Sergio Leone Web Board

Films of Sergio Leone => Once Upon A Time In America => Topic started by: Ramonda on February 02, 2024, 11:03:56 AM

Title: "Chicken Joe"
Post by: Ramonda on February 02, 2024, 11:03:56 AM
Hello everyone! I have a question about the role played by the actor Richard Bright
 with the nickname Joe Chicken.
Since I'm currently working on a translation from English (creating subtitles),
 I need a closer description or interpretation of his nickname.
Considering it's slang, is there any information on why he's called "Chicken"?
 Does it imply that he is some kind of "coward" or other character trait?
In the same scene, the actor William Forsythe, who plays the role of "Philip 'Cockeye' Stein,"
 calls him "Chickenhead," which may imply an insult suggesting that he is actually "brainless,"
 or perhaps I am mistaken...
Title: Re: "Chicken Joe"
Post by: drinkanddestroy on February 04, 2024, 02:10:21 AM
We need to check THE HOODS and see if the character appears

I did a brief check the other day. Crowning appears by name, but the other guy I think is named Thaddeus. So Chicken Joe may be totally made up for movie. But I am not sure. I only did a brief check. Will try to look through the book later today.
Title: Re: "Chicken Joe"
Post by: dave jenkins on February 04, 2024, 04:40:24 PM
This is what the entry in the SL Encyclopedia says:
Quote
Chicken Joe. Gangster played by Richard Bright in OUATIA. Origin and meaning of the nickname uncertain.
I think we are free to speculate. Maybe he's called that because he looks like a chicken, thinks like a chicken, acts like a chicken. Or maybe chicken is his favorite meal.
Title: Re: "Chicken Joe"
Post by: drinkanddestroy on February 04, 2024, 11:26:57 PM
There?s probably a way to search the book on Google Books or something and then do a search of the full document for terms like ?chicken? or ?joe.?

If it?s not from the book, as dj says, one can speculate ?
Title: Re: "Chicken Joe"
Post by: andybarlow on February 05, 2024, 05:18:06 AM
I'm not sure that searching for "Chicken" in the book "The Hoods" will provide Ramonda with useful information but here goes.

In the movie Richard Bright plays the character Chicken Joe and works for Crowning. He's quite memorable in the dowsing Treat Williams with petrol scene and wildly shooting a machine gun from a moving car.

In Chapter 42 of The Hoods we are introduced to a character named Chicken Flicker - something about a truck being stolen and Max interrogating gangsters:

Where the hell were you guys the other night that Hogan had to ride without a guard? Maxie snapped sarcastically.
Ask Herring, Max, a peevish voice said. He's in charge. He gives us orders. We were around. We didn't even know the truck was ready to leave.
Okay, okay, Max said tersely. Is that you, Chicken Flicker?
Yeh, Max, the peevish voice answered.
Okay, let's go to the office, Max said.

The same scene appears in the book Mano Armata which friends thought Sergio Leone was obsessed with.

Dove diavolo eravate voi l'altra sera, quando Hogan ha dovuto uscire senza guardie? scatt? Maxie in tono sarcastico.
Domandalo a Herring, Max  fece una voce lamentosa. lui che comanda. Gli ordini li d lui. C'eravamo, ma non sapevamo neanche che l'autocarro partiva.
Bene, bene, disse Max. Sei tu, Chicken Flicker?
Si, Max, rispose la voce acuta.

Leone subsequently said that the copyright fee was a lot more than the book was worth and he didn't use much of the book in the movie. I can't remember this particular scene being in the movie but there are lots of other things which were either in the movie or inspired scenes in the movie. Chicken Joe is not in the book. Most will be aware that very often gangsters were given strange and sometimes funny names and we can only speculate on the origins.
Title: Re: "Chicken Joe"
Post by: Cusser on February 05, 2024, 07:25:43 AM
Did we ever establish whether David Aaronson got his nickname for being a smart guy/"using his noodle" or because he liked chicken noodle soup ???

If I remember correctly, Deborah called him David only, and no one else called him David.  Like everyone except Mrs. Cusser addresses me as "Cusser".
Title: Re: "Chicken Joe"
Post by: andybarlow on February 05, 2024, 08:17:55 AM
At the beginning of the book "The Hoods" Max, Noodles, Cockeye, Patsy and Dominick are in school talking about Jesse James and money. Some of them are asking daft questions and Noodles gives the answers, thinking to himself:

"I was proud. I knew all the answers. That's why they called me Noodles."

Noodles uses his "noodle" (head).

Later the Principal Mr O'Brien called Noodles into his office and said:

"Your environment is partly to blame. Do you understand what I mean by environment?"

For a moment I forgot myself. "Do I know what environment means?" I sneered.

He laughed. "I forgot, you're the one they call Noodles; you know everything."

Noodles thought the Principal was a pretty good guy and felt sorry for him. O'Brien was only trying to help but Noodles didn't want charity.

"Charity, feh. What good is education? I had enough for what I wanted to do. I can write. I know arithmetic. I can read. I'm smart.
I use my noodle. Yeh, that's why people call me Noodles. Because I'm smart."
Title: Re: "Chicken Joe"
Post by: drinkanddestroy on February 05, 2024, 03:04:51 PM
@ andybarlow

Welcome aboard and thanks for the solid posts!

Yeah, the book explains the Noodles nickname though the movie oddly doesn?t.

If there is no Chicken Joe in the book, I guess one can only speculate why he is called that in the movie.

Bottom line is, for the guy doing subtitles for the movie, I would not recommend that he assume ?chicken? means ?scared? and translate it that way. I think its best if he just uses ?Chicken Joe? as long as it?ll be clear to the viewers in that language that it?s just one of these gangster nicknames.

Anyway, I guess this means that a new disc is being released of this movie. Can we get any info on that? Which company, what?s the expected release date, is it only overseas or also US? And what?s with the deleted scenes? (The last release downgraded the quality of the entire movie because the deleted scenes are of crappy quality and they didn?t want them to look different from the rest of the movie!)
Title: Re: "Chicken Joe"
Post by: Ramonda on February 09, 2024, 05:39:53 AM
Firstly, thanks to everyone for the effort in unraveling the origin of the nickname "Chicken-Jo."
I must say that I didn't at all "assume" that it meant "Chicken Jo - coward" or something similar,
but rather wondered if there was a hidden reason behind the nickname that could be translated from English.
 It is easiest for me to leave his nickname in its original version.

In fact, I am working on the "adaptation" of a professional translation (subtitles) for my personal collection.
 4K-(extended Version) - Running time: 245' The original 35mm camera negative was scanned at a resolution of 4K
at Warner Bros. Motion Picture Imaging (MPI).
 The scanned files were then worked on at 4K resolution in Cineteca di Bologna?s L?Immagine Ritrovata laboratory,
where the complete frame-by-frame digital restoration was carried out.
 
Title: Re: "Chicken Joe"
Post by: cigar joe on February 09, 2024, 02:08:44 PM
Firstly, thanks to everyone for the effort in unraveling the origin of the nickname "Chicken-Jo."
I must say that I didn't at all "assume" that it meant "Chicken Jo - coward" or something similar,
but rather wondered if there was a hidden reason behind the nickname that could be translated from English.
 It is easiest for me to leave his nickname in its original version.

In fact, I am working on the "adaptation" of a professional translation (subtitles) for my personal collection.
 4K-(extended Version) - Running time: 245' The original 35mm camera negative was scanned at a resolution of 4K
at Warner Bros. Motion Picture Imaging (MPI).
 The scanned files were then worked on at 4K resolution in Cineteca di Bologna?s L?Immagine Ritrovata laboratory,
where the complete frame-by-frame digital restoration was carried out.

Yea, the nickname Chicken Joe could be because he likes chicken, or likes girls. I heard a guy called Joey Pots & Pans I think he sold cookware.





 
Title: Re: "Chicken Joe"
Post by: Ramonda on February 09, 2024, 03:39:56 PM
I think you're thinking well about this,
that he got the nickname because he loves girls.
It seems most likely to me.  ;)
Title: Re: "Chicken Joe"
Post by: dave jenkins on February 10, 2024, 03:58:34 AM
I think you're thinking well about this,
that he got the nickname because he loves girls.
It seems most likely to me.  ;)
Plausible.
Title: Re: "Chicken Joe"
Post by: Cusser on February 10, 2024, 07:38:50 AM
I think you're thinking well about this,
that he got the nickname because he loves girls.
It seems most likely to me.  ;)
Like Chico Marx.  Was pronounced Chick-O
Title: Re: "Chicken Joe"
Post by: Ramonda on February 19, 2024, 11:42:27 AM
Yeah!  :)