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Other/Miscellaneous => Off-Topic Discussion => Topic started by: cigar joe on April 20, 2012, 06:01:36 PM



Title: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: cigar joe on April 20, 2012, 06:01:36 PM
Angel Face (1952) 8/10 drinksanddestroys

Jean-Luc Goddard called this one of the ten best movies of the sound era (according to the commentator on the dvd). I don't think it's that good, but it is an enjoyable movie. Robert Mitchum is absolutely perfect for this role.


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: dave jenkins on April 22, 2012, 08:15:08 PM
Angel Face (1952) 8/10 drinksanddestroys

Jean-Luc Goddard called this one of the ten best movies of the sound era (according to the commentator on the dvd).
The "commentator"? Are you talking about Eddie Muller, the Czar of Noir? I suppose that Frayling guy is just the "commentator" on the Dollars Blu-rays?

Per the movie: one of the greatest endings of any noir ever. Everytime I watch it I laugh myself sick.


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: drinkanddestroy on April 22, 2012, 09:44:57 PM
The "commentator"? Are you talking about Eddie Muller, the Czar of Noir? I suppose that Frayling guy is just the "commentator" on the Dollars Blu-rays?

Per the movie: one of the greatest endings of any noir ever. Everytime I watch it I laugh myself sick.


 To me, cigar joe is the Czar of Noir (and just about everything else  ;) )


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: drinkanddestroy on April 22, 2012, 09:48:03 PM
btw, I am not sure if Muller said that Goddard rated it as one of the ten overall best sound films, or one of the ten best American sound films.


SPOILER ALERT

RE: the ending: shouldn't Simmons have first tried to convince Mitchum to stay with her, and only run off a cliff if they got close to the bus station and it didn't seem she wouldn convince Mitchum to stay with her? Remember, there was a time earlier where Mitchum was sure he was walking out on her, but she had such a spell on him that he fell for her, against his own better judgment. Who's to say she couldn't have convinced him again? (I'm sure she could have found another cliff if it became apparent that he wasn't going for it).


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: dave jenkins on April 22, 2012, 10:28:48 PM
Do you not understand anger? People do unreasonable things when they're angry.


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: drinkanddestroy on April 22, 2012, 11:38:23 PM
Do you not understand anger? People do unreasonable things when they're angry.

yeah, but I think if she coulda had Mitchum back, she'd never have wanted to kill them; she only killed them cuz she thought Mitchum is leaving. I am surprised she didn't make that one last plea to Mitchum to try to get him to be with her, before committing murder-suicide.

And with the champagne? was she trying to give the investigators a "reason" for the accident being alcohol? Really? Was she getting pleasure now that in a few minutes from now -- after she will be dead -- she will have tricked the detectives yet again, into now thinking it was an alcohol-related death? Did she really care what happened after she and Mitchum died?


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: dave jenkins on April 22, 2012, 11:46:35 PM
yeah, but I think if she coulda had Mitchum back, she'd never have wanted to kill them; she only killed them cuz she thought Mitchum is leaving.
No, Mitchum triggers her angry response with his comment. Watch it again.


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: drinkanddestroy on April 23, 2012, 01:29:51 AM
No, Mitchum triggers her angry response with his comment. Watch it again.

I was going to, but then I found out that either way, a lowly noir-rookie like me is is unqualified to say a single word against the ending of a great movie like this made by such a great filmmaker like Otto Preminger. So I shouldn't even bother having an opinion of it. This discussion is apparently over.


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: Groggy on April 26, 2012, 02:59:23 PM
I was going to, but then I found out that either way, a lowly noir-rookie like me is is unqualified to say a single word against the ending of a great movie like this made by such a great filmmaker like Otto Preminger. So I shouldn't even bother having an opinion of it. This discussion is apparently over.

Now you're getting it drink. No way a n00b like you can question the genius of the man behind Skidoo. :D


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: drinkanddestroy on September 30, 2013, 06:30:11 AM
I found that list of Godard's that I mentioned in the first post: http://alumnus.caltech.edu/~ejohnson/critics/godard.html#bestAm
According to this list, released in the Dec. 1963-Jan. 1964 issue of Cahiers du Cinema, Godard named Angel Face as the 8th best American sound film.


I'll cut and paste the list here.
So these are Jean-Luc Godard's ten favorite American sound films released before 1964:


01. Scarface (Howard Hawks)
02. The Great Dictator (Charles Chaplin)
03. Vertigo (Alfred Hitchcock)
04. The Searchers (John Ford)
05. Singin' in the Rain (Kelly-Donen)
06. The Lady from Shanghai (Orson Welles)
07. Bigger Than Life (Nicholas Ray)
08. Angel Face (Otto Preminger)
09. To Be or Not To Be (Ernst Lubitsch)
10. Dishonoured (Josef von Sternberg)

----------------------------------------------------------------

Additionally, Robin Wood named Angel Face on his all-time Top 10 list http://www.jonathanrosenbaum.com/?p=17784

I got these links courtesy of Angel Face's Wikipedia page http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angel_Face_%281952_film%29#Critical_response


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: dave jenkins on September 30, 2013, 11:14:22 AM

Additionally, Robin Wood named Angel Face on his all-time Top 10 list http://www.jonathanrosenbaum.com/?p=17784

I got these links courtesy of Angel Face's Wikipedia page http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angel_Face_%281952_film%29#Critical_response
No confirming plaudits from Ebert? What are we to think? WHAT ARE WE TO THINK???


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: rexlic on October 01, 2013, 12:33:45 PM
Man, I thought you were talking about this.

(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-279_AVofk80/UAITKeTB5wI/AAAAAAAAAi4/Hgpa3-egHNM/s400/angel_face_front.jpg)


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: drinkanddestroy on December 22, 2016, 12:37:54 AM
Saw the movie (on TCM) for the second time.

What an overrated film. Great ending and not much else. Jean Simmons is crap. She was best in BLACK NARCISSUS cuz she didn't open her mouth. Say what you want about a great ending, it does not make up for a nothing-special film.


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: cigar joe on December 22, 2016, 04:24:31 AM
I like Simmons best in Mister Buddwing.  O0


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: dave jenkins on December 22, 2016, 10:41:47 AM
Saw the movie (on TCM) for the second time.

What an overrated film. Great ending and not much else. Jean Simmons is crap. She was best in BLACK NARCISSUS cuz she didn't open her mouth. Say what you want about a great ending, it does not make up for a nothing-special film.
So now you LIKE the ending?


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: drinkanddestroy on December 22, 2016, 01:17:00 PM
So now you LIKE the ending?

I never said it's not a good ending.

Maybe I did a few years ago, maybe I was wrong then. But the movie is crap and even a Gone With the Wind or Casablanca ending would not make me enjoy this movie.


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: T.H. on December 23, 2016, 04:09:30 AM
I'm pretty convinced that my theory that Angel Face is just a bloated, stagy version of Where Danger Lives holds up even better than I thought, even though it's been years since I've seen either movie.


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: dave jenkins on December 23, 2016, 11:47:25 AM
I'm pretty convinced that my theory that Angel Face is just a bloated, stagy version of Where Danger Lives holds up even better than I thought, even though it's been years since I've seen either movie.
Maybe. But Where Danger Lives I find unwatchable, whereas I enjoy Angel Face.


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: T.H. on December 28, 2016, 01:12:37 AM
Maybe. But Where Danger Lives I find unwatchable, whereas I enjoy Angel Face.

You're definitely with the majority on what movie you prefer, but Where Danger Lives has left an impression on me (the imagery, the attention to detail for minor characters) years after I've seen it. I need to revisit that soon.


Title: Re: Angel Face (1952)
Post by: greenbudgie on April 24, 2017, 04:20:01 AM
The ending did take me by surprise. That was a hefty slap that Robert Mitchum gave Jean Simmons earlier in the film. I thought it was a good performance particularly by her. She was really demented. I was impressed that her and Herbert Marshall came across as a seemingly authentic daughter and father. I reckon that this is a good noir.