Sergio Leone Web Board

Films of Sergio Leone => Other Films => Topic started by: titoli on October 06, 2006, 03:45:26 PM



Title: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: titoli on October 06, 2006, 03:45:26 PM
http://www.spaghettiwestern.altervista.org/paga_sartana.htm

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0065499/


I have to finish watching it yet, still the undeniable fact is that, exactly as when I watched it as a kid, I could sit through this stuff for hours. I like Garko, dressed like he his, for the opposite reasons why I don't like Arthur Kennedy: he's photogenic, the other, while a better actor, isn't. I like the cutting cards, I like the uninterrupted turning of tables, Sartana's omniscience, his being always one step ahead of the others. Actually, though the narrative pace is fast, you would want it to be faster, as in a slapstick.
The music is nothing worth remembering: Nicolai has done better things.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Sanjuro on October 06, 2006, 04:04:16 PM
While the melody is not so memorable as Adios Sabata, the tune itself holds an excitement.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Banjo on October 07, 2006, 01:48:14 AM
I think its a fantastically cool  Nicolai score,one of his best in fact, and  was used again for the first Shanghai Joe film :)


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Sanjuro on October 07, 2006, 03:06:39 AM
If my memory is correct, this music is one of Firecracker's favorites. 


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Banjo on October 07, 2006, 03:26:37 AM
If my memory is correct, this music is one of Firecracker's favorites. 
I think he may be using this for his next movie And The Crows Will Dig Your Grave? ::)


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Sanjuro on October 07, 2006, 03:27:55 AM
I think he may be using this for his next movie And The Crows Will Dig Your Grave? ::)

That's right! He told me about it too.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 07, 2006, 02:21:07 PM

The music is nothing worth remembering: Nicolai has done better things.

I know opinions differ but how can you make such negative comments about this great piece of work?

http://members.home.nl/mirandadidll/muziek/have%20a%20nice%20funeral%20my%20friend%20sartana%20will%20pay.mp3

I guarantee anybody who listens to this (on this site) will love it or at least enjoy it.

As for the film, yes it's a very fun, ashame Carnimeo never made more then 4 Sartana sequels. I say "Have a good funeral" is the second best of the whole Sartana series.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: titoli on October 07, 2006, 03:24:36 PM
Opinions differ. That's why we have forums. You can say that Leone is not the best SW director, so why can't I say that the main theme for They Call Him Cemetery is much better  than this one? Or do we always have to say that everything is good and, consequently, everything is bad?


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 07, 2006, 03:39:29 PM
Opinions differ. That's why we have forums. You can say that Leone is not the best SW director, so why can't I say that the main theme for They Call Him Cemetery is much better  than this one? Or do we always have to say that everything is good and, consequently, everything is bad?

I never said Leone is not the best SW director. I have only complained that many don't even consider trying to watch quality films from his contemporaries because they have only heard that they are not on par with him. That's snobbery (and ignorance) at it's worst if you ask me.

I do realize opinions differ, hence my first sentence on my last post, but to say that the score is nothing special is just strange to me.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 07, 2006, 03:44:35 PM
so why can't I say that the main theme for They Call Him Cemetery is much better  than this one?

You can say what you want, but you never made this too clear on your last post. All you said was that the "Have a good funeral..." score was not worth remembering. Can't I defend it?


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: titoli on October 07, 2006, 04:27:46 PM
I seem to remember (so don't say again I don't read what you have to say: the problem is that I don't have time to read "everything" you write. And you write a spate) that you wrote that some of his contemporaries sometimes "surpassed" him. That may have a reason to be in a forum not dedicated to SW like this, to provoke a reaction. But here I must take you literally.   
About the soundtrack, fact is I don't remember it at all while I remember the Cemetery one. The score of Funeral is (highly) competent, but not memorable.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 07, 2006, 04:37:44 PM
that you wrote that some of his contemporaries sometimes "surpassed" him.

My comment was not made clear I guess...

I meant to say that they surpassed him in some instances (and I believe they did, it's not to provoke anybodies reaction since most on here can't have much of an opinion about other sw directors).


As for the "you ignoring me" comment, it certainly seemed that way a few months ago. I directed questions at you many times only for to ignore them time and time again treating me as if I never existed. I found it offensive that's all.

and I openly apologise for the "very rude" comment I left you as a PM some time ago.

If it was all just a misunderstanding I'm willing to accept it. In fact I haven't had a problem with you in a very long time and want to keep it that way. You were very unpleasant the first few months I was here though. I don't harbour any contempt anymore and with that said neither should you. I'm not out to get you. I just want to get along.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: titoli on October 07, 2006, 05:03:57 PM
Quote
I meant to say that they surpassed him in some instances (and I believe they did, it's not to provoke anybodies reaction since most on here can't have much of an opinion about other sw directors).

Can you give some example?

About the rest, I was referring simply to the fact that a while ago you "accused" me (quite jokingly) of not reading your posts. Which is not true. The fact is that I have to be selective because I can't read everything everybody writes for a question of time and interest. But on topics I care about I usually read what everybody writes, expecially if his messages are kept not very long.
About the first period of your permanence here, I wanted to make sure first you were not a troll. Second, you were writing too much and  didn't want to begin an intense correspondence with you: no time for that, sorry. Also, I don't want to have things imposed on me: sometimes I make questions to other posters but if they don't think they want to answer is just as good.  I don't have it against them for such trifles. I think (I have already said that) that some of you (expecially the younger forumists) make too much of what we write (or don't) on these boards. That's why we never had a problem and never will. What problem can one have just by writing on a board? The problems are all in one's mind.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 07, 2006, 05:13:18 PM


 I don't have it against them for such trifles. I think (I have already said that) that some of you (expecially the younger forumists) make too much of what we write (or don't) on these boards. That's why we never had a problem and never will. What problem can one have just by writing on a board? The problems are all in one's mind.


Agreed, but you ignored me to the extreme (countless questions and several pms), extreme enough to come off rude (I'm sure you can understand this).

But your right, it's only the internet and not to be taken seriously. I'm fairly new to internet forums (It may be noticeable) and it took some time to get that into my head.


I'll give examples as to Leone's contemporaries in a few minutes (perhaps an hour or more) as I have to leave for a moment.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 07, 2006, 05:46:39 PM
Can you give some example?



certainly. I'll only give a few since my posts won't be read by many anyway (not a crack at you but at others who don't bother with Italian western threads)...




I think we can all put our biasts away when saying that most  non-Leone spaghetti westerns are better then anything "A fistful of dollars" has to offer.
The examples here are obvious.


In "for a few dollars more" most all the action sequences in the film have to be a standard showdown (two characters or more standing on opposite ends of a room or terrain staring at each other until one party decides to fire), couldn't Leone have been a bit more innovative? His contemporaries sure were. Not every action sequence in a Corbucci movie had to consist of two characters taking ten minutes to fire at each other.
After Eastwood's showdown with the three residents of Agua Caliente is finished the novelty of Leone's showdown wears off. As is evident with the Van Cleef versus Kinski showdown. How many more of these do we have to see?
Then there is the unoriginal but satisfying (mainly because there isn't a showdown in sight) shoot out near the climax of the film. Both the Colonal and Eastwood each use tactics, that would feel right at home in a roadrunner cartoon, to eliminate Indio's henchmen. Each has their own UNcreative way of dispatching the baddies (Eastwood with his "poncho decoy in a coat rack"). There is a similar sequence in "Johnny Yuma" (as much as I would hate to defend it because I really don't like the film too much) where the hero is sneaking around and taking out the baddies with creative and well thought out gunplay in a similar set.

In another spaghetti western, perhaps "The Specialist" is a good example, you'll find fast paced and well edited action sequence consisting of the hero taking out several baddies from all sides. This is not found in the pre-climax shoot out in FAFDM.
Then of course there is the wonderful showdown at the end between LVC and Volonte. While all of Leone's climatic showdowns are heart stopping you can't help but think how you would react to these scenes without Morricone's music? They most certainly wouldn't be heart stopping or ground breaking that's for sure if not for the Maestro's magic touch.
A lot of italian directors were lacking in the music department so they opted to kill the villain in a very creative fashion.

As is seen in Tonino's Valerii's "The Taste of Killing"

As is seen in Giancarlo Parolini's "If you meet Sartana, pray for your death"

As seen in Carlo Lizzani's "Kill and Pray"

(more examples to come...)

Leone just settled to kill the main villain in the same fashion he killed the henchmen.




"The Good, the Bad and the Ugly" suffers from the same problems as FAFDM does.
You would think Leone would try to top his Agua Caliente shoot out sequence in the Bombed out town shoot out scene but sadly that doesn't take place.
The set is remarkable but it isn't used to it's fullest extent.
We just get a satifying but standard shootout. Bad guys pop out of corners the heroes plug them just before they can shoot (yawn).
Another director (Giuliano Carnimeo or perhaps Giancarlo Santi) would have used the sets tall buildings to have his actors (or stuntmen rather) perform fabulous stunts and falls. What does Leone give us when Eastwood shoots a henchman from the roof of a building? A half assed cutaway shot a guy falling onto the sandy street. No style, no excitment.

Think of the opening in "The Grand Duel" and you'll see what he should have attempted to do (of course in his own masterful way).

I think this is a sufficent amount of examples for now.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: titoli on October 07, 2006, 07:47:04 PM
You're watching the tree but missing the forest.
Of course the Leone's movies wouldn't be what they are without Morricone's music, but who chose Morricone in the first place? And who gave Morricone directions about what kind of music to compose? And who picked the single tunes among  those Morricone offered to Leone? And who was the director with whom Morricone gave his best? And why so?
About the non creativity of some of Leone's scenes I can agree (the final duel in Agua CAliente is duplicated in GBU and OUTW). Still I dare you to find in  all the SW (and also American Western) a scene that can be compared  to the final duel in FOD: I have known that scene for more than 40 years and I'm still thrilled each time I see it. Sure, most of te effect is because of Morricone's score: but how come the other directors who worked with him couldn't emulate it? Only Leone was able to emulate himself with the successive 3 duels. Not a mean feat, I'd say. The Specialist I have seen a pair of weeks ago and can't remember distinctly the scene you're referring to. That could mean I don't have good memory, But could also mean it is not particularly significant (actually I remember better the final duel Adorf Hallyday). Is it better than many Leone scenes? Maybe, or even probably.  But we see repeatedly Leone's movies for his best moments, not for the bad ones. And that somebody may have been able to do better than him in his worst moments it is not as significant as the fact that nobody could emulate his best: here lies the difference between your approach and mine.   
About Van Cleef vs. Kinsky, what do I care  about the way they shoot at each other when they have that great dialogue before? Do you find many dialogues like that in other SW? I can't remember none.
Sure, the Colonel and Eastwood get rid awkwardly of the gang. But the final duel? I mean, I wouldn't trade it for all of John Ford and Howard Hawks filmography, not to mention Corbucci's. This is not only a question of music. Corbucci worked with Morricone and had that wonderful music for the Mercenary: still I can't find a single scene in Corbucci's movie that even remotely approaches one of Leone's as to rhythm or intensity. Not everything in Leone is first class, but when he is good he's not even remotely approached by honest artisans like Corbucci or Sollima or Petroni. They don't have his sense of composition, his sense of rhythm, the ear for dialogues. To find Leone's betters you need to turn to the great ones of cinema like Fellini or Welles.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 07, 2006, 08:10:50 PM
You're watching the tree but missing the forest.
Of course the Leone's movies wouldn't be what they are without Morricone's music, but who chose Morricone in the first place? And who gave Morricone directions about what kind of music to compose? And who picked the single tunes among  those Morricone offered to Leone? And who was the director with whom Morricone gave his best? And why so?
About the non creativity of some of Leone's scenes I can agree (the final duel in Agua CAliente is duplicated in GBU and OUTW). Still I dare you to find in  all the SW (and also American Western) a scene that can be compared  to the final duel in FOD: I have known that scene for more than 40 years and I'm still thrilled each time I see it. Sure, most of te effect is because of Morricone's score: but how come the other directors who worked with him couldn't emulate it? Only Leone was able to emulate himself with the successive 3 duels. Not a mean feat, I'd say. The Specialist I have seen a pair of weeks ago and can't remember distinctly the scene you're referring to. That could mean I don't have good memory, But could also mean it is not particularly significant (actually I remember better the final duel Adorf Hallyday). Is it better than many Leone scenes? Maybe, or even probably.  But we see repeatedly Leone's movies for his best moments, not for the bad ones. And that somebody may have been able to do better than him in his worst moments it is not as significant as the fact that nobody could emulate his best: here lies the difference between your approach and mine.   
About Van Cleef vs. Kinsky, what do I care  about the way they shoot at each other when they have that great dialogue before? Do you find many dialogues like that in other SW? I can't remember none.
Sure, the Colonel and Eastwood get rid awkwardly of the gang. But the final duel? I mean, I wouldn't trade it for all of John Ford and Howard Hawks filmography, not to mention Corbucci's. This is not only a question of music. Corbucci worked with Morricone and had that wonderful music for the Mercenary: still I can't find a single scene in Corbucci's movie that even remotely approaches one of Leone's as to rhythm or intensity. Not everything in Leone is first class, but when he is good he's not even remotely approached by honest artisans like Corbucci or Sollima or Petroni. They don't have his sense of composition, his sense of rhythm, the ear for dialogues. To find Leone's betters you need to turn to the great ones of cinema like Fellini or Welles.


The dialogue between Kinski and LVC is nothing special (to me). I can think of many other instances in a Leone that betters that piece of dialogue.

"Small world isn't it?"

"yes and very very bad"


pretty elementary if you ask me

Non-leone sw have done better.

Must I really give examples?


...fine...


The dialogue in "The Grand Duel" alone can match and surpass that of FAFDM Kinski versus LVC scene. Pretty much every scene is littered with the same machismo talk as the scene you mention (but In my opinion is better).


But then again neither leone or Santi ever wrote their own dialogue anyway so...this arguement should have never been brought up.



As for "The Specialist", I'm not pointing out one particular scene but all the shoot outs (which there are few and far between). Well paced action and frenetic editing. Good stuff.


As for the climax of FOD, I agree one of the best (if not the best) scenes Leone directed(too bad the rest of the film is not even half as good). But off hand I can say that the opening to both "if you meet Sartana pray for your death" and "Light the fuse... sartana is coming" is on par with that scene or maybe even better.



If you classify sw as B-movies then you will have a biased against them. You will see them as "not worthy" of other more "sophisticated" films. I don't believe in such talk. If that makes me a neanderthal then so be it.

I give each film I watch the same amount of attention I give a Fellini, or Leone film. I don't discriminate.

I used to see B-movies, c-movies, etc. as unworthy pieces of garbage and only hailed the "masters" Fellini, Ford, Eisenstein, Godard,Truffaut, Bergman, etc.
This was me being ignorant. This was me being biased.
I try not to be that way anymore (though I still make my mistakes).




Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Silenzio on October 07, 2006, 08:19:56 PM


As for the climax of FOD, I agree one of the best (if not the best) scenes Leone directed(too bad the rest of the film is not even half as good). But off hand I can say that the opening to both "if you meet Sartana pray for your death" and "Light the fuse... sartana is coming" is on par with that scene or maybe even better.




One of the best scenes Leone directed? I don't think so. Definitely the best scene in the film, but not one of the best Leone directed. I find the showdowns in all of his other Westerns to be far superior.

I don't think that main villains need to be killed in an "innovative" or "cool" way to make it better. With the more minor villains or henchmen, I agree that this might make it a little more enjoyable. But a bare-bones spaghetti showdown I think is the best way to kill off a main villain. The prologned preceedings of an act of violence are one of the highlights of Leone's films for me.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 07, 2006, 08:30:33 PM
One of the best scenes Leone directed? I don't think so. Definitely the best scene in the film, but not one of the best Leone directed. I find the showdowns in all of his other Westerns to be far superior.




The only thing that makes the others superior is Morricone's music. The Final confrontation in FOD doesn't rely on that (except for the first 2 minutes but that isn't even the exciting part).

The duels at the end of FAFDM and GBU are only phenomenal because of the music.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 07, 2006, 08:36:20 PM


I don't think that main villains need to be killed in an "innovative" or "cool" way to make it better. With the more minor villains or henchmen, I agree that this might make it a little more enjoyable.


Isn't ENJOYING a picture what a movie is all about?
Cinema is mostly for escapism, not to make a political point or to be an artsy fartsy.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Silenzio on October 07, 2006, 08:44:17 PM

Isn't ENJOYING a picture what a movie is all about?
Cinema is mostly for escapism, not to make a political point or to be an artsy fartsy.

When i said "this might make it more enjoyable" I meant that it might make it more enjoyable just when they kill off those little henchmen, you pointed out one of the flaws of FAFDM.

but, when it comes to the main villains, I would much more enjoy those showdowns. Instead of having the hero shoot a champagne bottle that makes the cork pop out which hits a hat stand and falls, thus making one of the bowling balls on top of a book case become dislodged and fall onthe ground, shaking the chandelier and make it fall on the villain.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 07, 2006, 08:47:32 PM


but, when it comes to the main villains, I would much more enjoy those showdowns. Instead of having the hero shoot a champagne bottle that makes the cork pop out which hits a hat stand and falls, thus making one of the bowling balls on top of a book case become dislodged and fall onthe ground, shaking the chandelier and make it fall on the villain.

This isn't a comedy hour. It's an sw.
The movies I mentioned in "interesting ways to kill a villain" section of my post all involve a showdown.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Silenzio on October 07, 2006, 08:49:38 PM
This isn't a comedy hour. It's an sw.
The movies I mentioned in "interesting ways to kill a villain" section of my post all involve a showdown.

I was exaggerating (a lot).  What I really mean is that Leone's showdowns don't require an interesting way to kill a villain. But, as I'm guessing you will say, that's because the phenomenal music compensates.

And you'll have to excuse my lack of SW knowledge sometimes.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 07, 2006, 08:52:48 PM
I was exaggerating (a lot).  What I really mean is that Leone's showdowns don't require an interesting way to kill a villain. But, as I'm guessing you will say, that's because the phenomenal music compensates.

correctomundo.
Why is this so hard to understand?


Quote
And you'll have to excuse my lack of SW knowledge sometimes.
Quote

I won't. you have a seen a fair amount to more or less get what the genre is about though it has many transformation you have yet to experience.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Silenzio on October 07, 2006, 08:58:00 PM
correctomundo.
Why is this so hard to understand?


I won't. you have a seen a fair amount to more or less get what the genre is about though it has many transformation you have yet to experience.

I know what the genre is all about, but i won't feel I'm with the big boys until I've seen the spaghettis I ordered and the Sartana movies you've sent me. I'm so excited.

But, the thing is, all of those examples you provided in that one post, I don't know what you're talking about because I've never seen any of those films.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 07, 2006, 09:04:40 PM
I know what the genre is all about, but i won't feel I'm with the big boys until I've seen the spaghettis I ordered and the Sartana movies you've sent me. I'm so excited.



Things get a bit different later on. Not everybody is a Corbucci or a Sollima and that is not a bad thing.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Silenzio on October 07, 2006, 09:06:43 PM

Things get a bit different later on. Not everybody is a Corbucci or a Sollima, and that is not a bad thing.

The Sartana movies are actually what I'm excited the most about, because those will be the most "hardcore" spaghetti's I've ever seen. All of the other spaghetti's I've seen are ones I could easily acquire from Netflix/the local rental shop (Great Silence, Bullet for the General, Companeros, Run man run, Sabata, Navajo Joe, etc.)


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: titoli on October 07, 2006, 09:54:06 PM
Quote
Cinema is mostly for escapism


The fact that you're spending much time posting here proves you wrong.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 07, 2006, 09:59:48 PM


The fact that you're spending much time posting here proves you wrong.
Vague comments don't help your arguement.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: titoli on October 07, 2006, 10:13:29 PM
I wasn't aware to be vague.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 07, 2006, 10:20:28 PM
I wasn't aware to be vague.

Then you could elaborate.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: cigar joe on October 07, 2006, 10:41:07 PM
Quote
have only complained that many don't even consider trying to watch quality films from his contemporaries because they have only heard that they are not on par with him. That's snobbery (and ignorance) at it's worst if you ask me.

Actually its truth  ;D


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Silenzio on October 07, 2006, 10:46:50 PM
Titoli, you were being vague, in the purest sense. Can you explain a little?

First of all, cinema is mainly about escapism, to me. It's about escaping into the world that the director has created for you. That's why I stress a lot on the atmosphere of a film. Film's with such a wonderful atmosphere (like OUATITW) are easier to escape into, and they're just as enjoyable as some action-packed film.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...p
Post by: titoli on October 08, 2006, 12:19:28 PM
If it's pure escapism, then you escape temporarily from reality. You don't take the movie with you, don't ruminate about it, don't care about particulars. The experience ends then and there with the vision.  I thought this was autoexplanatory. I was wrong. Sorry.

 And about granting a b-movie the same degree of attention I concede to  a great movie, that depends on the watcher.  I don't think I need the same degree of attention to watch 8 1\2 or Marienbad that I  need to watch Titanic or Pretty Woman. Exactly as I need a different kind of concentration to read Dante's Inferno  from the one needed to read a comic book. If you don't establish difference as to how you absorb different kinds of movies then you are not discriminating. That means that watching a Fellini movie or your father's home movies is for you the same thing. I think it isn't, though I can easily understand that the argument was brought forth by the apologetes of the B-Movies that pretend to make me believe that there are no valid aesthetic cathegories at all and that the only rule to follow is the one of one's taste, however rough that may be.





 


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...p
Post by: The Firecracker on October 08, 2006, 12:54:35 PM


 And about granting a b-movie the same degree of attention I concede to  a great movie, that depends on the watcher.  I don't think I need the same degree of attention to watch 8 1\2 or Marienbad that I  need to watch Titanic or Pretty Woman. Exactly as I need a different kind of concentration to read Dante's Inferno  from the one needed to read a comic book. If you don't establish difference as to how you absorb different kinds of movies then you are not discriminating. That means that watching a Fellini movie or your father's home movies is for you the same thing. I think it isn't, though I can easily understand that the argument was brought forth by the apologetes of the B-Movies that pretend to make me believe that there are no valid aesthetic cathegories at all and that the only rule to follow is the one of one's taste, however rough that may be.





 

It's discrimination when you already walk into a movie expecting a crap fest.

"Consider the facts seven times before you suspect someone." -Japanese Proverb

I give the same amount of a attention when watching "Buon funerale, amigos!...paga Sartana!" that I do watching "Satyricon". When both films have been viewed by me I then place them in their own catergories. I don't just go right in and say "okay..."Have a good funeral" is going to be good but certainly not as thought provoking as Fellini's "Satyricon" which will bring the cinematic pompous out of me. Therefore the Sartana movie is nothing more then mindless fun...okay I'm ready to watch".

If you walk in like this you carry that  prejudice (that pre-conception) of the film and later you may find (or rather not find) that you missed something in the movie. In fact I gurantee you will hate an aspect of it that you may have liked only if you walked in with the same expectations as the Fellini film.



And I don't consider my father's home movies (or anybody elses) "cinema". 


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Banjo on October 09, 2006, 06:16:40 AM
Actually its truth  ;D
It would only be the truth if Corbucci,Sollima,Parolini,Barboni etc were trying to make a Leone sw because undeniably Leone was the best at doing his own thing.But equally those other Italian directors all had their own distinctive styles which they brought to the genre and i have grave doubts whether Leone could've made a Django or Great Silence.
To make a judgement as to who made the best quality sw's is pretty pointless as it is impossible to measure  except perhaps in terms of enjoyment so is therefore down to personal preference.
You never hear suggestions that non-Ford westerns were inferior,so why build up Leone so much and disregard his Italian contemporaries who have contributed their own brand of equally valid talents.
   Some people would say that no-one could play rock guitar like Hendrix but Hendrix couldn't have played jazz like John McLaughlin who in turn couldn't have played country picking style as well as Albert Lee.Can you really so who was the best guitar player out of these?
No,they all had their own style and were best at what they did ;)


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Arizona Colt on October 09, 2006, 12:18:44 PM
Wow. What an interesting episode of GERALDO this would have made-flying chairs and all!

I find it interesting the use of the word B MOVIE by some of the people here, people who although I don't know personally seem to have personal as well as social issues. These same individuals seem to think if the films they watch aren't a 2000 calorie diet of brain food then they have severely starved themselves for the day. This is not an insult just an observation because I've dealt with people like this before not just in the movies they watch but in other daily activities.


In an earlier post someone made some unkind comments about NAVAJO JOE, a fine and entertaining SW. A movie that didn't pretend to be anything more than escapist entertainment but said person felt the need to look at it from the perspective that ALL MOVIES ARE SUPPOSED TO BE HIGH ART. I could care less if what Reynolds wears is authentic or not. If all he had was a tomahawk and a feather I would still assume he was an indian as I'm not a professor of native american dress as some seem to be.

I guess also I should dismiss all my favorite fantasy films like VALLEY OF GWANGI (a western with dinosaurs!) with effects by the revered Ray Harryhausen because the dinosaurs featured are not anatomically accurate or any of the SINBAD films because those things simply never existed.

Does this mean nobody should enjoy a flick that allows there imagination to run wild for 2 hours?

These same hypocrites champion movies by a man who seldom journeyed into realism in the first place!

Anyways, for those that don't know (and it seems many do not) a B MOVIE was the second feature of a double bill usually filmed on left over money from the first feature. The 2nd flick rarely, if ever, got the attention that the first film did in all aspects of the filmmaking process. The co feature, or B FILM, was just an added attraction to give the public some extra bang for the buck. A similar example would be old 45s. The A side was the "hit single" and the B side was the throwaway. Many of you can attest that often times the B SIDE overshadowed the A SIDE.

Also, some of you here seem to miss the fact that since Leone was first to demonstrate the new style of violent western that naturally he will be revered as an auteur since he essentially started the whole cycle so why should 100 other directors go and do the same thing?

Nearly all these movies were seriously low budget and the directors had to work within those parameters so any innovation or creativity in spite of there budget should be noted and appreciated. Leone didn't have a large amount of money with his first film and Corbucci didn't have lots of cash for DJANGO but Corbucci was extemely innovative in his approach and thus once he proved himself was also getting large budgets for his other films but I seem to remember a films budget has nothing TO DO WITH ENTERTAINMENT VALUE!!!

When I sit down to watch a flick I generally have some preconception of what I'm getting into.

If I'm watching a SW I hope to see gunfights (well done hopefully) some decent music cues (and HAVE A GOOD FUNERAL...has an excellent love theme BTW), and some plot twists.

If I'm watching a kung fu movie I hope to see good fights, sets (Shaw Brs. always had the most beautiful sets since early hollywood days), plot twists, etc...

Horror flicks I hope for some good attempts at suspense at the very least or decent make up effects.

If any or all these are met then I'm happy as well as entertained but if certain ones meet all these criteria or make an effort of it I will note it.

These other SWs regardless of technical proficiency should not be compared to Leones work as they for the most part take different approaches to the subject matter although some directors do ape his style and did it very well Giancarlo Santi with GRAND DUEL for example. The openig and closing duels are very reminescent of Leones style and Santi did an admirable imitation (the best form of flattery) of his films whether you think these others as GRAVEL PITTERS or not which I don't remember seeing any gravel or pits.

Oh, and I didn't spend the entire day typing this tirade. It took about thirty minutes, I type fast! ;D


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: cigar joe on October 09, 2006, 09:03:19 PM
wow what an impressive amount of verbal diarrhea, you obviously need to get a life. And I'm glad you are using paragraphs now. ;D

As a Western Navajo Joe sucks, plain & simple, but its obviously entertaining to mindless cretins, I've met people like you before in other daily activities.  ;D

You my friend look at SW's from the perspective that they are MEARLY ESCAPIST ENTERTAINMENT, rather than acknowledge that some escaped the realm of mortal directors and achieved GREATNESS.  8)

I could care less that you could care less if what you think what Reynolds wears is authentic. I sure that if he had worn a dress that would ok with you as long as it was escapistly entertaining.  :P

You can enjoy any wildly imaginative film you like, for as long as you like. I'm not stopping you.  ;)

When I sit down to watch a Western, I expect it to fit into certian universaly preconcieved parameters. A true Western should have the landscape as an essential part of its composition, with plausibly believable charaters interacting with realistic weaponry upon that landscape that depicts the Western part of the North American Continent circa late 1800's early 1900's.  8)

A gravel pit is not a landscape.  ::)

Westerns that don't fit the above are hyphenated Westerns, ie., Fantasy-Westerns, SiFi- esterns, Horror-Westerns, Mystical-Westerns, etc., etc., and they are fine in their own right and have their own merits and they should be judged in their own categories. So if they all have their own style judge them by the categories they fit, and let their styles and stories be the factors debated.  ;)


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 09, 2006, 09:12:07 PM
wow what an impressive amount of verbal diarrhea, you obviously need to get a life. And I'm glad you are using paragraphs now. ;D


Let's not resort to name calling here Joe. AC brought some very valid points to the table here whilst you have only brought insults.

There is no indication that AC needs to get a life (if anything I need one from being on here most of my time) since he is hardly on here to begin with. His preferences to films don't indicate whether he has a life or not either. Your comments were immature.

Let's keep this half way civil.


P.S. and I guess most of us are "mindless cretins" because I can name at least 7 active members who enjoy Navajo Joe.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: cigar joe on October 09, 2006, 09:24:39 PM
verbal diarrhea is not calling a name, its a "description".

These are not insuts?

Quote
These same individuals seem to think if the films they watch aren't a 2000 calorie diet of brain food then they have severely starved themselves for the day. This is not an insult just an observation because I've dealt with people like this before not just in the movies they watch but in other daily activities.

Quote
but said person felt the need to look at it from the perspective that ALL MOVIES ARE SUPPOSED TO BE HIGH ART.

and....

Quote
These same hypocrites champion movies by a man who seldom journeyed into realism in the first place!

"hypocrites" I think the name calling was started by AC.



Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 09, 2006, 09:30:34 PM
verbal diarrhea is not calling a name, its a "description".

These are not insuts?

and....

"hypocrites" I think the name calling was started by AC.



There is a bit of a difference. AC didn't mention any names. That could be anybody.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: cigar joe on October 09, 2006, 09:40:47 PM
If you noticed I punctuated everying (tongue in cheek so to speak) with a smiley face.  ;D

"you my friend" wasn't mentioning any names either.... 8), it could be refering to anybody even you.  ;D


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 09, 2006, 09:44:22 PM
If you noticed I punctuated everying (tongue in cheek so to speak) with a smiley face.  ;D

"you my friend" wasn't mentioning any names either.... 8), it could be refering to anybody even you.  ;D

gangrene is eating my leg away, not my eyes...

 we all know who you were referring to here. Even a blind man can see it just by reading your post.

and a smiley faced  emoticon means nothing after you basically said "go fuck your mother" in so many words.



Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: cigar joe on October 09, 2006, 09:46:30 PM
you, you know nothing of cigar joe  ;D


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Arizona Colt on October 09, 2006, 10:58:31 PM
Where do you hail marlboro joe? English is my native tongue although I do speak decent mandarin chinese I don't believe 'insut', 'certian' and best of all 'preconcieved' (i before e except after c!) ::) are actual words of the english language, close BUT NO CIGAR! ;D ;D ;D

Wow, so I've a bad case of verbal diarrhea? Being a MINDLESS CRETIN as you so called me, is vastly preferable to a sniveling, ego minded, self centered, hypocritical little man who apparently is lacking in certain areas and in order to feel better than everyone else gets emblazoned with superiority when he views an obscure piece of high art (not denouncing a classic whether I've seen it or not I do respect the masters and do give respect where it is do unlike YOU!).

Then, said person overhears several friends talking about the GOOD TIME THEY HAD AT THE CINEMA over the weekend seeing whatever MINDLESS CRETINS such as myself watch all the while saying to himself---"THEY ARE SO BENEATH ME! ONE DAY WHEN I HAVE REACHED MY PHYSICAL ZENITH AND BECOME LIGHT IN THE COSMOS THEY'LL STILL BE NOTHING!" :D I AM GREATNESS PLAIN & SIMPLE! :) ;) :D ;D

The only thing is, said person is the only one around to hear himself speak! :) He has no friends to talk to about the high art just witnessed!  ;) It doesn't matter, one day said person will achieve greatness becoming light in the cosmos ::) spreading his intellectual garbage throughout the universe! :) ;) :D ;D


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 09, 2006, 11:03:21 PM
You see where this has gotten to CJ? This will continue.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Arizona Colt on October 09, 2006, 11:22:32 PM
Oh, regardless of what you may think NAVAJO JOE does not suck although I know some who think CIGAR JOE does! :D  :o :-X

Is this the sequel where the indian character realizes he's been such a fool for not being historically accurate and tries to make amends and only work for true artisans? Damn that Corbucci and his great action set pieces and that great Morricone score although WHO IS HE without Sergio "the one & only" Leone guiding him? ;D

These smileys sure are fun for mindless cretins like myself. I see why you enjoy employing there use so much! :) ;) :D ;D


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Banjo on October 10, 2006, 02:59:22 AM
When I sit down to watch a Western, I expect it to fit into certian universaly preconcieved parameters. A true Western should have the landscape as an essential part of its composition, with plausibly believable charaters interacting with realistic weaponry upon that landscape that depicts the Western part of the North American Continent circa late 1800's early 1900's.  8)
"Universally preconceived parameters"?
Have these been published somewhere or is this just your assumption CJ?
I don't really see a problem with the landscape in 99.9% of westerns unless we are talking about Fantasy Land like the finale of Blazing Saddles but surely in most cases westerns are a complete fantasy especially Sergio Leone.You can throw in as much authentic weaponry,costumes,sets etc as you like but all reality falls flat on its face with the totally IMPLAUSIBLE LARGER THAN LIFE CHARACTERS and the ludicrously UNBELIEVABLE storylines.Do you really think that cowboys used to stand in a triangle for 10 minutes before settling accounts?But who cares as reality is BORING.Arizona Colt,Firecracker and myself you have called deluded but surely you are deluded if you believe that anything Leone ever did resembled what life was really like in the Old West and if you are so fussed about authenticity and realism i'm very surprised that you have a preference for the outlandish(when compared to American) Italian westerns at all.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: cigar joe on October 10, 2006, 04:43:46 AM
Quote
You see where this has gotten to CJ? This will continue.


Not if I don't answer  ;D.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 10, 2006, 07:51:49 AM
"Universally preconceived parameters"?
Have these been published somewhere or is this just your assumption CJ?
I don't really see a problem with the landscape in 99.9% of westerns unless we are talking about Fantasy Land like the finale of Blazing Saddles but surely in most cases westerns are a complete fantasy especially Sergio Leone.You can throw in as much authentic weaponry,costumes,sets etc as you like but all reality falls flat on its face with the totally IMPLAUSIBLE LARGER THAN LIFE CHARACTERS and the ludicrously UNBELIEVABLE storylines.Do you really think that cowboys used to stand in a triangle for 10 minutes before settling accounts?But who cares as reality is BORING.Arizona Colt,Firecracker and myself you have called deluded but surely you are deluded if you believe that anything Leone ever did resembled what life was really like in the Old West and if you are so fussed about authenticity and realism i'm very surprised that you have a preference for the outlandish(when compared to American) Italian westerns at all.

CJ:

Well at least answer the above.

your logic illudes me as well.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: cigar joe on October 10, 2006, 05:50:23 PM

http://dictionary.laborlawtalk.com/Western_movie#What_a_Western_is

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_movie


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 10, 2006, 07:04:57 PM


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_movie


This doesn't argue any of Banjo's points.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: cigar joe on October 11, 2006, 03:47:39 AM
Quote
This doesn't argue any of Banjo's points.


I couldn't care less.  8)

Quote
Have these been published somewhere or is this just your assumption CJ?

What are these, they pretty much say what I was getting around too.?

http://dictionary.laborlawtalk.com/Western_movie#What_a_Western_is

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_movie


"if it looks like sh*t, smells like sh*t, tastes like sh*t, it must be sh*t.    Old New York Proverb  ;D

Now basta, no mas, I won't address this thread anymore.




Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Banjo on October 11, 2006, 06:51:08 AM
I won't address this thread anymore.
    Whats wrong CJ,losing the argument?  :D
I expected a bit more from you  than just throwing at me parts of an encyclopedia(surely just the opinion of one author who in all probability hasn't watched a sw outside of Leone) and anyway i can't see any do's or don'ts there as regards making a western.Surely like all creative artists the best western directors do not adhere to any rulebook and use the filmaking progress as a sheet of blank canvas to project their own imaginative talents rather than just paint by numbers.
I think if someone had confronted Leone with your "universally pre-conceived parameters" in 1964 i think he would've shoved them up where the sun don't shine ;D


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on October 11, 2006, 12:23:33 PM


I couldn't care less.  8)






But their valid points, more valid than anything you or titoli have brought to the table. If you want to admit defeat just say so.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: titoli on October 11, 2006, 04:51:51 PM
I disagree with CJ about the value of Navajo Joe (which I find entertaining, though with some faults) and about his the value he assigns to many Corbucci's movies, which I find generally exaggerated. At the same time I probably value more than him some funny westerns he finds worthless. That doesn't make us enemies. The same goes with any other forumist' opinions.
Anyway, reading the thread, I find that Banjo has attributed some opinions to CJ that he never expressed. The requisite of realism doesn't emerge in his opinions but only in Banjo's interpretations of it. It is anyway apparent that he likes Westerns with a more pronounced touch of verisimilitude. He underlines the role of landscape (though there have been westerns almost totally shot in interiors, like the one with Fonda and Robards playing poker in a saloon) and that is obvious, as western is a geographical definition.  I think this is a plausible opinion, one may or not share (though to me it seems pat: a western without landscape is not a real western): that doesn't make him a pariah or a mujaddin to shoot at.
About his preferring "plausibly believable characters", that means only that he likes verisimilitude, not realism. It is Banjo who misinterprets him.  It is possible, though improbable, that two characters may stare at each other's eyes for 15 minutes before shooting at each other. Implausible is that an indian may wear a winter costume like that of NJ in the heat. The problem is that, apart from him, only few watchers are aware of that and are disturbed from the circumstance. One can say: blessed ignorance.
Now, as to the B-Movies, I love them. But B-movies they are, including Leone's. I wondered for a long time whether his or Risi's or Monicelli's comedies or some Hitchcock's could be considered commercial fare or plain art. Well, this is my personal opinion, they are not. But this is my opinion. And that depends on my consideration of what Art is. And if Fellini's or Antonioni's best movies are Art, then any Leone's movie can't be, for the same reason that, if Mozart's Don Giovanni or Beethoven's Ninth are Art, Extasy of Gold is not in the same realm (I think Morricone would be the first to admit that). Or, to be more exact, is not Art of the same level.  Actually, Leone's movies (or 007 Connery's movies) entertain me as nothing else, I watched far many more timesI watched any single Fellini's or Antonioni. But every time I watch I vitelloni or 8 and 1\2  I find that I'm discussing with myself about the great questions of Life (and Death), which just doesn't happen with Leone's (not to talk of any lesser practicioner's) entertainments. Now, I can't exclude that somebody (alas, I'm afraid there are many, among non musicians) might think that the Beatles are greater than Bach or Mozart. Or that Stephen King writes better novels than Henry James. But why should one care? I don't. 


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Banjo on October 12, 2006, 02:21:29 AM
Anyway, reading the thread, I find that Banjo has attributed some opinions to CJ that he never expressed. The requisite of realism doesn't emerge in his opinions but only in Banjo's interpretations of it.
I agree that theres not so much evidence in this thread but Cigar Joe(LOL ;)) has expressed such opinions in other similar discussions elsewhere so i haven't misinterpreted CJ at all.
I have a high regard for CJ and his contributions(i don't always agree with his movie reviews but they are always very well written) here and i don't wish to make him a pariah or mujaddin etc.I was merely responding to put downs of certain non-Leone  movies.
As far as i'm concerned we are all friends here with a common interest but we're not always gonna agree which makes for some enjoyable debate :)


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...p
Post by: titoli on October 12, 2006, 06:18:27 AM
Thanx for the civil answer.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Sanjuro on October 12, 2006, 10:23:53 AM

As far as i'm concerned we are all friends here with a common interest but we're not always gonna agree which makes for some enjoyable debate :)

This is certainly one of the best opinions on this board.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Rojo Ramone on April 30, 2009, 09:41:18 AM
So Is SARTANA WILL PAY any good?
The original SARTANA is one of my favourite SWs.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on April 30, 2009, 01:02:52 PM
So Is SARTANA WILL PAY any good?
The original SARTANA is one of my favourite SWs.

It's probably more in keeping with the original since it is the darkest of the sequels.
So yes, you'd probably like it.
If you like the first Sartana you owe it to yourself to watch the rest.
My favorite is the fourth and final with Gianni Garko in the title role (Light The Fuse... Sartana is Coming!).
It is much more light hearted than the previous films but it still has a nasty mean streak (particularly in the first 20 minutes).


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Rojo Ramone on May 04, 2009, 02:12:06 PM
Thanks Firecracker!

If there's only four, I think i'll hunt them all down.



Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on May 04, 2009, 02:27:43 PM
Thanks Firecracker!

If there's only four, I think i'll hunt them all down.




There are actually five.
The last one stars George Hilton in the title role (Sartana Is Here, Trade Your Pistol for A Coffin).


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Rojo Ramone on May 09, 2009, 12:37:25 PM
I discovered that there's a cheap boxset of SARTANA films called SARTANA SAGA vol 2
 With a liittle  sleuthing I found out that some of the films are taken from German releases.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on May 09, 2009, 11:03:10 PM
I discovered that there's a cheap boxset of SARTANA films called SARTANA SAGA vol 2
 With a liittle  sleuthing I found out that some of the films are taken from German releases.
Yeah,
from the spaghetti western bible: Grindhouse experience people.
They put out an earlier edition with the Trinity films being the main pull but they're full of shit.
4 out of 10 movies on that dvd collection weren't even spaghetti westerns.
Typical flimflammery using the "Grindhouse" label to pull in the ignorant Tarantino audience.


I might just pick up this dvd so I don't have to constantly re-burn my dvd-Rs.
Are these in wide screen?


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: cigar joe on May 10, 2009, 10:52:29 AM
Quote
I might just pick up this dvd so I don't have to constantly re-burn my dvd-Rs.
Are these in wide screen?
Curious why do you have to do that?


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on May 10, 2009, 06:08:15 PM
Curious why do you have to do that?

Re-burn dvd-Rs?

They don't last forever. Kinda like VHS tapes.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: moviesceleton on May 11, 2009, 01:19:40 AM
Re-burn dvd-Rs?

They don't last forever. Kinda like VHS tapes.
Yeah, I noticed that some time ago with some CD-Rs. I wonder if there are certain (more expensive?) discs that last longer?


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on May 11, 2009, 02:49:50 PM
I wonder if there are certain (more expensive?) discs that last longer?

Not to my knowledge.

DVDs, themselves, should last forever.
Of course, we'll find out whether or not that is true.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: moviesceleton on May 12, 2009, 02:52:21 AM
Hey, what about those people who advertise that they will convert your old VHSs and home movies on DVD? Do they make real DVDs or just DVD-Rs? Maybe you could make your DVD-Rs into reals DVDs. But I'm not sure if it would be cheaper than buying a legitimate DVD...


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: cigar joe on May 12, 2009, 04:39:11 AM
But if all you have is a DVDr its a reburn of DVDr anyway no? ::) Doesn't the quality of the subject then decline with each reburn?


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: moviesceleton on May 12, 2009, 08:34:47 AM
But if all you have is a DVDr its a reburn of DVDr anyway no? ::) Doesn't the quality of the subject then decline with each reburn?
I'm not sure. Isn't the great thing about digital media supposed to be that there is no loss of data (unlike with analog media e.g. VHS and cassette tape)?


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: Rojo Ramone on May 12, 2009, 02:17:23 PM
Are these in wide screen?
[/quote]



I read that some are but not all...it's kind of a mixed bag.
It will be a few more days before I get it in the mail.


Title: Re: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga
Post by: The Firecracker on May 12, 2009, 07:37:26 PM
But if all you have is a DVDr its a reburn of DVDr anyway no? ::) Doesn't the quality of the subject then decline with each reburn?

Well, it's either reBurn a dvd or have no picture in a few years.