Sergio Leone Web Board

Films of Sergio Leone => Other Films => Topic started by: cigar joe on January 19, 2005, 04:49:49 PM

Title: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on January 19, 2005, 04:49:49 PM
Ok bit on this one and watched it last night SPO Entertainment Japan, its on the top twenty list (low on the list though) over at Spaghetti Westerns in America board.

Its nothing special as far as story or camera work, a basic revenge flick with a few twists and a SW ending. It also has a dedication by Robert Hossein to his Friend Sergio Leone at the end.

It stars and was directed by this Robert Hossein, he plays a gunfighter who's little habbit is reaching in his pocket and putting on a black leather glove before he draws his gun.

He lives in "Ghost Town" and this is probably the most  surrealistic  set of any SW I've seen, looks like something from a Dali painting. It just juts up out of a sand dune desert. It doesn't look like any set that I've sceen before in any other SW. That dilapadated town is the best part of the movie.

The film has no jarring out of place sequences that screw up the SW experience but its not a very inspired story. I believe Benito Stefanelli makes a cameo at the beginning.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: KERMIT on January 19, 2005, 10:29:50 PM
Ok bit on this one and watched it last night SPO Entertainment Japan, its on the top twenty list (low on the list though) over at Spaghetti Westerns in America board.

Its nothing special as far as story or camera work, a basic revenge flick with a few twists and a SW ending. It also has a dedication by Robert Hossein to his Friend Sergio Leone at the end.

It stars and was directed by this Robert Hossein, he plays a gunfighter who's little habbit is reaching in his pocket and putting on a black leather glove before he draws his gun.

He lives in "Ghost Town" and this is probably the most  surrealistic  set of any SW I've seen, looks like something from a Dali painting. It just juts up out of a sand dune desert. It doesn't look like any set that I've sceen before in any other SW. That dilapadated town is the best part of the movie.

The film has no jarring out of place sequences that screw up the SW experience but its not a very inspired story. I believe Benito Stefanelli makes a cameo at the beginning.
for some reason, all week, i've been thinking of this film's title.  great name for blues tune. the old black gloove trick. when he goes for the black glove how does the music sound ?
the town sounds like my kinda place to hang.
just on what you've posted cement's my obligation to get to best buy an cough up the dough !!
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on January 20, 2005, 05:04:46 AM
Kerm the only SW's you might find at BB are Leone's and the following, Django, Mannaja A Man Called Blade, A Minute To Pray A Second To Die, Shalako, Companero's, and the crappy SW collector set, there is also a good SW set that has  Companero's, Keoma, Teaxas Adios, and Four For the Apocalapse, but thats about $80 and only Companero's and Keoma are worth it but not $80.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: spag fan on January 20, 2005, 06:41:48 AM
there is also a good SW set that has  Companero's, Keoma, Teaxas Adios, and Four For the Apocalapse, but thats about $80 and only Companero's and Keoma are worth it but not $80.

Don't forget that set includes the excellent "Bullet For The General". You should be able to pick this set up for less than $60 if you look around.  I'd say it's worth that.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Sentenza on January 20, 2005, 09:30:42 AM
He lives in "Ghost Town" and this is probably the most  surrealistic  set of any SW I've seen, looks like something from a Dali painting. It just juts up out of a sand dune desert. It doesn't look like any set that I've sceen before in any other SW. That dilapadated town is the best part of the movie.

You don't happen to have any stills or screenshots from that town, do you? The best I could find was this, but it has no pictures of the town set:
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/monteloup/marquise_des_anges/michele_mercier_corede_colt.htm
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: grandpa_chum on January 20, 2005, 10:48:51 AM
there is also a good SW set that has  Companero's, Keoma, Teaxas Adios, and Four For the Apocalapse, but thats about $80 and only Companero's and Keoma are worth it but not $80.

I have the set... and i recently rewatched four of the apocalypse and texas adios and they are both alot better than i remember... worth having if your a spaghetti fan, although most don't agree with me.... although with apocalypse you'd have to be more of lucio fulci fan than just a spaghetti western fan and i do like lucio fulci, but it's an aquired taste i guess.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: KERMIT on January 20, 2005, 01:37:18 PM
i'm always saying this  mucho thanko guys. i'm out the door now on my recon mission. i'll take notes and report back later . GP_CHUM, i'll keep a special eye out.

in this neck of the woods i'd be lucky to find rio lobo , lol

Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on January 20, 2005, 06:48:53 PM
Yer Right I forgot about "A Bullet for the General", Also you may find "A Man Called Sledge".
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on January 21, 2005, 04:10:51 AM
Sentenza this is what I got at the site you directed me to. Send it again.


Si votre navigateur n'affiche pas le site, cliquer sur ce bouton:

Send it again

I don't yet have a way to capture screen shots. But I can try and descibe it a little bit more. Its an unpainted dilapadated town with false fronts no higher than 2 stories. The main street is narrower than what you would usually see in a western town which contributes to its surreal look along with the sense that its being swallowed up in the sand dunes.

Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: spag fan on January 21, 2005, 06:43:07 AM
How is A Man Called Sledge? I always liked James Garner. I've been meaning to pick this up, but haven't seen it at the right price.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Sentenza on January 21, 2005, 11:36:32 AM
cigar joe, you get redirected due to some pesky javascript on the page I posted. Disable javascript in your web-browser and you should be able to reach the page, works for me. ;)
Don't expect anything extraordinary, just a couple of posters and a few stills.

Your description of that town sounds most intriguing, to say the least! 8)
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on January 21, 2005, 01:44:37 PM
A Man Called Sledge is an average SW sort of B+ so better than a B anyway. Directed by Vic Morrow of TV "Combat". Its got the old timey "sung" openning credits score, something called "Other Mans Gold."

Its got a great opening sequence in the snow a la "The Great Silence" and has a great bar room shoot out near the beginning too. After this great beginning it sort of lays down (however all I've seen is the R1 version its supposedly cut some what, a lot of Garners girl friend Laura Antonelli must be cut since she doesn't seem to have much of a part and she is important at the end) into an average tale, you don't see any of the SW staples at least those that I recognize ( its got American actors Dennis Weaver, Claud Akins, and John Marley) but you do see Leone's sets (Agua Caliente). Though the adobe walls are draped with colorful rugs that really stand out.

Its got a good SW ending, that I won't give away. Its a worthy SW for a SW collection
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: spag fan on January 21, 2005, 02:59:14 PM
Thanks for the info CJ. :)
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: bronsky on January 29, 2005, 06:07:15 AM
There are now some nice pics at Shobary's Site:
http://koti.mbnet.fi/rs901536/shobary/cemetery/withoutcrosses.htm  (http://koti.mbnet.fi/rs901536/shobary/cemetery/withoutcrosses.htm)
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Sentenza on January 30, 2005, 03:21:21 AM
Thanks alot, bronsky!

(http://koti.mbnet.fi/rs901536/shobary/cemetery/cemetery_04.jpg)
You were right, cigar joe. Fantasctic, eerie looking set. I need to see this film.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on January 30, 2005, 09:21:32 AM
Shobary must have just put that up since I looked recently for it.

But yea you can see what I mean, The other side of the street is the same and they are surrealistically too close together, especially since there is so much desert space around it.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Marco Leone on July 22, 2005, 01:43:20 PM
It took me sometime to re-find this thread, but as I have just got around to watching this film for the first time, I thought it was proper that I should add my review to the thoughts already expressed.  So, here goes :

"From the opening sequence, as a sepia camera lens captures the pursuit of a single rider by a gang on horseback, I just knew that this film was going to demonstrate class. And, although the story itself probably has little to set it apart from many other films within the Euro Western genre, it more than makes up for it with its effective use of camera work and great character portrayal. Yes, this film has class in abundance.

So to the story itself. Having witnessed her husband Ben (a brief but welcome appearance by Benito Stefanelli) executed by the Rogers family, Maria (played by stunning french actress Michèle Mercier) seeks revenge on the killers. Unable to rely on her two oafish brothers-in-law to assist, she seeks help from Ben's best friend (and, as we find out, Maria's former lover) Manuel (Robert Hossein).

Manuel enlists himself as a member of the Rogers gang, enabling him to capture the only daughter. With this prisoner in her custody, Maria has the perfect ransom to deliver a perfect revenge on the Rogers gang. With the scene now set, the bloodshed and twists to the story soon commence.

The character of Manuel is quite unlike any other main western lead that I have seen. Whilst demonstrating an unnerving ability with a gun, there is a definite reluctance to become too embroiled with Maria's plot. His time as a gunfighter by choice has passed - perhaps symbolically shown by him being the sole resident of "Ghost Town". However, his involvement is spurned on by his feelings for her. Hossein, who both played the part of Manuel and directed the movie, plays this solemn and complex character superbly.

Hossein's direction is really eye catching too, with the camera work demonstrating more than a little nod in the direction of a certain Mr Leone (to whom there is a suitable credit in the end title sequence). This is no copycat Leone film however, and firmly stands up on its own merit. Less is definitely more, as the opening scene proves (it must be a good ten minutes before there is any real dialogue. And in reality, when the picture is this effective words are not needed).

In summary, don't be put off by the simplicity of the story, as the way that this film is crafted makes such an issue completely irrelevant. It can stand quite proudly in that top echelon of Euro Westerns, and quite possibly a perfect introduction to the genre to those that have purely seen the Leone movies".
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on January 29, 2006, 01:16:49 AM
In my continuing re-evaluations rewatched (Une Cord Un Colt) Cemetery Without Crosses (1969) today. You notice a lot more with re viewings.

Marco Leone is right on the money, this is a very unique and different style SW. In the opening title sequence, the emphasis on a classic horse chase is enhanced by the shifting camera angles from the pursued and their point of view, to the pursuers, and at times the camera is right amongst the horses as if you are there in the group, adding to this "you are there" effect are the sound of pounding hooves, the billowing dust, the passing barren, open, no place to hide landscape.

This all adds to the desperation of the three Cane Brothers as the closing of distance by the Rogers clan builds up to a dramatic climax. We see that one of the three Canes is lagging behind and when this wounded Ben Cane (Benito Steffenelli) drops off his horse at his own ranches doorstep and is summarily dragged from his wife's Maria (Michele Mercier) arms and hung from a gatepost to a mornful spanish guitar score, the bleak, dark tone of this Western is set. There are no good guys in this film.

The other two Cane's escape death and watch from a ridge as their small ranch house is burned to the ground.
Here Hossein adds a nice human little touch, when later their ranch house is reduced to smouldering ashes one of the Cane brothers sifts through them and retrieves a functional keepsake a small skillet that he drops into his saddle bag before riding off. This is one of the first references to food in the film which if you pay attention you'll notice, you see a lot of references to bread, lol. Perhaps its a French affectation.

The two Canes ride back to Ben's place where they find Maria burrying Ben. They split up the gold they got from the Rodgers cattle, giving Maria a third before they go.
Maria takes her cut to "Ghost Town" to get revenge.

In the middle of a shifting sand dune desert that threatens to swallow it whole, lies Ghost Town the most surreal town in any SW. There at a dilapidated gambling hall she seeks gunfighter Manuel (Hossein), Ben's best friend, and her former lover.

Manuel's whole demeanor has "something to do with death", and its fitting that he is the only resident of Ghost Town. Reluctant at first,  he accepts the bag of coin, and plots to kidnap Clan leader Will Rogers only daughter. Manuel smokes cheroots with his own style, he has a habit of placing the cigar in his mouth and wetting it with saliva then turning it around and places the dry end in his mouth before lighting the wet end.

In the Hall after he decides to do the job he pulls out a music box that chimes (referencing the musoical pocket watch) when he opens the top and pulls out a black leather glove, when he puts on the glove people die, (he uses it to fan the hammer on his Colt).

After he kidnaps Johanna, Maria visits her, and takes her locket as proof in order to blackmail the Rodgers into giving Ben a proper funeral in town. Meanwhile Tomas & Eli Cane ride into Ghost Town unexpectedly and rape Johanna. Manuel does not interfere with this act nor tries to stop them in any way.

There are no winners in this film.

If I had to name one off key element it would have to be the title song and its chorus which pops up on and off throughout the film, it has that '70's modern sound and unfortunately takes you out of the somber mood of the story and also dates it, the rest of the scoring is perfect.


Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: themroc on October 24, 2006, 11:36:02 AM
I am a little confused: In Fraylings "Something to do with death" the author writes that Leone acted in Hosseins interesting Gothic-Spaghettiwestern UN CORDE UN COLT better known as Cemetery without Crosses. And indeed, the clerk in the hotel looks very much like him.
Frayling quotes some interviews: 1. Carla Leone saying "Leone didn't participate in the making of the film", 2. on the same page he writes that Leone was indeed playing the hotel clerk, and 3. he is quoting Leone with "When I saw myself in the film I decided I would not repeat the experience."
After that confusing two pages in Fraylings book (pages 267-268, Faber and Faber 2000, paperback) I searched the web. Imdb gives the name Chris Huerta for the actor. There is also on fistfulofwesterns.com a statement that it is definitively not Leone but Chris Huerta who played the part:
http://website.lineone.net/~braithwaitej/mainsite/overview/actors/huerta.htmthe quote)
Does anyone know for sure if it is Leone in this scene or Huerta? What really confuses me is that Frayling is actual quoting Leone  ???

By the way: Hosseins movie is going to be released in Germany on DVD. The actual release date is not yet confirmed such as the language and subtitle options. But its going to be released by a pretty good label (Anolis) that is known for very decent DVDs :)
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: The Firecracker on October 24, 2006, 12:36:36 PM
It's a total Hoax. The desk clerk is Huerta not Leone.

It's a fact, I have seen the film. Others on here who have can also vouch for me.


Not sure if Frayling got this info from Weisser ( a big liar) or vice versa.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Banjo on October 25, 2006, 04:48:41 AM
I am a little confused: In Fraylings "Something to do with death" the author writes that Leone acted in Hosseins interesting Gothic-Spaghettiwestern UN CORDE UN COLT better known as Cemetery without Crosses. And indeed, the clerk in the hotel looks very much like him.
And i was thinking of getting that book but i won't bother now.I've heard that Frayling is prone to the odd gaff here and there but that is one massive howler (as it adds ACTOR to Leones cannon-i'm assuming here that Leone never had any roles other than in the CWC lie)and demonstrates that his research must be sadly lacking as anyone with the slightest interest in sw's should be aware of the reputation of Weisser and his book.
For books about non-Leone sw's one should definately check out Howard Hughes information packed Once Upon A Time In The Italian West in which i haven't found any inaccuracies so far though Leone Admirer mentioned in a pm there were a couple of typo errors but that ain't no big deal.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Groggy on October 25, 2006, 12:35:25 PM
Leone was a bit actor/extra in a lot of the films on which he worked as an AD - I remember reading he was in "The Bicycle Thief" for one.  Other than that, no he didn't have an acting character as far as I know.  Was in the film in some other capacity?  I honestly don't know, I believe he's credited as being in the film somewhere. . .  ???
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: The Firecracker on October 25, 2006, 12:47:50 PM
I honestly don't know, I believe he's credited as being in the film somewhere. . .  ???
He isn't.
He is not in there to begin with.


Bicycle thief is a yes. You can catch him as a very skinny young pup in that film.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Silenzio on October 25, 2006, 09:02:59 PM
He isn't.
He is not in there to begin with.


Bicycle thief is a yes. You can catch him as a very skinny young pup in that film.

Love that movie.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: themroc on October 26, 2006, 06:57:40 AM
Thanks for the answers (especially firecracker). I had problems using the forum, so it took me some time to find out that somebody answered. Then it's obviously a major mistake in Fraylings book (which I like in other respects very much). But quoting is obviouly not his advantage (see also the wrong Baudrillard-quote discussed in another thread).
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: titoli on January 02, 2007, 06:55:38 PM
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0063740/

http://www.spaghettiwestern.altervista.org/cimitero_senza_croci.htm


The italian SW db tells the movie has "little content and story... (is) little exalting and quite flat". I more or less agree with this. The movie has a good start and is very good until the saloon shooting. Then it becomes a moving to and fro from Hossein's to Mercier's to Vargas', but at a slow pace. Really, I had to fight sleep to watch it through the end.
And I'm amazed that CJ wasn't bothered by the fact (similar to that we discussed about Searchers) that there a lot of going on in the desert. The Vargas family wants the other families out of the desert: what for? What is doing Hossein all alone in the ghost town in the middle pf the desert? Why before a shooting does he wear a black glove in the right hand but shoots with the left? And Mercier sport a pair of (fake) eyelashes very '60's.
 I like the main theme though, with the juxtaposition of downbeat with the uptempo sung by the choir. 
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Silenzio on January 02, 2007, 07:06:51 PM
Why before a shooting does he wear a black glove in the right hand but shoots with the left?
  

I assumed this was to protect his palm while he fanned the hammer.

I agree with you on the song, it is very effective, memorable, and all-around good.


I love this movie. One of my top 5 spaghettis. I've only seen it twice, though. We'll see how it holds up to repeat viewings (and i think it will fare well).
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on January 02, 2007, 08:42:44 PM
Yea, the glove was for fanning.

Quote
And I'm amazed that CJ wasn't bothered by the fact (similar to that we discussed about Searchers) that there a lot of going on in the desert. The Vargas family wants the other families out of the desert: what for? What is doing Hossein all alone in the ghost town in the middle pf the desert?

I'm assuming they (Rogers family) are cattle barons, that's the typical cliche, and they have a vendetta of some sort with the Cains. As far as Hossein in the ghost town he's a loner and its not explained, except for the short flash back to the gambling hall in its heyday, we are left to ponder. I think its more almost like a silent film a simple story of Western images and very little outright explaination, though enough so that you can devise your own story, sort of an existentialist Western.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: The Firecracker on January 02, 2007, 09:31:52 PM
Great film! Top 20 list for sure.
A shame Titoli found it dull.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: titoli on January 03, 2007, 08:49:08 AM
I wasn't alone, though.

Apparently this is one of the movies (like "And God Said to Cain") on which opinions widely differ (though this is much better than that).
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Silenzio on January 03, 2007, 04:54:00 PM
The Vargas family wants the other families out of the desert: what for?

I watched this movie again yesterday so I can answer this now.

The "Rogers" family (who I'm guessing must be called the Vargas family in the italian dub) didn't necessarily want the Caines out of the desert, it isn't until Ben and those other two steal their money that it becomes a personal vendetta. Somebody says in the saloon scene that the Rogers are notorious for rustling the cattle of the other families, so I think the Rogers rustled the cattle of the Caines, who, in revenge, stole the money from the Rogers, and that started the feud between the two. When the guy mentions the cattle rustling in the saloon scene, the camera isn't even on him, it's on a close-up of Manuel (I think) so that line of dialogue is easy to miss.

***SPOILERS***

One thing I noticed about this movie is that every hostile act is motivated by revenge, kind of like Manuel's line of dialogue towards the beginning of the movie "You believe in revenge, I don't.... It never ends."

Note that the Rogers rustle the catle of the Caines, who, in revenge, steal the money, and the Rogers kill Ben as revenge for that, so Maria kidnaps the Rogers' daughter in revenge, so the Rogers set out after Manuel and Maria and the rest of the Caines in revenge, both of the Caine brothers die, and so does Maria, so Manuel sets out after the Rogers in revenge for Maria, and then the daughter kills Manuel to avenge both A) her rape which he allowed and B) the fact that he just killed more than half of her immediate family.

Indeed.... "Revenge never ends"
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: titoli on January 03, 2007, 06:05:40 PM
I call the "Rogers" family, "Vargas" family because the actor playing the head of the family is Daniele Vargas. Sorry.

I seem to remember somebody (maybe M.Mercier) saying "They wanted us out of here from the beginning". 
But the question is: where is the cattle? what is cattle doing in the desert anyway? You can't have your pie and eat it too. You can take liberties with the landscape (as many westerns do) but not with logic. 

the condensation of the plot you make is a good explanation of my small enthusiasm for it. 

Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on January 03, 2007, 09:19:19 PM
Quote
But the question is: where is the cattle? what is cattle doing in the desert anyway? You can't have your pie and eat it too. You can take liberties with the landscape (as many westerns do) but not with logic. 


Huh? Open Range.... they weren't using fancy breeds of pampered cattle these original Spanish breeds could eat almost anything.

Read about the Last open Range:

http://www.hcn.org/servlets/hcn.Article?article_id=14586
 
And Texas Longhorns :

http://dfwnetmall.com/e-mag/longhorn.htm
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Silenzio on January 03, 2007, 09:41:06 PM
Ah, now I understand about the "Vargas" family. I do similar things when I talk about movies... call characters by their actor's names.



the condensation of the plot you make is a good explanation of my small enthusiasm for it. 



Yes, the movie is more of a slow-paced exercise in style than anything else. It may not accomplish great things with its plot, but i think it's a lovely change from a Django-style bullet festival and other over-the-top spaghettis (nothing against them) and that's what sets it apart for me as one of my favorites.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on January 03, 2007, 09:57:45 PM
Quote
but i think it's a lovely change from a Django-style bullet festival and other over-the-top spaghettis (nothing against them) and that's what sets it apart for me as one of my favorites.

Couldn't have said it any better
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: The Firecracker on January 04, 2007, 12:27:14 AM
I enjoy how perverse all the characters are. There is not one redeeming feature in any of them. Even the victimized widow allows her enemy's daughter to be raped by her murdered husbands brothers. She even makes her enemies dig up her husbands corpse to parade him over to another cemetery.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: titoli on January 04, 2007, 01:28:48 AM
Quote
Huh? Open Range.... they weren't using fancy breeds of pampered cattle these original Spanish breeds could eat almost anything.

I.e. desert sand? Come on, CJ: the prairie you see in the pic in the first article has nothing to do with the desert of Hossein's movie.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on January 04, 2007, 05:18:30 AM
I'm not talking about the sands about  "Ghost Town", I talking about all the background you see during the chase sequence.

Prehaps the encroching dunes are the reason the town became a ghost town.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: titoli on January 04, 2007, 05:59:11 AM
I'm not an agronomist but I have definitely not the impression cattle has a chance to thrive over there. That earth is good only if there is oil way down under. And I'd like to know which is another movie where such a landscape is used as a cattle feeder.   
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Lonestar on January 04, 2007, 02:46:04 PM
I enjoy how perverse all the characters are. There is not one redeeming feature in any of them. Even the victimized widow allows her enemy's daughter to be raped by her murdered husbands brothers. She even makes her enemies dig up her husbands corpse to parade him over to another cemetery.

Why do you enjoy how perverse the characters are? With not one redeeming feature, as you said.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on January 04, 2007, 04:05:05 PM
I think it may because of all the "propaganda" for want of a better word, over the years that overly melodramatic westerns used to force fed us "candy coating" and omitting the nasty parts of our "Manifest Destiny".



Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: The Firecracker on January 06, 2007, 12:11:31 AM
Why do you enjoy how perverse the characters are? With not one redeeming feature, as you said.


What CJ said.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Banjo on January 08, 2007, 06:01:07 PM
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0063740/

http://www.spaghettiwestern.altervista.org/cimitero_senza_croci.htm


The italian SW db tells the movie has "little content and story... (is) little exalting and quite flat". I more or less agree with this. The movie has a good start and is very good until the saloon shooting. Then it becomes a moving to and fro from Hossein's to Mercier's to Vargas', but at a slow pace. Really, I had to fight sleep to watch it through the end.
 
Yes Titoli is right on the money here.A very well made sw but very sleep inducing.I from time to time revisit Great Silence(for me a huge influence on CWC)  but never get the same inclination with this movie.Maybe they should've used the otherwise brilliant up tempo soundtrack for something else!
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Banjo on May 25, 2007, 04:19:16 AM
Leone Admirer's review from his SW Virgins Guide:-

Cemetary Without Crosses

A film set in a nightmareish West, from the styalised opening to the desperate ending, Cemetary Without Crosses presents a different West, perhaps akin to that of Kurosawa's Yojimbo, like Fistful Of Dollars but with a more flawed bounty hunter protagonist.
  The film begins with Maria, Michèle Mercier, witnesing the death of her husband Ben at the hands of the Rogers family. She goes off in search of Manuel, Robert Hossein, to avenge her but he has troubles for himself and is unwilling. After some self persuasion he goes off and joins the Roger's gang and captures their daughter to hold for ransom. But all does not go to plan...
    One of the most interesting aspects of this speaghetti is the characters. Both Maria's family and the Roger's family are not on the right side of the law. Maria's complex releationship with Manuel is interesting also. He is an ex-lover of hers and friends with Ben but you don't really know whether he is undertaking his 'mission' for revenge on the part of Ben or Maria. He won't take the money given to him by Maria however. Light comic relief is given by the two brothers of Maria who are the most inept pair of cowboys that side of the West. However the ineffectiveness brings down the whole operation later on in the story. 
   The acting on the whole is of a very high standard with the beautiful and pained face of Mercier bringing across the troubled Maria very well. Hossein's performance as the avenging Manuel. Seemingly trapped in the past. A nice character trait I thought was having the character put on a glove before he was about to shoot someone. Now I am positive I have seen this somewhere else but I thought here it was a nice touch.
     Cemetary Without Crosses gives off many artistic flares through out it's running time. Hossein directs as well as stars in this film and his use of a Sepia tone in the begining and end of the film, literally bringing the film and it's viewers back into the past whilst giving a nod to the earlier Hollywood westerns of the silent era as well as the 30's and 40's is a particulaly neat effect. Also Manuel's experience in his new home, the abandoned 'Ghost Town' adds a creepy and surrelist feel to the film.  The cinematography for this film captures expertly the very dusty landscape whilst the music re-inforces the despair like atmosphere whilst offering a glimering of hope at certain sections.
    This film is also of great importance to Leone fans.The film is full of Leone esque sequences and referances, However it is not true that Leone plays the head of the hotel that Manuel goes to visit.
     I recomend this film to all spaghetti fans, especially Leone fans and Corbucci fans. Why Corbucci, well if your a fan of the brilliant The Great Silence you'll recognise and love the tone, mood, setting etc of Cemetary Without Crosses as they are expertly similar. I urge those who haven't yet seen it to check it out.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Banjo on May 26, 2007, 06:59:46 AM
A rare (but justisfied  ;) ) negative review from Arizona Colt :-

CEMETERY WITHOUT CROSSES however, I found a bit overrated. I did enjoy it I just don't see what the fuss is about. I liked the gloomy atmosphere and sense of dread especially the howling wind in many scenes but the film seems to drag on much longer than its 85 minute running time. Dario Argento must've had GREAT SILENCE on his mind when he wrote this. Good film just not what I expected.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: The Firecracker on July 27, 2007, 04:15:31 AM
Interesting quote from a SWWB member...

"Got the new CWC DVD by Anolis today. Looking very good, very nice packaging also. There is a 30 minute interview with Hossein who has some stories to tell. For instance that he was also offered Clint's part in FOD, that Leone shot the eating scene of CWC, and that Argento didn't contribute a single word to the script".


Those are some serious claims Hossien is making. Wonder if their true?
The "eating scene" that is referred to is the scene where the baddies play a joke on the hero at a dinner table.
Now that I think about it, Leone's touch is in that scene since it is rather slow moving and contains a lot of awkward close-ups.
The Argento claim is interesting also.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on July 27, 2007, 04:31:38 AM
thanks for that info, something to ponder.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: moviesceleton on July 27, 2007, 06:53:37 AM
Nice discovery O0. When I saw the eating scene I thought: "Very good imitation of Leone's style!" and because I'd heard that the whole movie was a homage to Leone I had no reason doubt that impression. But now when you say that...  The scene is too Leonesque to be directed by anyone else than the master himself ;D.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Rojo Ramone on July 27, 2007, 10:29:18 AM
I was just looking at Xploited to see what was new when i came across the Anolis CWC.
Naturally i came back here to see what you guys thought of this movie because i haven't seen it.
Of course this is another SW i want but can't afford...DAMN!
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Sundance on July 27, 2007, 01:28:05 PM
The Argento claim is interesting also.


http://www.mclink.it/personal/MC8574/englishdario.html  :P
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: moviesceleton on July 27, 2007, 01:37:48 PM
http://www.mclink.it/personal/MC8574/englishdario.html  :P
Interesting... Thanks. Is this Donati's homepage for sure? http://www.mclink.it/personal/MC8574/
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: The Firecracker on July 27, 2007, 09:23:20 PM
http://www.mclink.it/personal/MC8574/englishdario.html  :P


PAWNED
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Silenzio on July 27, 2007, 10:19:30 PM

PAWNED

It's nice to see Sergio Donati obtain supreme ownage over Dario Argento.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Silenzio on July 27, 2007, 10:24:15 PM
This is like the Leone equivalent of Tyson's bite fight.....
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Arizona Colt on July 28, 2007, 02:31:55 PM
That post from "sergio donati" is suspect. When was this written? Why wait until now to post a rant against Dario? Either way, Dario has produced enough great movies that this is meaningless. This isn't the first time in history that a writer, director, etc has taken credit for something he did or did not do. Many times it is done intentionally so as to give said writer, director some early credit. Remember the RUN, MAN, RUN score?

It's quite funny when it was brought to people's attention that Leone's action scenes were directed by other directors because he was incapable of doing so himself, it is ignored.

But yet, when something about him SUPPOSEDLY DIRECTING a scene in another movie is brought up.....oh, of course, his trademark is stamped all over this thing! He is the true component for the existence of this film. I didn't like it before but I like it now knowing this. ::)
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: The Firecracker on July 28, 2007, 02:32:47 PM
That post from "sergio donati" is suspect. When was this written? Why wait until now to post a rant against Dario? Either way, Dario has produced enough great movies that this is meaningless. This isn't the first time in history that a writer, director, etc has taken credit for something he did or did not do. Many times it is done intentionally so as to give said writer, director some early credit. Remember the RUN, MAN, RUN score?

It's quite funny when it was brought to people's attention that Leone's action scenes were directed by other directors because he was incapable of doing so himself, it is ignored.

But yet, when something about him SUPPOSEDLY DIRECTING a scene in another movie is brought up.....oh, of course, his trademark is stamped all over this thing! He is the true component for the existence of this film. I didn't like it before but I like it now knowing this. ::)


 O0 >:D
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Silenzio on July 28, 2007, 03:30:05 PM
It's quite funny when it was brought to people's attention that Leone's action scenes were directed by other directors because he was incapable of doing so himself, it is ignored.

But yet, when something about him SUPPOSEDLY DIRECTING a scene in another movie is brought up.....oh, of course, his trademark is stamped all over this thing! He is the true component for the existence of this film. I didn't like it before but I like it now knowing this. ::)


Haha, so amazingly true.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Sundance on July 28, 2007, 05:52:24 PM
The letter from Donati is I think at least one year old. I first saw it when someone linked to it at SWWB (probably a year ago, might be even longer, I can't remember) and nobody there questioned if it's really Donati's site or not. Google also lists that site as the first one if you search for "Sergio Donati" (not that it necessarily means anything) and lots of Italian websites seem to be linking to it. I can't understand Italian and I haven't been following the site so I can't know what kind of things it has and has been updated with.

As to why make the rant now... the letter has actually been modified from the version I saw... if my memory is correct, it used to have him mentioning seeing the new DVD release of Once Upon A Time In The West at stores and seeing Argento credited. Which I guess could be why he just absolutely needed to get this out there. So maybe it was written when the DVD was released? I don't know.


So because Leone made so many great movies, it's meaningless who actually was the director of Nobody? :P
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: dave jenkins on July 28, 2007, 05:56:51 PM
That post from "sergio donati" is suspect.
And yet it is consistent with what he says in his interview with Frayling (Once Upon a Time in Italy), 156,157:

Quote
I have here the shooting script. And you can see here "from a story by Bernardo Bertolucci and Dario Argento," not "story by. . . " And it is 420 pages long. And I used to make a workshop for young scriptwriters, and I would put on the cassette of the finished sequences, and I [would] read from this, and it is almost identical to the shooting. It is so descriptive, the feeling of Jill as she goes among the men and maybe somebody touches her ass. Sergion asked to have everything written down; he liked that. Long descriptions, indirect dialogue, long biographies of the characters, lots of suggestions on how to direct the scene. Many different possibilities. Hundreds and hundreds of stage directions, with just one line of dialogue. The first sequence--there is the fly, the water, the knuckles, everything. The first line is on page thirty, I think. Here, the old man asking for the money for the tickets. Then nothing, nothing, nothing. It is exactly what you see on the screen--the still on the cover of your biography of Sergio Leone. The small station of Cattle Corner, exterior, day. Camera finds detail of gun in holster. It was shot just as it was written. We're introduced to the three bad guys waiting at the station--more and more stage directions. We're on page eleven already--no words yet. Pages seventeen to twenty--no words except the notice board, which says "delays". . . . And then page twenty-nine, the stationmaster, the old man, says, "For the tickets, you have to pay . . ." All the sound effects are written down, too. The plop of water--that's Woody Strode standing there with the water dropping on his head. The insect--zzzzz. That, Leone loved. Here's the fly, everything.

...

With Sergio you sat down and you imagined the scenes together. It was a very fast work. He said that, and it's true. But he also says, "We wrote it." He never wrote even a postcard. But that's typical for a director. I wrote, but we worked together. He used to imagine the scenes. . . . For Once Upon a Time in the West, we sat around the table for fifteen days, and I didn't take many notes. He used to say to other people, "Oh, he remembers everything." It was a surprise to him, because what I believe in I don't need to jot down. And if I take notes, they are no use. I can write only when I have the script clear in my mind. And so I came home, and in three weeks I wrote this 420 pages, and I rewrote just two or three scenes, no more than that.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Arizona Colt on July 28, 2007, 08:34:13 PM
Again, the Elite Order of Higher Intellect are not reading the post.

I will re-type in the hopes that it is clear the second time.

Obviously with Dario's name being on the film, he had some input whether it be a single sentence or idea, he had some input regardless of how much it may have been.

Again, I will re-type--IT IS NOT UNCOMMON FOR A WRITER, DIRECTOR, MUSICIAN, ETC...TO RECEIVE CREDIT FOR A WORK HE MAY NOT HAVE HAD MUCH INVOLVEMENT WITH IN THE FIRST PLACE TO GIVE HIM SOME CREDIT FOR LATER OPPORTUNITIES.

Again, I will re-type--DARIO ARGENTO HAS DIRECTED ENOUGH CLASSY MOVIES THAT HIS PLACE IN CINEMA NEED NOT BE QUESTIONED AND IS MEANINGLESS TO DEBATE HIS CINEMATIC SKILLS OVER A CREDIT FROM A MOVIE OVER 40 YEARS OLD.

Again...what does my response have to do with MY NAME IS NOBODY? AGAIN.....THAT'S NOT A LEONE MOVIE.... ::)

I was referring to the one who said that Leone directed a scene in the awful CEMETERY WITHOUT CROSSES.

Since no one bothered to read my post carefully and concisely, I noticed that no one also bothered to address this bit from the same post...in reference to the awful CEMETERY WITHOUT CROSSES in case there is still further confusion. If so, check the title of this thread....

But yet, when something about him SUPPOSEDLY DIRECTING a scene in another movie is brought up.....oh, of course, his trademark is stamped all over this thing! He is the true component for the existence of this film. I didn't like it before but I like it now knowing this.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: dave jenkins on July 28, 2007, 08:55:48 PM
Well, as is the habit of this board, discussion doesn't always stay on topic. It wanders into other areas, such as the above digression regarding authorship of OUATITW. Touchy, touchy . . . .
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Arizona Colt on July 28, 2007, 09:05:38 PM
AGAIN, I NEVER QUESTIONED THE AUTHORSHIP OF ONCE UPON A TIME IN THE WEST. ARGENTO IS NOT THE SOLE CREDITED SCREENWRITER.

IT IS NOT UNCOMMON FOR A WRITER, DIRECTOR, MUSICIAN, ETC...TO RECEIVE CREDIT FOR A WORK HE MAY NOT HAVE HAD MUCH INVOLVEMENT WITH IN THE FIRST PLACE TO GIVE HIM SOME CREDIT FOR LATER OPPORTUNITIES.

The THIRD time I hope is the charm.

Still, no one has bothered to acknowledge anything about Leone's inability to direct an action sequence. Instead relying on other directors to do it for him. We're talking more than one scene. LENGTHY SCENES OF ACTION. I guess that means LEONE ISN'T THE SOLE "AUTHOR" OF HIS WORK EITHER. NO ONE SEEMS TO RECOGNIZE THIS BUT WHEN THE SUPPOSED GENIUS THAT HE IS DIRECTS A SCENE THEN SAID FILM IS NOW SEEN IN A DIFFERENT LIGHT.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: dave jenkins on July 28, 2007, 09:11:24 PM
You seem to think that this thread is all about you. Well, you have my pity.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on July 28, 2007, 09:12:13 PM
Quote
It's quite funny when it was brought to people's attention that Leone's action scenes were directed by other directors because he was incapable of doing so himself, it is ignored.

I wouldn't say that he was incapable, its mentioned in the commentaries on DYS that Leone was busy directing the principals and leaving the action to the second units. I could be the same in the other films.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Arizona Colt on July 28, 2007, 09:23:37 PM
Not according to Margheriti. He has nothing but praise for the man but it is said that he was uncomfortable shooting big action scenes and he left them to his ADs. Alberto de Martino also did the final action scene in DUCK YOU SUCKER. So that's three for this one movie...

Giancarlo Santi, Margheriti and de Martino.

To Jenkins--what gave you the impression that I thought the thread was about me? I simply brought something to your attention that seems to be constantly overlooked. No need to pity me. You wish to incite some sort of battle of words with me but I have little time for you now. If you like, PM me your address and I will send you some toys. I have some old WW2 toy soldiers in the attic that could possibly bring some enjoyment to you and possibly help you to focus and read posts more carefully next time.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: The Firecracker on July 28, 2007, 09:24:20 PM
I wouldn't say that he was incapable, its mentioned in the commentaries on DYS that Leone was busy directing the principals and leaving the action to the second units. I could be the same in the other films.


Well I don't know Joe.

I know he did direct the bombed out town shootout in GBU because I have seen pics of him on that set.

That shootout is pretty pedestrian stuff.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: titoli on July 28, 2007, 09:46:31 PM
Quote
Not according to Margheriti. He has nothing but praise for the man but it is said that he was uncomfortable shooting big action scenes and he left them to his ADs.

That makes me wonder why he wanted to do a movie on the Leningrad siege. Probably planned to shoot it in a bathroom.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on July 29, 2007, 11:11:03 AM
 O0 O0
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: The Firecracker on August 23, 2007, 10:43:53 PM
This is getting a rerelease in Japan.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: The Firecracker on August 23, 2007, 10:56:41 PM


To Jenkins--what gave you the impression that I thought the thread was about me? I simply brought something to your attention that seems to be constantly overlooked. No need to pity me. You wish to incite some sort of battle of words with me but I have little time for you now. If you like, PM me your address and I will send you some toys. I have some old WW2 toy soldiers in the attic that could possibly bring some enjoyment to you and possibly help you to focus and read posts more carefully next time.


 ;D
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Kurug3n on March 01, 2008, 10:32:27 AM
http://xploitedcinema.com/catalog/cemetery-without-crosses-anolis-limited-edition-release-p-12305.html (http://xploitedcinema.com/catalog/cemetery-without-crosses-anolis-limited-edition-release-p-12305.html)

This movie looks very interesting to me. But i dont know if im willing to spend $45+ on it :-\
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Novecento on May 30, 2009, 07:03:26 AM
Just thought I'd add a comment here. The confusion stems from Leone directing the dinner sequence which Hossein talks about on the interview on the German DVD where a photo of Leone directing is shown.

And yes, if you watch the movie, Cris Huerta looks absolutely nothing like Leone.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Dust Devil on July 29, 2009, 08:05:43 AM
Well, Cemetery Without Crosses is a classic of its sub-genre, merited or not, the opinions obviously vary. I like it, though I don't watch it often and wouldn't rate it very high. It's full of W cliches, yeah, but the non-standard W characters, the surreal touch and the fact that it's stripped of the usual SW excesses make up for a nice little change. The dinner scene is great; the unsure close-up build up to a nifty surprise.


7/10
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Novecento on July 29, 2009, 10:41:07 AM
Personally I love it. It is pure visual cinema with minimal reliance on dialogue. Alex Cox says in his review that he wishes even some of this very sparse dialogue would be removed which would almost render it literally speechless. In any case it should really be watched in its original French, rather than English or Italian, for the times when speaking does sporadically occur.

Including this one, I have only seen two films directed by Hossein. Albeit well-respected as an actor, he seems to be to have been grossly underrated as a director.

After Leone's five, this vies with Corbucci's "Great Silence" for the no.6 spot in my favorite Spaghetti Westerns
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: T.H. on July 29, 2009, 10:46:35 AM
Well I don't know Joe.

I know he did direct the bombed out town shootout in GBU because I have seen pics of him on that set.

That shootout is pretty pedestrian stuff.

Not really. That's probably better than 90+% of western shootouts that came before.

I have my doubts about Leone's supposed inability to shoot action. Anyone else have more evidence?
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Dust Devil on July 29, 2009, 02:25:07 PM
(http://i25.tinypic.com/n5mv4w.jpg)
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: stanton on July 30, 2009, 01:13:53 AM
About Dario Argento. The French version, which must be considered as the original version, doesn't mention Argento in the credits.

For me one of the best SWs.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Novecento on July 30, 2009, 05:16:51 AM
About Dario Argento. The French version, which must be considered as the original version, doesn't mention Argento in the credits.

If I remember correctly, in the interview on the German DVD Hossein says that Argento had nothing to do with it.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: dave jenkins on September 09, 2009, 07:13:41 PM
Personally I love it. It is pure visual cinema with minimal reliance on dialogue. Alex Cox says in his review that he wishes even some of this very sparse dialogue would be removed which would almost render it literally speechless. In any case it should really be watched in its original French, rather than English or Italian, for the times when speaking does sporadically occur.
A really, really good point.

I finally saw this, courtesy of CJ and his DVD burner. The dialogue is, as you suggest, almost entirely superfluous. The lack of plot allows the characters to take their time doing things, mostly looking at each other. This is a film that's got gaze! It really needs a Morricone score, however.

Oh, and in case anyone still needs to be convinced, this is definitely NOT Leone:
(http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/7113/cap307.png)
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Novecento on November 13, 2009, 10:47:21 PM
If I remember correctly, in the interview on the German DVD Hossein says that Argento had nothing to do with it.

I just watched this excellent 30 minute interview again last night. Hossein says that he might perhaps have given a copy of the finished script to Argento because he was also Leone's friend, but then noted that Argento doesn't understand French at all so would not have been able to read it in any case. Hossein also pointed out that the correct French credits (with the black and white rather than Italian sepia background of the riders) does not even mention Argento's name - the German disc has a nice comparison of both credit sequences.

On a related note, the original French version begins and ends in black & white. Out of curiosity, has the black & white ending also been changed to sepia in the Italian version or left as is?
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Novecento on November 13, 2009, 11:42:58 PM
It really needs a Morricone score, however.

I actually really like the score. It's by Robert Hossein's father, André Hossein, who it seems did the scores for many of his son's works.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on November 14, 2009, 04:10:48 AM
Quote
On a related note, the original French version begins and ends in black & white. Out of curiosity, has the black & white ending also been changed to sepia in the Italian version or left as is?

The DVDr I have has sepia, I think its from the SPO Japanese DVD. I don't mind the score at all.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Novecento on November 14, 2009, 09:37:18 AM
Thanks for letting me know. The sepia looks quite nice actually, but I wonder why they changed it from the original black & white in the first place  ???
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: O'Cangaceiro on August 09, 2010, 05:50:21 PM
I agree about Cemetery without crosses being one of the greatest SWs. I have really enjoyed watching it, especially its surreal atmosphere. However, I must say that I found it quite slow in general.

The soundtrack is also great.

And the hotel clerk is definitely Chris Huerta.

7.5/10
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Dust Devil on August 10, 2010, 05:30:39 AM
I agree about Cemetery without crosses being one of the greatest SWs.

7.5/10

Still, for one of the best SWs around 7.5/10 does seem kinda low...
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Groggy on August 10, 2010, 06:00:40 AM
Still, for one of the best SWs around 7.5/10 does seem kinda low...

Not if one isn't a Spaghetti fan.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Novecento on August 10, 2010, 06:10:13 AM
Not if one isn't a Spaghetti fan.

Regardless if one is is a Spaghetti fan IMO
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: O'Cangaceiro on August 10, 2010, 08:07:44 AM
Still, for one of the best SWs around 7.5/10 does seem kinda low...

Maybe so, but that is just MY view. I would have given the movie a higher mark if I did not find it sooooooo slooooooow.

And I am an avid SW fan.  8)
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Rudra on August 03, 2011, 08:57:56 PM
I tried searching everywhere for a DVD of this film "Cemetery Without Crosses" and all of my efforts came to a zilch. Is there any place, where I can buy and preferably a re-mastered DVD version of the film? Thanks for the pointers.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Banjo on August 04, 2011, 04:19:48 AM
http://cultcine.com/products-page?view_type=default&product_search=cemetery
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: stanton on August 04, 2011, 01:34:14 PM
But that's a bootleg, and besides most likely only a DVD-R.

Here are the released DVDs: http://www.spaghetti-western.net/index.php/Une_corde,_un_Colt/DVD

German DVD is excellent, but also very expensive.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Banjo on August 04, 2011, 03:48:54 PM
but also very expensive.

Exactly. ::)

The Culttzine site has caused much controversy on that spaghetti western site as it seems that the sources aren't exactly  legit.But who really cares if they can deliver on excellent quality if the legit releaes don't.Here's a review of the Cultzine release of Face To Face which apparently is superior to the Japanese SPO disc(i own this and the English audio is dreadful).

http://www.spaghetti-western.net/index.php/Face_to_Face_DVD_Review_%28Cultcine%29
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: stanton on August 05, 2011, 01:03:00 AM
The problem seems to be that he uses partly other people's work to make money. You can get get most unreleased SWs as fan dubs for nothing, or for the cost of a trade.

I rarely pay more than 10 € for a legit DVD, and I would never pay 15 $ for a bootleg, especially as it is not even a burned DVD.

Compared to the German DVD, which I bought for 25 € (still the most expensive single DVD I ever bought), the Cultcine bootlegs are very, very expensive.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Banjo on August 05, 2011, 01:35:26 AM
Well at least we've given Rudra a couple of leads where he can get hold of this film.  :)
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Rudra on August 06, 2011, 09:46:14 AM
Dear Banjo and Stanton,

Thank you very much for the links. I have gone through both the links and will make a decision soon.

Thanks again!

R
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Novecento on December 08, 2011, 05:13:50 PM
Hossein's "Le Goût de la violence" (The Taste of Violence) is apparently being released as part of the 'Collection Gaumont à la demande' this March.

If you like "Cemetery without Crosses", you'll certainly appreciate this as well.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on December 08, 2011, 05:23:07 PM
Hossein's "Le Goût de la violence" (The Taste of Violence) is apparently being released as part of the 'Collection Gaumont à la demande' this March.

If you like "Cemetery without Crosses", you'll certainly appreciate this as well.

Its not a Western is it?
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: titoli on December 08, 2011, 05:30:40 PM
Its not a Western is it?

Looks like a zapata-w.

http://www.spaghetti-western.net/index.php/Go%C3%BBt_de_la_violence%2C_Le
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: stanton on December 09, 2011, 01:47:33 AM
In the SWDB forum you find some more information about it:

http://www.spaghetti-western.net/forum/index.php/topic,1883.0.html

There is also a link to the well written Scherpschutter review.



And there I already wrote about the western or not-western question:

I don't think it's a western at all. It has indeed some western elements, but I would call it at best a half western.

You can debate about several of the revolution westerns if they are really westerns, or if they are more likely war films or political films or whatever. Of course they are often also war films (like Giu la testa), or political films (Quien sabe? is probably more connected with Damiani's polit thrillers, than with most of the other SWs), but they contain enough western elements to be called as such by me.

Taste of Violence is obviously a Hossein film, but the western elements are very vague. And the setting is not intended to be Mexico but a different Middle- or South American country. It's interesting to watch it in the context of the later made revolution westerns, but I don't include it.

Some people also view american films like Viva Villa (1933, co-directed by Howard Hawks) and Kazan's Viva Zapata as westerns, I don't.

Another difference is that Quien sabe? and it's successors were made directly in the context of the SW boom, and therefore included more elements of western directing than other films which were dealing with revolution themes.
The western status of Quien sabe? and Tepepa can be questioned, but they were always considered as westerns by me. Taste of Violence is like O cangaceiro or  Pontecorvo's Queimada out of the canon. But like the similar discussion about Spaghetti- , Paella- , or Euro westerns it's a matter of definitions which everybody has to make for himself.

On the other hand, due to their style and their directing, it was never questioned by me that Corbucci's The Mercenary and Companeros and Leone's Giu la testa are 100% westerns



Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Banjo on December 10, 2011, 06:24:20 AM
Dear Banjo and Stanton,

Thank you very much for the links. I have gone through both the links and will make a decision soon.

Thanks again!

R

My bootleg of the Japanese  disc of CWC won't play anymore so i bought this very cheap box set the other week which has an excellent print of this movie and of several other sw's:-

http://cinemaraiders.blogspot.com/2011/05/best-of-spaghetti-westerns.html
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Novecento on June 04, 2014, 04:54:08 AM
Hossein's "Toi le venin" has been slated for a blu-ray release by Gaumont this November
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: dave jenkins on June 04, 2014, 05:43:07 AM
Hossein's "Toi le venin" has been slated for a blu-ray release by Gaumont this November
The ultimate Hossein film, apparently. From IMDb:
Quote
A throbbing jazz score and a bitterly ironic twist at the end top off what looks to be a reel family affair: director Hossein adapted his friend Frédéric Dard's pulp novel and co-starred with his wife, Marina Vlady, and sister-in-law Odile Versois. His father, André Hossein, composed the music.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: titoli on June 04, 2014, 07:57:33 AM
Hossein's "Toi le venin" has been slated for a blu-ray release by Gaumont this November

I've read the novel last month. Not his best, though good. On the contrary, I've read soon after Le dos au mur, which is an absolute masterpiece: apparently no movie has been made out of it, am I wrong?
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: dave jenkins on June 04, 2014, 09:48:31 AM
I've read the novel last month. Not his best, though good. On the contrary, I've read soon after Le dos au mur, which is an absolute masterpiece: apparently no movie has been made out of it, am I wrong?
Of course you are: http://movies.msn.com/movies/movie/le-dos-au-mur.2/

I've been championing that film, ever since I saw it as part of Gaumont's 100-year retrospective in 1994. But you never listened.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: titoli on June 04, 2014, 10:09:05 AM
Of course you are: http://movies.msn.com/movies/movie/le-dos-au-mur.2/

I've been championing that film, ever since I saw it as part of Gaumont's 100-year retrospective in 1994. But you never listened.

Probably the fact that you were championing it turned me off. Thanx, anyway.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: dave jenkins on June 04, 2014, 03:40:05 PM
I'm a big Leone fan, too, so you may want to steer clear of his work.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: noodles_leone on June 04, 2014, 04:03:02 PM
And yellow. He likes yellow.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: titoli on June 04, 2014, 11:51:28 PM
I'm a big Leone fan...

Nah, you only think you are.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: titoli on June 04, 2014, 11:52:14 PM
And yellow. He likes yellow.

And black, too.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Sundance on April 02, 2015, 12:22:24 PM
So this shit is coming out in July from Arrow.

(http://i.imgur.com/gDrdRlu.jpg)
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: dave jenkins on April 02, 2015, 01:15:36 PM
Quote
SPECIAL EDITION CONTENTS

- Brand new 2K restoration of the film from original film elements
- High Definition Blu-ray (1080p) and Standard Definition DVD presentations
- Original Italian and English soundtracks in uncompressed PCM mono audio
- Newly translated English subtitles for the Italian soundtrack
- Optional English subtitles for the deaf and hard of hearing for the English soundtrack
- Remembering Sergio - an all-new interview with star and director Robert Hossein, filmed exclusively for this release
- French television news report on the film’s making, containing interviews with Hossein, and actors Michèle Mercier and Serge Marquand
- Archive interview with Hossein
- Trailers
- Reversible sleeve featuring original and newly commissioned artwork by James Flames
- Illustrated collector’s booklet containing new writing by Ginette Vincendeau and Rob Young

Release date: July 20th

Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Novecento on April 02, 2015, 06:43:47 PM
Awesome news, except for one thing.... where is the original French audio ??
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: dave jenkins on April 03, 2015, 07:08:45 AM
Awesome news, except for one thing.... where is the original French audio ??
From what I understand, they don't have access to it yet but they're trying to get it. Obviously they don't want to promise what they can't be sure they'll get. So, we'll have to see.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Sundance on April 03, 2015, 07:09:48 AM
From Arrow's Facebook page:

We are looking into the French track, it's not within our rights presently but we're doing all we can to get it.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Novecento on April 04, 2015, 04:16:02 AM
I just received an e-mail from them to the same effect:

In relation to the French soundtrack, we are looking into acquiring the rights to this. It is not within our right presently but I can assure you that we are doing everything we can to try and secure it.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: dave jenkins on July 26, 2015, 09:03:26 AM
http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Cemetery-Without-Crosses-Blu-ray/128684/#Review

I hadn't realized Leone directed one scene.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Rojo Ramone on May 21, 2016, 01:28:18 PM
This has become one of my favorite Westerns almost on par with Leone's best
With every viewing it ranks higher for me.
It's close to the top now thanks to the Arrow BD.

Between the beautiful Spanish guitar and Hossein's brilliant sombre performance this film has a quiet, poetic beauty unmatched by any other Western.
His performance is similar to the Man With No Name but with an added vulnerability.
It could even be argued he was a little depressed.
I like that we don't know the full relationship between the 3 characters. (I hope I didn't just miss it)

The main theme song works perfectly (for me :)) as the fanfare music it is.
It kinda reminds me of the theme in 3:00 TO YUMA
It was written by his father and every time it appears I get the chills and realize Hossein "gets" Leone like no other.
I can't think of a better made tribute in any Art-form. (I dislike Tarantino)
The dinner scene, directed by Leone himself, also stands out as a high-lite among all Westerns.

This film is a great example of a grower.




 


Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Novecento on May 23, 2016, 08:41:26 PM
This has become one of my favorite Westerns almost on par with Leone's best
With every viewing it ranks higher for me.
It's close to the top now thanks to the Arrow BD.

Between the beautiful Spanish guitar and Hossein's brilliant sombre performance this film has a quiet, poetic beauty unmatched by any other Western.
His performance is similar to the Man With No Name but with an added vulnerability.
It could even be argued he was a little depressed.
I like that we don't know the full relationship between the 3 characters. (I hope I didn't just miss it)

The main theme song works perfectly (for me :)) as the fanfare music it is.
It kinda reminds me of the theme in 3:00 TO YUMA
It was written by his father and every time it appears I get the chills and realize Hossein "gets" Leone like no other.
I can't think of a better made tribute in any Art-form. (I dislike Tarantino)
The dinner scene, directed by Leone himself, also stands out as a high-lite among all Westerns.

This film is a great example of a grower.

Generally actors should probably not try directing and directors should probably not try to act. There are of course some very notable exceptions to this rule - Orson Welles is probably the most famous. Robert Hossein should certainly be included on this list too. I only wish he had directed anywhere near as many films as he has acted in.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: stanton on May 24, 2016, 01:12:03 AM
Generally actors should probably not try directing and directors should probably not try to act. There are of course some very notable exceptions to this rule - Orson Welles is probably the most famous. Robert Hossein should certainly be included on this list too. I only wish he had directed anywhere near as many films as he has acted in.

I actually wish I could see his other films. They are barely released and hard to find.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: noodles_leone on May 24, 2016, 01:41:09 AM
I think everybody should try whatever they want. Artists (in a broad meaning) staying within their comfort zone is the most boring thing mankind ever created (maybe I'm overstating my point, let's say second most boring right after Argo).
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Spikeopath on February 24, 2017, 03:29:30 PM
Just adding my own review to the mix. No requirement for anyone to read and comment. Especially irate Italian guys.  ;)

The Black Glove Man.

Une corde, un Colt (AKA: Cemetery Without Crosses) is directed by Robert Hossein, who also stars and co-writes the screenplay with Dario Argento and Claude Desailly. Starring alongside Hossein are Michèle Mercier, Anne-Marie Balin, Daniele Vargas, Guido Lollobrigida and Serge Marquand. Music is by Andre Hossein and cinematography by Henri Persin.

After being forced to watch the lynching of her husband by the ruthless Rogers family, Maria Caine (Mercier) asks her inept brothers-in-law for help in retribution. Getting no joy from the pair, she seeks outside help in the form of fast gun Manuel (Hossein), a loner living in solitude out at a ghost town...

It's dedicated to Sergio Leone, who directs one of the best scenes in the film, contains the Argento factor, so it's not really a shock to proclaim that Leone's influence is all over Hossein's movie.

It's a Pasta Western that operates in the void between the real and the spirit world, deliberately ethereal in tone, even sprinkling dashes of the surreal onto the hearty portion. Dialogue is used sparingly, but not to the detriment of film's quality, and Hossein the director dallies in black and white staging, slow zooms and excellent usage of sound effects.

Much like the dialogue, the violence is pared down, there's no Blunderbuss infused blood laden approach to the evil that men do here, it's all very controlled and in keeping with the tonal flows that Hossein favours. The cliché's of the sub-genre are adhered to throughout, thankfully so, while the finale is suitably melancholic.

Thoughtful, sombre and ripe with blurry ambiguity, Cemetery Without Crosses is comfortably recommended to the Euro Western fan. 8/10
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on February 24, 2017, 03:40:52 PM
I like it's soundtrack too.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Novecento on February 26, 2017, 10:33:41 AM
Une corde, un Colt (AKA: Cemetery Without Crosses) is directed by Robert Hossein, who also stars and co-writes the screenplay with Dario Argento...

If I remember correctly, Hossein has said that Argento wasn't really involved and isn't mentioned in the French credits.

Thoughtful, sombre and ripe with blurry ambiguity, Cemetery Without Crosses is comfortably recommended to the Euro Western fan. 8/10

Probably my favorite non-Leone Spaghetti Western. Now you need to watch Hossein's "The Taste of Violence" which is very similar in style and tone.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: stanton on February 26, 2017, 12:30:47 PM
If I remember correctly, Hossein has said that Argento wasn't really involved and isn't mentioned in the French credits.



As far as I remember, according to Hossein, Argento had nothing to do with it.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Spikeopath on February 27, 2017, 12:18:00 PM
If I remember correctly, Hossein has said that Argento wasn't really involved and isn't mentioned in the French credits.

Probably my favorite non-Leone Spaghetti Western. Now you need to watch Hossein's "The Taste of Violence" which is very similar in style and tone.

IMDb has Argento listed as - Dario Argento   ...   (dialogue) (italian version). That to me now seems a bit spurious as a credit! Be nice to have an Argenrto enthusiast around to find out exactly what input (if any) was there. Thanks for letting me know  O0

Noted with thanks for The Taste of Violence  O0 O0

Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: moorman on June 20, 2018, 06:59:58 PM
A rare (but justisfied  ;) ) negative review from Arizona Colt :-

CEMETERY WITHOUT CROSSES however, I found a bit overrated. I did enjoy it I just don't see what the fuss is about. I liked the gloomy atmosphere and sense of dread especially the howling wind in many scenes but the film seems to drag on much longer than its 85 minute running time. Dario Argento must've had GREAT SILENCE on his mind when he wrote this. Good film just not what I expected.

BINGO.  The director made this the year after Corbucci made The Great Silence.  Let me back up.  Its a good but flawed film.  The problem is its The Great Silence redone with a little bit of For A Few Dollars More thrown in.  The Great Silence is a film that you cannot redo in any way without coming off as pretentious. Its just HARD to redo that in any way.  No, you CANNOT redo that film.  Thats why Tarintino chose elements of the film but not the script itself when he made the Hateful Eight. 

My other problem is the similarity to For A Few Dollars More. I would've went in another direction than the one he chose to infiltrate the gang like Clint did in his film.  The Caine brothers were fabulous with their guns. I would've wrote the film to incorporate the three of them taking on the Rodgers without the drawn out play of the kidnapping, etc.  There are some great things about this film though.  The opening chase was just down right superb.  The casting was perfect.  The camera work was fantastic with the MAJOR exception of the ping pong scene ( the back and forth camera shots of Manuel and his ex girlfriend). It came across as very gimmicky.  The film hadn't earned that shot. The score was good but early on seemed rushed and out of place ( the uptempo score).

Overall I give this a 7 out of 10...
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: stanton on June 21, 2018, 04:38:24 AM
BINGO.  The director made this the year after Corbucci made The Great Silence.  Let me back up.  Its a good but flawed film.  The problem is its The Great Silence redone with a little bit of For A Few Dollars More thrown in. 

I don't see much connections to TGS, neither to FAFDM.

And btw it was most liekly already shot in 68. In several books Une corde, un Colt is named as a 68 film, which indicates that the film was shot that year.

The release date is only about half a year after TGS in May 69.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: moorman on June 21, 2018, 09:26:28 AM
I don't see much connections to TGS, neither to FAFDM.

And btw it was most liekly already shot in 68. In several books Une corde, un Colt is named as a 68 film, which indicates that the film was shot that year.

The release date is only about half a year after TGS in May 69.

Clint smoked LOTS of cigars. There is hardly a scene that Manuel isn't puffing on one.  Clint joined Indio's gang under the guise of helping them by breaking their gang member out of jail.  Manuel joined the Rogers gang under the guise of helping them in that bar. Clint had a wrist cuff which was his signature. Manuel had a glove which was his signature.  Robert even threw in a musical watchbox.

The Great Silence was filmed in 1967.  Robert had almost a year to find out what that script was all about.   Both have a widow that hires someone to get revenge. Both have themes of dark tones with no winners.  Both have the widow die. Both have the protagonist die at the end.  The only thing different that Robert did was SEPERATE the widow's death from Manuel's.  I think its clear that Robert got his ideas from both Leone and Corbucci.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: stanton on June 21, 2018, 11:47:54 AM
That's all too vague for me. The similarities are all nothing special, things you don't need to steal from others.

And that a director gets his ideas from a script from an unreleased film is ... well ... extremely vague.

I have watched all 3 films quite often, and I never got the feeling to watch a clone from the other 2 films.

And btw plots are anyway not that important, and the story is not what makes Une Corde un colt so unique, but the directing. And here makes Hossein his own thing.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Novecento on June 21, 2018, 01:34:28 PM
... and the story is not what makes Une Corde un colt so unique, but the directing. And here makes Hossein his own thing.

That is absolutely the case (regardless of how valid the other comments above may or may not be)
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: mike siegel on June 21, 2018, 02:05:50 PM
SILENZIO was not filmed in 1967.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: moorman on June 21, 2018, 02:51:31 PM
SILENZIO was not filmed in 1967.

It was released in 1968 but filmed in 1967. Alex Cox says it was filmed in 1967,   https://vimeo.com/50101903   Cox spoke with Vonetta Mcgee about The Great Silence AND directed her in Repo Man. If anyone knows when The Great Silence was filmed,  it has to be Alex Cox...

Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: mike siegel on June 23, 2018, 07:22:19 AM
Alex is nice, he wrote me a nice note about my PASSION & POETRY...

However, anybody who is into film history will confirm to you that remembering after 20,30, 40 years is most difficult - especially
for movie people, who wander from one film to the next...
Even Corbucci himself remembered it wrong. In his autobiography he writes that the film was shot after GLI SPECIALISTI,
because (Producer) Dorfmann was impressed by that film's success. Which he remembered wrong of course, GLI
was shot even after MERCENARIO...
Anyway, from what I researched for my SILENZIO audio-commentary SILENZIO was shot in late winter (exteriors)/ early spring (studio) 1968.
One can also see it in the WESTERN ALL'ITALIANA documentary, which was shot approx. February - April 1968 (it ends
with the early production of OUATITW which was shot around April - June '68, posters he filmed in Rome depict films released in March...)
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: moorman on June 23, 2018, 11:29:26 AM
Alex is nice, he wrote me a nice note about my PASSION & POETRY...

However, anybody who is into film history will confirm to you that remembering after 20,30, 40 years is most difficult - especially
for movie people, who wander from one film to the next...
Even Corbucci himself remembered it wrong. In his autobiography he writes that the film was shot after GLI SPECIALISTI,
because (Producer) Dorfmann was impressed by that film's success. Which he remembered wrong of course, GLI
was shot even after MERCENARIO...
Anyway, from what I researched for my SILENZIO audio-commentary SILENZIO was shot in late winter (exteriors)/ early spring (studio) 1968.
One can also see it in the WESTERN ALL'ITALIANA documentary, which was shot approx. February - April 1968 (it ends
with the early production of OUATITW which was shot around April - June '68, posters he filmed in Rome depict films released in March...)

Very enlightening response. Thanx.  Getting back to Alex.  Alex said that The Great Silence was filmed in late 1967 and from your research, early 1968.  My point is that Robert had enough time to see that script IF thats actually what happened.  There is too much similarity there for it not to be the case.  As far as the comparison to A Few Dollars More its obvious from Robert himself and his acknowledgment of Sergio Leone that he borrowed ideas from that film.   

Let me say this also.  I'm not nick picking Robert for borrowing any ideas from other directors. They all do that.  What I'm nick picking is that some films are so iconic and different that you cannot touch them. The Great Silence is one of them.  All Westerns have the same elements in one form or another.  Also, if you borrow from another director, do it RIGHT.  That ping pong of the camera scene where Robert bounced back and forth between his character and his ex girlfriend's character came across as very gimmicky.  Leone did it right.  Finally,  Robert's film is GOOD. Its not a bad film.  Its just that it comes across to me as Sergio Leone and Sergio Corbucci lite and thats not a bad thing because Robert's film is still better than 2/3rds of the sphagetti westerns that were made.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on June 23, 2018, 03:08:50 PM
Check out Day Of The Outlaw if you haven't yet
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: moorman on June 23, 2018, 05:29:41 PM
Check out Day Of The Outlaw if you haven't yet

I saw the LAST scene of that and have always intended to go back and watch the whole movie. I will do that and give a review. Thanx...
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: stanton on June 24, 2018, 03:01:42 PM
Check out Day Of The Outlaw if you haven't yet

Don't say TGS is a remake of that one.

But I'm sure Corbucci knew Day Of The Outlaw. Took some of it's atmosphere (and especially the costumes), transformed it ...
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: stanton on June 24, 2018, 03:17:52 PM
Very enlightening response. Thanx.  Getting back to Alex.  Alex said that The Great Silence was filmed in late 1967 and from your research, early 1968.  My point is that Robert had enough time to see that script IF thats actually what happened.  There is too much similarity there for it not to be the case.  As far as the comparison to A Few Dollars More its obvious from Robert himself and his acknowledgment of Sergio Leone that he borrowed ideas from that film.   


Of course directors take things from other films, borrow ideas, or even steal them. I have no problem with that. Even when they steal, as long as they steal good. But the connections you make with TGS are too common to make much sense. And that a French director had read an Italian screenplay from a then not well known director, who made mostly minor films, is extremely far fetched.

And I still have no idea why you compare both films so close. I still don't think that they have much in common.

The things Hossein maybe took from FaFDM are maybe indeed taken from Leone, but even then they are so differently used that I see more differences than similarities. E.g. Eastwood's smoking underlines his coolness, while Hossein's smoking is nothing of that.

When I watch A Stranger in Town, yes, than it is obvious that without Fod this would most likely never have been made. But it is still more than a mere copy though.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: moorman on June 24, 2018, 03:36:00 PM
Of course directors take things from other films, borrow ideas, or even steal them. I have no problem with that. Even when they steal, as long as they steal good. But the connections you make with TGS are too common to make much sense. And that a French director had read an Italian screenplay from a then not well known director, who made mostly minor films, is extremely far fetched.

And I still have no idea why you compare both films so close. I still don't think that they have much in common.

The things Hossein maybe took from FaFDM are maybe indeed taken from Leone, but even then they are so differently used that I see more differences than similarities. E.g. Eastwood's smoking underlines his coolness, while Hossein's smoking is nothing of that.

When I watch A Stranger in Town, yes, than it is obvious that without Fod this would most likely never have been made. But it is still more than a mere copy though.

At the end of the day, to me The Great Silence is a excellent film and Robert's film is pretty good in its own right.  Like you said, whether you take, borrow or steal from another director, make sure its GOOD, lol.  I could be totally wrong and what I'm seeing could be coincidence.  Doesn't really matter in the end...
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: stanton on June 25, 2018, 01:14:48 AM
Wise words.
But I value Hossein more than you do, Une Corde is a film which gets better with every viewing. One of the 10 best Spags, and I prefer it slightly to FoD or FaFDM or Django.

TGS is a very underrated film, maybe because Corbucci made too much crap, filmed too often under his possibilities. But in his best films he made very daring films with some brilliant directing. Leone's weaker films are now praised world wide for the simple fact that they were made by Leone, while Corbucci is a director only known by insiders.

But that happens all the time in art history.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Novecento on June 26, 2018, 11:15:56 AM
Even Corbucci himself remembered it wrong. In his autobiography he writes that the film was shot after GLI SPECIALISTI,
because (Producer) Dorfmann was impressed by that film's success. Which he remembered wrong of course, GLI
was shot even after MERCENARIO...

Are you referring to his autobiography in the volume edited by Caldiron? I can't seem to find the comment about Dorfmann. I see that Corbucci talks about Django, Navajo Joe and Gli specialisti as a set: "Django era un film contro il razzismo e l'intolleranza, Navajo Joe era un film contro il genocidio degli indiani, Gli specialisti era un film contro lo sopraffazione del ricchi" (p.80) after which he then talks about The Great Silence in the context of Django's continuing success: "Cominciavo ad essere un po' stanco di questo tipo di film, perché in breve tempo ne avevo fatti sei. I francesi mi chiesero di fare un altro western, sempre in coproduzione, con un attore che mi era molto amico, Jean-Louis Trintignant" (p.82). I think it's a little ambiguous (What specifically are the six westerns he is counting? Does he mean "another French western" or just "another western" that this time was requested by the French), and thematically he appears to be clumping Gli specialisti before The Great Silence, but I don't think he is saying that it actually was shot before.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: moorman on June 26, 2018, 02:08:09 PM
Wise words.
But I value Hossein more than you do, Une Corde is a film which gets better with every viewing. One of the 10 best Spags, and I prefer it slightly to FoD or FaFDM or Django.

TGS is a very underrated film, maybe because Corbucci made too much crap, filmed too often under his possibilities. But in his best films he made very daring films with some brilliant directing. Leone's weaker films are now praised world wide for the simple fact that they were made by Leone, while Corbucci is a director only known by insiders.

But that happens all the time in art history.

Everything you said is true.  Its exactly the reason why Leone is known and he is not.  In fact, If Corbucci JUST made TGS, Django and maybe the Mercenary, his name would've been more known because it would've been attached to better work.  Django is not a bad film either.  My only problem with the Mercenary is I don't particularly like the lighter themed sphagetti westerns.

As far as Robert's film, i believe I will like it more and more over time.  I liked it the first time but I kept comparing it to those other two films I mentioned.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: stanton on June 27, 2018, 04:31:29 AM
I think under its light looking surface The Mercenary is as cynical as TGS and Django. And also similar violent, even if not everything is visible.
And just like in TGS he plays with the audience's expectations, and where TGS does not end like expected Il mercenario does not end where it is expected, and Corbucci does this 2 times, and by this series of endings turns the film's content from head to toe, from a positive ending to a pessimistic one.

For me Il mercenario is doubtless together with TGS Corbucci's masterpiece, and the 3rd and 4th best Spagie,  after the 2 by that other director (which name I just can't remember).
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: Jordan Krug on June 27, 2018, 03:57:24 PM
I think under its light looking surface The Mercenary is as cynical as TGS and Django. And also similar violent, even if not everything is visible.
And just like in TGS he plays with the audience's expectations, and where TGS does not end like expected Il mercenario does not end where it is expected, and Corbucci does this 2 times, and by this series of endings turns the film's content from head to toe, from a positive ending to a pessimistic one.

For me Il mercenario is doubtless together with TGS Corbucci's masterpiece, and the 3rd and 4th best Spagie,  after the 2 by that other director (which name I just can't remember).

The only issue I have with the mercenary is some of the editing, it's a little sloppy in places.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: cigar joe on June 27, 2018, 05:50:08 PM
I think under its light looking surface The Mercenary is as cynical as TGS and Django. And also similar violent, even if not everything is visible.
And just like in TGS he plays with the audience's expectations, and where TGS does not end like expected Il mercenario does not end where it is expected, and Corbucci does this 2 times, and by this series of endings turns the film's content from head to toe, from a positive ending to a pessimistic one.

For me Il mercenario is doubtless together with TGS Corbucci's masterpiece, and the 3rd and 4th best Spagie,  after the 2 by that other director (which name I just can't remember).

You know I just re-watched most of the Zapata Westerns, and the one that I've upped my estimation of the most this go round was Damiano Damiani's A Bullet For The General, he should have made more Westerns.
Title: Re: Une corde, un Colt... aka Cemetery Without Crosses (1969)
Post by: stanton on June 28, 2018, 04:22:53 AM
The only issue I have with the mercenary is some of the editing, it's a little sloppy in places.

Where?