Sergio Leone Web Board
General Information => General Discussion => Topic started by: stanton on January 12, 2023, 07:49:03 AM
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Here's a thread for all the box office data for the Leone films which are available.
I start with Italy.
I created many years ago a list of the most successful SWs.
For that I had transferred the available box-office data with the aid of average ticket prices into admission numbers, the only accurate way to compare films which were released in different years. Especially as in Italy the inflation was rather galopping in these years.
The estimated admissions (in thousands and Lira in millions) of Leone's westerns:
Title Admissions Lira
Per qualche dollaro in piu * 14.672 * 3.492
Per un pugno di Dollari * 14.269 * 3.182
Il buono, il brutto, il cattivo * 12.071 * 3.211
C' era una volta il West * 8.077 * 2.504
Il mio nome e Nessuno * 8.008 * 3.620
Giu la testa * 6.224 * 2.465
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I guess this are the box office data from the year they were released? Or is in an all times box office, that keeps growing up with each re-release?
Also the french wikipedia states 8.9 millions of admissions for OUATITW in Italy (not a huge difference but still a notable one). The source is that website: https://www.jpbox-office.com/fichfilm.php?id=9020 (which gives also numbers for Germany and France for that movie).
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And the admissions (in thousands) for Leone in Germany:
Per un pugno di Dollari 2.302
Per qualche dollaro in piu 3.072
Il buono, il brutto, il cattivo 1.164
C' era una volta il West 13.018
Giu la testa ?
Il mio nome e Nessuno 6.287
Once upon a Time in America 2.320
No data for DYS so far, but pretty sure under 2 mio.
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I guess this are the box office data from the year they were released? Or is in an all times box office, that keeps growing up with each re-release?
Also the french wikipedia states 8.9 millions of admissions for OUATITW in Italy (not a huge difference but still a notable one). The source is that website: https://www.jpbox-office.com/fichfilm.php?id=9020 (which gives also numbers for Germany and France for that movie).
I used data from a book someone else had, and here's a list in Lira for SWs: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1qx8FHnEX0Po052EArfNEeG05xujDoHA2BeJmTgC6MMQ/edit#gid=0
Some of my data are already different from that list, others were the same, and of course there are many other factors which are not secured (like the way I calculated the average ticket prices), but my list gives an overview, and a much better one than only looking at the mere Lira data.
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So the website I linked earlier gives the following in France:
C' era una volta il West 14 862 764 (#1 that year)
Il buono, il brutto, il cattivo 6 308 276 (#2 that year)
Il mio nome e Nessuno 4 732 369 (#2 that year)
Giu la Testa 4 723 338 (#4 that year)
Per un pugno di Dollari 4 383 331 (#4 that year)
Per qualche dollaro in piu 4 170 929 (#7 that year)
Il Colosso di Rodi 1 686 128 (#42 that year)
Once upon a Time in America 1 231 072 (#36 that year)
There are German, Italian and even US data for some of those films on that website. It also sometimes details like opening week results, and Paris/rest of the country breakdown.
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USA (available figures on the same website. Those figures are said as "approximative" as they aren't official data but calculated the same way Stanton did with his figures):
Il buono, il brutto, il cattivo 21 271 000 (#11 that year)
Per un pugno di Dollari 15 591 000 (#20 that year)
Per qualche dollaro in piu 13 761 000 (#20 that year)
C' era una volta il West 4 190 000 (#39 that year)
Il mio nome e Nessuno 3 081 000 (#31 that year)
Once upon a Time in America 1 538 000 (#107 that year)
So yeah, of course a box office success on the US market is more profitable than a box office success in France or Germany, but not than in France AND Germany. "The real money" is everywhere as long as there is money.
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I'm in Arizona, and C' era una volta il West, Il mio nome e Nessuno, and Once upon a Time in America NEVER got decent bookings here on their release, were in a few small theaters and Il mio nome e Nessuno was a 2nd feature of a twin bill. But I saw all in the theaters.
Once upon a Time in America here was the butchered chronological form, but I didn't see it until the following year when an "art theater" showed the appropriate version.
GBU debuted here in 1968 and I saw it then, but believe that FOD and FDM did not play here until AFTER GBU, and they were shown as a double feature. Duck You Sucker played here, saw that too.
We did get here Death Rides a Horse, Day of Anger, Big Gundown, two "Stranger" films, three Sabata films; No Django, no Great Silence
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Damn. I thought GBU played in 1966 for the US in general. The art theater playing the original OUATIA is something I didn't know about also. I thought all Americans would only find about the real version 20 years later through DVD release (? Heard something like that multiple times.
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The art theater playing the original OUATIA is something I didn't know about also. I thought all Americans would only find about the real version 20 years later through DVD release (? Heard something like that multiple times.
I guess what the DVD granted wasn't "the first time American could access the real OUATIA" but more "easy access for those who aren't actively looking for it or aren't just lucky".
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I guess what the DVD granted wasn't "the first time American could access the real OUATIA" but more "easy access for those who aren't actively looking for it or aren't just lucky".
;D true
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USA (available figures on the same website. Those figures are said as "approximative" as they aren't official data but calculated the same way Stanton did with his figures):
Il buono, il brutto, il cattivo 21 271 000 (#11 that year)
Per un pugno di Dollari 15 591 000 (#20 that year)
Per qualche dollaro in piu 13 761 000 (#20 that year)
C' era una volta il West 4 190 000 (#39 that year)
Il mio nome e Nessuno 3 081 000 (#31 that year)
Once upon a Time in America 1 538 000 (#107 that year)
So yeah, of course a box office success on the US market is more profitable than a box office success in France or Germany, but not than in France AND Germany. "The real money" is everywhere as long as there is money.
For "but not than in France AND Germany" you mean "than" or "then"? "Then" I assume ...
And the figures here are also admissions calculated for the BO in $?
The BO from a Variety list for the Leone westerns (in mio):
GBU : 6,11
FaFDM : 4,35
FoD : 4,25
The others are below 4 mio, and for that not listed.
Some contemporary US westerns from that list:
Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid : 45,95
Billy JacK : 32,5 (hard to believe)
Jeremiah Johnson : 21,9
Little Big Man : 15
True Grit : 14,25
Cat Ballou : 9,3
The Professionals : 8,8
High Plains Drifter ; 7,9
Hang em High : 6,78
El Dorado : 6
The War Wagon : 5,93
Hombre : 5,6
Nevada Smith : 5,5
The Wild Bunch : 5,3
2 Mules for Sister Sara : 4,64
5 Card Stud : 4,25
The Undefeated : 4
Inflation adjustment would already make a difference for the time span of these films. In another inflation adjusted Variety list 1966 films are calculated for the inflation with a 2,5 factor and 1972 films with 1,5.
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The European figures I'm giving are (supposedly) official box office figures of the year of each release. They aren't calculated, they're the number of admissions as they were reported at the time.
The US figures have been caculated.
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Yes, I was only asking for the US data.
It seems the $ income they used is higher than that from the Variety list.
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Yes, I was only asking for the US data.
It seems the $ income they used is higher than that from the Variety list.
Yeah they don't explain how they got it. They just write "approx." on the US admission numbers. They do provide the earnings (and not as "approx."), do you want me to write them down here?
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Of course, then I can compare.
From the Variety data Eastwood's Hang em High, a good but far less attractive film, had more success than Leone, and later high Plain's Drifter also.
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Damn. I thought GBU played in 1966 for the US in general.
I believe that the premier was in Rome in December 1966. English language version was likely lower priority.
The art theater playing the original OUATIA is something I didn't know about also. I thought all Americans would only find about the real version 20 years later through DVD release (? Heard something like that multiple times.
It was at the Valley Art Theater in Tempe, Arizona between February and April 1985 (because I remember who I saw it with). Years later, with Mrs. Cusser I also saw the extended GBU at same theater as part of United Artists 90th Anniversary celebration (had to take the afternoon off work for that). That theater would show classic films like Casablanca, Adventures of Robin Hood....
Mrs. Cusser was also blessed with seeing Once Upon a Time in America at a theater in the 1980s; this was at Scottsdale Center for the Arts which used to have a program of "cult films" which even included Once Upon a Time in the West; she still remembers three old ladies who came to see "Hank Fonda" ("if Hank Fonda is in it, it's bound to be good"), but they quickly exited just after Frank's gang sent redhead freckles flying...
With the video tape rental business taking off soon after, theaters like this pretty much died out, with such films occasionally being screened near colleges. Sometime about 2000-2010 we were in Flagstaff visiting my youngest daughter, and a downtown theater had GBU on its marquee.
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I believe that the premier was in Rome in December 1966. English language version was likely lower priority.
The Dollar trilogy came to the USA in 1967, all 3 in that year.
FoD in January, FaFDM in May and GBU in December.
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The Dollar trilogy came to the USA in 1967, all 3 in that year.
FoD in January, FaFDM in May and GBU in December.
Yess, I meant 1967 instead of 1966. Thanks stanton
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I believe that the premier was in Rome in December 1966. English language version was likely lower priority.
It was at the Valley Art Theater in Tempe, Arizona between February and April 1985 (because I remember who I saw it with). Years later, with Mrs. Cusser I also saw the extended GBU at same theater as part of United Artists 90th Anniversary celebration (had to take the afternoon off work for that). That theater would show classic films like Casablanca, Adventures of Robin Hood....
Mrs. Cusser was also blessed with seeing Once Upon a Time in America at a theater in the 1980s; this was at Scottsdale Center for the Arts which used to have a program of "cult films" which even included Once Upon a Time in the West; she still remembers three old ladies who came to see "Hank Fonda" ("if Hank Fonda is in it, it's bound to be good"), but they quickly exited just after Frank's gang sent redhead freckles flying...
With the video tape rental business taking off soon after, theaters like this pretty much died out, with such films occasionally being screened near colleges. Sometime about 2000-2010 we were in Flagstaff visiting my youngest daughter, and a downtown theater had GBU on its marquee.
LOL! Yeah, It's definitely not part of "Hank's" usual stuff. I doubt they would've enjoyed the rest of the film. Shame about the art theatres. I'll be extremely lucky if I ever find one screening GBU in my country, if it's rare in the US, here in Peru it's nearly impossible.
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I mentioned on another thread that the US box- office figures for GBU.are total bullshit.
It was a smash hit in.1968 with both the 45 single and LP going gold.
It was definitely one of the top ten grossing films of 1968.
I have speculated that the low reported rentals is a result of the disputes with Eastwood and their European partners over profits.
UA underreported GROSSES to avoid payments.
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I mentioned on another thread that the US box- office figures for GBU.are total bullshit.
It was a smash hit in.1968 with both the 45 single and LP going gold.
It was definitely one of the top ten grossing films of 1968.
I have speculated that the low reported rentals is a result of the disputes with Eastwood and their European partners over profits.
UA underreported GROSSES to avoid payments.
Agree.
GBU was a big hit, played first run (with B film as double feature) when I saw it in 1968.
When I took a film class at Arizona State University in 1974 (I got "A", my brother was in the class and got "B" and is still mad about that), I asked the professor what he thought about Leone's films. He panned them all, said they were junk, but said that he'd never seen them. He was gay, obsessed with Judy Garland, his taste in films was definitely different than mine; however, he hosted a weekly classic film showing on the local PBS channel, and they broadcast such films without interruptions. My girlfriend and I watched one of those films one week, then took a walk and her top "somehow" came off....
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Thank you for sharing this information with us.
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I'm not so sure about that.
What Eastwood said is maybe true, or maybe not, but if the figures for the Leones are wrong, than the others could also be too low.
In Germany, where Leone and SWs generally were considered as successful, FoD was only about # 30, FaFDM was in the top 10, but GBU than again only at # 30 with 1,15 mio admissions. The most successful western in 1967 was Massacre Time (2,03 mio, marketed as Django sequel and # 7 that year), followed by Five for Revenge (1,89 mio, only hardcore SW fans know today this film directed by Aldo Florio) and the mediocre Texas Adios (1,46 mio, another false "Django). GBU was for westerns alone only # 7 in 67, also beaten by John Wayne (El Dorado, 1,21 mio), another mediocre SW (Wanted, 1,24 mio with Giuliano Gemma) and even the bad Mag 7 sequel Return of the 7 (1,47 mio).
The "official" BO for GBU is now given with 38,9 mio, and that's a lot for a budget of only 1,2 mio, but for UA their Bond films made much more in these years:
Thunderball (141 mio)
You only Live Twice (112 mio)
On Her Majesty's SS (82 mio)
Diamonds Are Forever (116 mio)
The BO for Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid is given with 102 mio for North America alone. Interestingly, unlike later The Sting, that one was not a hit in Germany with only 1 mio tickets sold.
Actually it is very interesting to see which films were successful in the 60s, and which now famous ones were not. It is often very different form what I had assumed before we had figures at hand.