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Films of Sergio Leone => Other Films => Topic started by: cigar joe on November 13, 2006, 11:23:05 PM



Title: Lawman (1971)
Post by: cigar joe on November 13, 2006, 11:23:05 PM
Was at the local video rental place & picked this up to rent on VHS.

All I can say is WOW!

Here is another great American Western that slipped under my radar. 

Where to start, Dircted by Michael Winner, starring Burt Lancaster in whats got to be the best Western I've seen him in so far, with Robert Ryan, Lee J. Cobb, Robert Duval, Albert Salmi, Ralph Waite, JD Cannon, John McGiver, John Hillerman, Wilford Brimley and Sheree North in whats gotta be the biggest & best role I've seen her in. Plus a great supporting cast of all good actors in realistic parts.

This is sort of a psycological/action Western hybird with an emphasis on very good action, so its got a lot of dialog but its great dialog that sounds true with a good ear for Western slang.

A guy named Ray Moyer did the set design, and this is another standout of this film, a great job, he is as good as Carlo Simi, I couldn't believe how much detail was crammed into this film. Everything looks spot on, the town set is fantastic, the ranch's are great, interiors highly detailed. Roberto Silva & Herb Westbrook did the Art direction and they deserve mention too.

There is a whore house set thats great it features a crippled gambler/pimp who hobbles about on crutches who is a past friend of Maddox, he has this skull clock sitting on his card table that is a nice touch. All the whores are real looking women not caricatured or dressed overly flashy.
 
The landscape & town sets were all shot in Durango,  Mexico and some of the buttes featured were just beautiful, don't remember seeing these locations before but the rock in the outcrops look similar to those seen in the Magnificent Seven.

The story basically revolves around Bannock Marshall Jared Maddox (Lancaster) a "mankiller" he has the nickname "The Widowmaker". Maddox is after a bunch of drovers who shot up his town during a drunken spree killing an old man. The drovers work for big time cattleman Vincent Bronson (Cobb) near the town of Sabbath, New Mexico.

Maddox has a reputation for being quick on the draw, and always getting his man, we first see him riding into Sabbath with a corpse. He ties up at the Sabbath Marshall Cotton Ryan's (Ryan) office and he tells Ryan what happend and who he's after. Ryan tells him that the men all work for Bronson, and that he'll ride out to the ranch & tell them that Maddox wants to bring them back for trial to Bannock.  Bronson's men decide to tough it out and face Maddox.

This film even has a love interest thats handeled the just the way it should be in that it doesn't detract from or slow down the narrative one iota.

The score is nothing that sticks in head and pretty forgetable, its not an SW , no picaresque charaters or humor, but it does have some SW influenced action as do a lot of the post Leone & Peckinpah films of the 70's.

The ending is worth the price of the DVD which I just ordered. Michael Winner best film, IMO.  8)

Check it out you wont go wrong.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: titoli on November 14, 2006, 01:12:44 AM
It was on an italian national channel a pair of weeks ago. I find incredible that you could miss it all these years. How come?


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: cigar joe on November 14, 2006, 04:56:43 AM
Its never been on TV that I can remember, at least not in regular rotation on AMC possibly on TCM but I've never stumbled across it.

There was a period in the 1970's where I lived without TV so I don't remember any adverts for the film either, you don't hear it mentioned on forums much either, strange.

Lancaster was definitely playing against type in this. If it would have had a Morricone score and a little bit of picaresque humor it and been directed by one of the Sergio's, lol.......


Tell me Titoli did you happen to watch it?


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: titoli on November 14, 2006, 05:51:21 AM
I watched it more than 20 years ago, but over here is aired quite regularly (actually they're airing a lot of half-known AW and also some SW these very days). I had decided to rewatch this time but it passed off my mind caught only the last half hour (when Lancaster takes Duvall prisoner),so I can 't be definite about it. I don't like Cobb's final action, though it is coherent: it should have been off-screen.
It goes hand in hand (they were made in succession) with Valdez is coming and Ulzana's Raid. In Italy the first 2 were given a similar title, making the connection clearer: I Am The Law, I Am Valdez. But maybe Ulzana'ìs Raid (which was aired a few months ago) is just as good.
 


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: cigar joe on November 14, 2006, 03:32:28 PM
When you do watch it again look at the sets I was very impressed.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: titoli on November 15, 2006, 12:53:46 AM
Oh, you know, first I should disintoxicate myself from having watched these days some SW shot near Rome, where you have huts built with bricks and the like...


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: cigar joe on November 15, 2006, 03:25:38 AM
Quote
Oh, you know, first I should disintoxicate myself from having watched these days some SW shot near Rome, where you have huts built with bricks and the like...


lol, well I couldn't believe the copious amounts of detail in the film, behind every actor there is someting interesting to look at , on low camera angles you see ceiling details.  I was also impresed with the large amount of well used supporting characters & extras. It wasn't a cheap production by any means.

This would have been a great role for Lee Van Cleef.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Banjo on November 15, 2006, 05:42:51 AM
I taped this off BBC2 a couple of months back and enjoyed it immensely-some great action and an intriguing battle of wills between Lancaster and Lee J Cobb! :)
 


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: titoli on November 15, 2006, 06:26:56 AM
Do you like Cobb's final decision?


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Banjo on November 15, 2006, 06:55:16 AM
You mean to confront the Lawman instead of trying and failing to buy him off? ::)
Predictable but well done!


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Tim on November 15, 2006, 09:02:12 AM
  I caught Lawman for the first time this summer on TCM and really enjoyed it.  The whole cast gives excellent performances, especially Lancaster and Cobb, but also the supporting cast, oh and Robert Ryan.  How could I forget him?

  And personally, the ending kinda bothered me.  I know the men Maddox are after are scared out of their minds, but to not get a single shot off?  It did catch me completely off guard when Lancaster shot JD Cannon in the way he did.  The same thing for how Cobb goes out.

  Overall though, great movie.  I'd heard of it before, but never how good it was. 


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: titoli on November 15, 2006, 09:22:22 AM
Quote
You mean to confront the Lawman instead of trying and failing to buy him off?

No, I mean the way he does away with himself. I think that maybe (maybe) he should have tried for him, knowing it was a lost cause anyway.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: cigar joe on November 15, 2006, 05:52:27 PM
It was definitely the unexpected, I'm still amazed that it ended the way it did.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Banjo on November 16, 2006, 10:54:37 AM
No, I mean the way he does away with himself. I think that maybe (maybe) he should have tried for him, knowing it was a lost cause anyway.
Sorry,i'd forgotten the ending so i'd need to look at it again :-[


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: The Peacemaker on November 16, 2006, 02:25:14 PM
I just saw this movie two weeks ago and I loved it. Great psychological western. Even though I'm not a big fan of those types of westerns, this one is an exception.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: cigar joe on November 16, 2006, 03:56:10 PM
I just saw this movie two weeks ago and I loved it. Great psychological western. Even though I'm not a big fan of those types of westerns, this one is an exception.

I'm just flabbergasted that I never heard of this Western before, its now way up there on my AW list. I'm wondering how many other lost gems may be out there?


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: titoli on November 16, 2006, 10:41:31 PM
That makes me wonder how this is rated in books on AW.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: cigar joe on November 17, 2006, 04:57:22 AM
Here you go:

Leonard Maltin (TV & Movie Guide 1989)

Lawman (1970) ***.... Intriguing thought-Western about stoic marshal who comes into unfamiliar town to bring back wanted men, refusing to sway from duty even though the entire town turns against him. Unsatisfactory resolution mars otherwise compelling story. Ryan gives one of his finest performances as timid sheriff.

Jay Hyams (Life & Times of the Western Movie 1983)

The notion that personal revenge inspires the dedicated pursuit of criminals is refuted, in a sence, in another film by Michael Winner. In Lawman (United Artists, 1970), Burt Lancaster plays a law officer named Jarred Maddox. a man thoroughly devoted to his duty. Hunting seven men who accidentally killed an old man during a drunken binge, Maddox rides into a strange town and finds that the men he is after all work for the local rancher, Vincent Bronson (Lee J. Cobb). Even when he has the entire town against him, the lawman presists in his efforts to bring in the culprits. Amazed at the man's determination, a storekeeper figures that it must be a matter of personal vengence. "Kin?" he inquires. "No" responds Maddox, "just a lawman."

Herb Fagen (The Encyclodedia of Westerns 2003)

Jared Maddox (BL) a stoic philosophical marshal, rides into an unfamiliar town determined to hunt down seven men who accidently killed an old man during a drunken rage. He learns that each of them work for a local rancher Vincent Bronson. Even when the entire town turns against him, Maddox continues the pursuit determined to bring the men to justice. When a storekeeper inquires into his motive, suggesting that the man they killed must have been his kin, and hisunyielding pursuit must be a matter of personal revenge, Maddox responds "no just a lawman." Robert Ryan again turns in a marvelous performance as the towns timid sheriff which can only make the pundits wonder why he never gained enormous industry stature mhe so richly deserved.


A Shoot-'Em-Up 'Lawman' Bows
HOWARD THOMPSON.
Published: New York Times, August 5, 1971

Some cutting dialogue and boiling psychological tension are the most winning things about "Lawman," a potent but curiously exasperating Western with those three hardies, Burt Lancaster, Robert Ryan and Lee J. Cobb.

This is the setup, familiar but perfectly viable. An iron-jawed realistic marshal, played by Lancaster, arrives in town to arrest an iron-jawed land baron and his henchmen for accidentally killing an old man. The crime, we repeat, was accidental and everybody knows it.

Why, then, wouldn't this shrewd visitor ride straight to the ranch of his main quarry and confront this equally intelligent chap? This is Cobb. Instead, the intruder aggressively stalks around town, arousing the hatred of the good (and weak) citizens and the halfhearted support of a bright, weak sheriff, Ryan. Cobb's boys murderously go at the intruder one by one.

There is, indeed, a baffling, oblique arrogance about the central character, played well by Lancaster, that belies his seeming quest for justice ("The law is the law"), the point of the film. But he is also a cold, egocentric fish. Wait till you see the final, main-street shoot-'em-up.

While unresolved in substance, the picture is long on sting, as sharply directed by England's Michael Winner and cynically turned by the writer, Gerald Wilson. The acting is solid, straight down the line. Especially good are Robert Duvall, Albert Salmi and Sheree North, a lady who has never had her just acclaim.

But it doesn't hold water, or convincing fire, for all the shooting.

Ozus' World Movie Reviews /8/8/2006

"... wannabe thoughtful Western."
Reviewed by Dennis Schwartz

Englishman Michael Winner ("The Stone Killer"/"Scorpio"/'Death Wish") helms his first Western in this unofficial remake of the 1955 "Man with the Gun," with the hardnosed Burt Lancaster in the Robert Mitchum role. It's a traditional Western, shot in Durango, Mexico, that's influenced by the spaghetti western, as it pours on an excessive amount of violence and gore while never getting satisfactorily to whatever psychological aims it had in mind; such as, to probe how far a man can compromise doing what's right and whether by not compromising one's beliefs the end will justify the means. 

Dedicated, by-the-book, taciturn, stern and unyielding lawman Jered Maddox (Burt Lancaster) rides into a neighboring town called Sabbath, where he has no jurisdiction, to bring to justice seven cowpokes who went on a drunken spree and accidently killed an old man in his town of Bannock. Sabbath's weak-kneed marshal living only on memories when he once was a man, Cotton Ryan (Robert Ryan), refuses to help Maddox, saying the men worked for cattle baron Vincent Bronson (Lee J. Cobb) who supports the town and in return demands loyalty. 

The exceptional cast is stuck with clunky dialogue it somehow manages to overcome. Lancaster is solid in his stoic marshal role, Ryan is convincing as the conflicted bought marshal, Cobb as the ruthless villainous corrupt boss tries hard to give his character some breath and not to be one dimensional as he searches his soul for answers and Sheree North is fine as Lancaster's love interest and one hope of softening his stance. But it's all for naught. The wannabe thoughtful Western, lacking style and freshness, can't get away from its bloodbath thrills as Lancaster methodically goes after his prey even as the entire town turns against him--little else matters when all is said and done. 

Apollo Guide Review (Scott Weinberg):

One of the more delightful aspects of the digital revolution is that several studios (most notably MGM and Warner) are sprucing up some dusty old movies from yesteryear and giving them the DVD treatment. I doubt there have been any online petitions supporting a DVD release of this 1971 Burt Lancaster western, but here it is…and any chance to revisit what is essentially a forgotten movie is welcome in my home. I had to look this one up online, as I knew nothing about it. If you knew me, you’d know how freaky that is.

Released in 1971 and directed by Michael Winner (Heaven Help Us, Death Wish and its two sequels), Lawman is not your traditional western shoot ‘em up, although there are more than a few exciting standoffs throughout. Much like Don Siegel’s The Shootist and Clint Eastwood’s Unforgiven, this is a sincere morality tale, only wrapped in an Old West exterior.

Marshall Jered Maddux arrives in the sleepy frontier town of Sabbath with a list of wanted fugitives. He explains to the cowardly Marshall Ryan that these seven men are wanted in his hometown for the accidental killing of an old man. Unfortunately, the suspects are all currently employed by Vincent Bronson, the cattle baron who essentially owns the entire town. Maddux’s unwavering dedication to the letter of the law disrupts the entire town and the local businessmen are as intent on removing Maddux as Bronson’s henchmen are.

While Winner’s screenplay is certainly not the model of originality, the old west clichés are presented with a fresh slant, and Lawman proves to be an engrossing film despite the familiar trappings. Aside from the irritated townsfolk and the villainous gunslingers, Maddux comes across an old flame tangled up with the wrong guy, a nemesis from the past who may or may not be on the right side of the law and a young cowboy eager to make a name for himself.

As Maddux, Burt Lancaster is positively stoic. In a performance that can best be described as “Joe Friday in the Old West,” Lancaster simply exudes honour and righteousness. As the craven local Marshall, Robert Ryan is fantastic and Lee J. Cobb plays the “evil cattle baron” role with a surprising degree of sense and humanity. Aside from the three leads, there are several enjoyable performances, including turns by Richard Jordan (of Logan’s Run, in his debut here), Albert Salmi (Dragonslayer) and a young Robert Duvall (less than a year before he’d appear in The Godfather).

As an old-fashioned western action film, Lawman works well enough. But thanks to some thought-provoking ideas on ‘legal murder’ and ‘honour amongst thieves,’ this is better than a straight shoot ‘em up. If you’re a fan of westerns or you simply enjoy your action movies presented with some deeper concepts than just “kill ‘em all,” Lawman is a forgotten little flick that’s definitely worth your time.






Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: titoli on November 17, 2006, 06:49:54 AM
Thanx. It is significant that the two western sources you quote don't venture a rating but just give some scant plot info: maybe they did see the SW influence and balked? The other ones, some are to the point others less. Still I think that all in all, if one hadn't seen it, by reading them one should be inclined to watch it, shouldn't he?
Anyway I'll be on the lookout for the Mitchum original. Ever seen it, CJ?



Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Tim on November 17, 2006, 04:13:23 PM
  Roger Ebert gave Lawman two stars, but it seems like he's close to giving it a positive review....or maybe that's just my interpretation of his review. 

 http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/19710831/REVIEWS/108310301/1023

  He also gave OUATITW 2.5 stars in 1969, but seems to have backed off that stance in recent years.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: cigar joe on November 19, 2006, 04:06:27 AM
No titoli,  I haven't seen the Mitchum original, I'll keep an eye out for it though.  ;)

Here is Herb Fagen's review from "The Encyclopedia of Westerns", doesn't sound quite the same.

Man with the Gun (aka Deadly Peacekeeper: The Trouble Shooter)

An alienated Clint Tollinger (Mitchum) rides into a town in search of his estrangled wife. Sheridan City is a lawless town, so the folk there hire him as town gunman, paying him $500 for his services. He is remarkably successful, managing to shoot up a band of outlaws, establish a curfew, and push the outlaws and their guns out of town. While the good townfolk applaud his endeavors, they start to castigate him for being too violent. Finally, once the threat is gone, they no longer want him around. Mitchun is superb in this slow-moving film with a familiar and straight forward theme. Look for Angie Dickenson in the uncredited role of Kitty.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: titoli on November 19, 2006, 10:33:58 AM
This sounds more like Death of a Gunfighter's plot than The Lawman's.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: cigar joe on November 19, 2006, 01:41:01 PM
This sounds more like Death of a Gunfighter's plot than The Lawman's.

It definitely does.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: cigar joe on November 24, 2006, 07:42:29 PM
Got the DVD (MGM Western Legends) of this and popped it in and watched this again, (another SW bow is the prominent use of crosses in a few cemetery sequences that I didn't notice before) I also watched the trailer which is definitely slanted towards a SW type trailer. If they had used Jerry Fieldings music cut from the trailer it would have improved that aspect of the film immensely, too bad.


here is the trailer check it out:

http://www.mgm.com/video_window.do?formatid=690&videoid=285


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: The Firecracker on May 30, 2007, 01:23:55 AM
No, I mean the way he does away with himself. I think that maybe (maybe) he should have tried for him, knowing it was a lost cause anyway.

I thought he killed himself because his son had just been killed? Not because he was afraid of being done in by Lancaster.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Tucumcari Bound on August 15, 2007, 10:05:07 PM
Lawman (1971) 8/10

A heavily Spaghetti Western influenced Film starring Burt Lancaster, Robert Ryan, Lee J. Cobb, and a young Robert Duvall. From the opening sequences this film screams Spaghetti Western from it's camera angles. Some people call it a SW ripoff. I don't understand why. It's paying homage to a great sub-genre that spawed some of the greatest films ever made. I don't see anything wrong with that. 

The music in this film is pretty damn good. You can hear it in the beginning as Maddox (Lancaster) rides on his horse towards the town. The gunfights were directed beautifully by Michael Winner who I think is an underrated director who doesn't get talked about much. He has some solid work on his resume. The violence very much resembles that of a spaghetti western or even a Sam Peckinpah film.

If you want to watch a great western that's often overlooked, then give Lawman a shot. It's an underrated classic in my opinion. Great and shocking ending top it off!



Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: KevinJCBJK on August 16, 2007, 12:20:08 AM
Because I was so rudely interupted before, I'm going to post my review for "Lawman" again....

Lawman (1971) 8/10

A heavily Spaghetti Western influenced Film starring Burt Lancaster, Robert Ryan, Lee J. Cobb, and a young Robert Duvall. From the opening sequences this film screams Spaghetti Western from it's camera angles. Some people call it a SW ripoff. I don't understand why. It's paying homage to a great sub-genre that spawed some of the greatest films ever made. I don't see anything wrong with that. 

The music in this film is pretty damn good. You can hear it in the beginning as Maddox (Lancaster) rides on his horse towards the town. The gunfights were directed beautifully by Michael Winner who I think is an underrated director who doesn't get talked about much. He has some solid work on his resume. The violence very much resembles that of a spaghetti western or even a Sam Peckinpah film.

If you want to watch a great western that's often overlooked, then give Lawman a shot. It's an underrated classic in my opinion. Great and shocking ending top it off!


Sounds promising, if that were the case wouldn't every western after 1964 be a spaghetti western rip-off?


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: The Firecracker on August 16, 2007, 12:22:18 AM
I didn't find the music all that good. The music in the trailer was much better.
I prefer Lancaster's other spaghetti like outing "VALDEZ IS COMING".


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Tucumcari Bound on August 16, 2007, 12:26:37 AM
I didn't find the music all that good. The music in the trailer was much better.
I prefer Lancaster's other spaghetti like outing "VALDEZ IS COMING".

There were certain sequences though where I loved the music. Most notably the beginning sequence with Lancaster and the sequence where Maddux (Lancaster) follows Vernon (Duvall) up the mountain. I loved the music in these sequences.

Speaking of "VALDEZ IS COMING" Firecracker, is it really that good? I've read mixed reviews of this. I'm sure you can give me some insight on it. Thanks.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Tucumcari Bound on August 16, 2007, 12:28:32 AM
Sounds promising, if that were the case wouldn't every western after 1964 be a spaghetti western rip-off?

Yeah somewhat. After the spaghetti western started to take off, we definitely seen the violence in American Westerns increase, meaning more blood, and less cut aways after shootings.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: KevinJCBJK on August 16, 2007, 12:30:53 AM
Yeah somewhat. After the spaghetti western started to take off, we definitely seen the violence in American Westerns increase, meaning more blood, and less cut aways after shootings.

Well, many westerns have become violent, which makes the old westerns so unique.

Which reminds me, I am kicking myself for missing Shane...TWICE.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Silenzio on August 16, 2007, 12:31:30 AM
Shane is damn good.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: KevinJCBJK on August 16, 2007, 12:33:28 AM
Shane is damn good.

I'll make sure to see it if it comes on.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Tucumcari Bound on August 16, 2007, 12:34:10 AM
Shane is damn good.

I agree. Many think it's the greatest American Western ever made. Great film and heavily homaged in "Once Upon a Time in the West."


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: The Firecracker on August 16, 2007, 12:36:38 AM


Speaking of "VALDEZ IS COMING" Firecracker, is it really that good? I've read mixed reviews of this. I'm sure you can give me some insight on it. Thanks.

I have a review of it somewheres...let me take a look...*ruffeling* ah ha!...oh, nope....*more ruffeling*.....GOT IT!

http://www.fistful-of-leone.com/forums/index.php?topic=3905.0


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: KevinJCBJK on August 16, 2007, 12:37:49 AM
I agree. Many think it's the greatest American Western ever made. Great film and heavily homaged in "Once Upon a Time in the West."

When I see it I'll review it. So far my favorite American Western is The Man who Shot Liberty Valance.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Silenzio on August 16, 2007, 12:39:18 AM
When I see it I'll review it. So far my favorite American Western is The Man who Shot Liberty Valance.

Excellent choice (and a much better choice than Shane would be in my opinion).


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Tucumcari Bound on August 16, 2007, 12:40:35 AM
When I see it I'll review it. So far my favorite American Western is The Man who Shot Liberty Valance.

Great choice. It's a MASTERPIECE for sure. One of my favorite films. I still rank THE SEARCHERS, John Ford's other MASTERPIECE, as the greatest AMERICAN WESTERN ever. I just love how it's shot. It's so damn beautiful to look at. It also contains one of the best final shots to end a film ever as you know.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Tucumcari Bound on August 16, 2007, 12:41:05 AM
I have a review of it somewheres...let me take a look...*ruffeling* ah ha!...oh, nope....*more ruffeling*.....GOT IT!

http://www.fistful-of-leone.com/forums/index.php?topic=3905.0

HAHAHA, thanks brother.  O0


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: KevinJCBJK on August 16, 2007, 12:43:24 AM
Yes the Searchers I've been wanting to see too. I like to watch all the Ford films, and any great American Western as long it's not Roy Rogers or stuff like that.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Silenzio on August 16, 2007, 12:44:09 AM
Great choice. It's a MASTERPIECE for sure. One of my favorite films. I still rank THE SEARCHERS, John Ford's other MASTERPIECE, as the greatest AMERICAN WESTERN ever. I just love how it's shot. It's so damn beautiful to look at. It also contains one of the best final shots to end a film ever as you know.

I agree with every word.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Tucumcari Bound on August 16, 2007, 12:49:33 AM
I agree with every word.

Thanks Silenzio. I did not know you thought this highly of THE SEARCHERS. That's good to know.  :)


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: cigar joe on April 09, 2008, 03:48:14 AM
Watched this again it was next on my random index card system.

Again WOW, its fastly going up on my Best Western list, you get these unexpected touches out of nowhere ie., there is a shot of Lancaster shooting Duval's horse out from under him, a few scenes later Lancaster with prisoner Duval in tow return to pass by the now disemboweled horse being devoured by coyotes and vultures.

A must get and see for those who haven't.

Now I have to see if I can find Ulzana's Raid, I may have caught parts of it years ago, but don't remember


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: titoli on April 09, 2008, 05:45:22 AM
Aren't these Lancaster westerns aired in USA? They are in Italy at least once a year, year and half.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Ben Tyreen on April 09, 2008, 11:05:06 AM
Quote
Aren't these Lancaster westerns aired in USA? They are in Italy at least once a year, year and half.

 That's the sad thing, they are every once in awhile but not enough.  I caught a bunch of Lancaster westerns on a TCM-themed night.

 CJ, Ulzana's Raid is very good and that's coming from someone who watched it in pan-n-scan on AMC with commercials.  No whitewashing there, it's about as realistic a western as I've seen.  No super-soldiers who kill Apaches by the dozen or anything of the sort.  It might be the only western I've seen where a soldier actually shoots a woman rather than have her captured by Apaches.  Well worth checking out. O0


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: cigar joe on April 09, 2008, 04:52:57 PM
AMC consistently shows Westerns on Saturday Mornings into the early afternoon these are in the rotation quite a bit lately, no SW other than Eastwood/Leone, not many late  60's or 70-80 Westerns at all.

The Appaloosa  (1966) TVPG
Starring: Marlon Brando, Anjanette Comer, John Saxon. More Info »   

River of No Return  (1954) TVPG
Starring: Robert Mitchum, Marilyn Monroe, Rory Calhoun. 
 
Comanche Territory  (1950) TVPG
Starring: Maureen O'Hara, Macdonald Carey, Will Geer.   

Rio Bravo  (1959) TVPG
Starring: John Wayne, Dean Martin, Ricky 

The Night Riders  (1939) TVG
Starring: John Wayne, Ray Corrigan, Max Terhune.
 
The Shepherd of the Hills  (1941) TVPG
Starring: John Wayne, Betty Field, Harry Carey.
 
Pony Soldier  (1952) TVPG
Starring: Tyrone Power, Cameron Mitchell, Thomas Gomez.   

Kansas Raiders  (1950) TVPG
Starring: Audie Murphy, Brian Donlevy, Marguerite Chapman.   

Broken Trail  (2006) TV14
Starring: Robert Duvall, Thomas Haden Church, Greta Scacchi.

Open Range  (2003) TV14
 
My Darling Clementine  (1946) TVPG
Starring: Henry Fonda, Linda Darnell, Victor Mature.
   
The Dark Command  (1940) TVPG
Starring: John Wayne, Claire Trevor, Walter Pidgeon.
   
Backlash  (1956) TVPG
Starring: Richard Widmark, Donna Reed, William Campbell.
 
The Comancheros  (1961) TVPG
Starring: John Wayne, Stuart Whitman, Lee Marvin. 

Bend of the River  (1952) TVPG
Starring: James Stewart, Arthur Kennedy, Rock Hudson.

Santa Fe Stampede  (1938) TVPG
Starring: John Wayne, Ray Corrigan, Max Terhune.
 
Pony Soldier  (1952) TVPG
Starring: Tyrone Power, Cameron Mitchell, Thomas Gomez.
   
Law and Order  (1953) TVPG
Starring: Ronald Reagan, Dorothy Malone, Alex Nicol.
 
Walk the Proud Land  (1956) TVPG
Starring: Audie Murphy, Anne Bancroft, Pat Crowley.
 
The Searchers  (1956) TVPG
Starring: John Wayne, Jeffrey Hunter, Natalie Wood.



Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: titoli on April 09, 2008, 06:22:51 PM
It's a really poor program, I tell you.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: dave jenkins on April 09, 2008, 09:02:06 PM
You are right. We deserve better.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: cigar joe on April 10, 2008, 03:56:13 AM
Watch it again, are you sure you watched the same film, Tuco Harmonica?

The cast is top notch, almost every minor character is a good actor, the sets are cramed full of details, every interior is loaded with interesting stuff, Winner has a very nice balance between the exterior landscapes, characters and interior shots. The cinnematographer is not Tonnio Delli Colli but its not bad at all.  I noticed this time around shots similar to Leone's where the camera had something between it and the actors in a few shots ie., spokes of a wagon wheel during the final gundown. Its now in my top twenty.  O0


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: cigar joe on April 10, 2008, 04:49:31 PM
Actually he was on the verge of changing from a jerkoff to a human being, it was right after he and Sheree Noth "found" each other again. He was leaving town, letting go of his obsession with the law. Sheree North had all her stuff packed in the wagon and was ready to leave with him,  he just didn't get out of town fast enough, and when Bronson and his men confronted him he reverted back to Lawman.

Watch it again you must have missed that part.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: cigar joe on April 11, 2008, 04:27:08 AM
Quote
Doesn't Lancaster provoke the violence in the movie's final scene anyways?

I'd have to pop in the DVD again to tell you for sure.  But doesn't Lancaster tell Robert Ryan in the sheriff's office that he through and that he's heading back without taking in the rest of the culprits, right before he goes out into the street?


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Noodles_SlowStir on April 11, 2008, 12:04:14 PM
I've seen Lawman once or twice.  Probably not as much as some and it's been a while.  I don't think the Lancaster character instigates the violence in the conclusion of the film.  Not his actions in the end anyway.  He delivers Duvall to Robert Ryan, and tells the Ryan character that he's going to leave well enough alone and leave town.  It seems after his night with Sheree North, he's really had to confront the regret in his personal life.  But it's too late.  The town has been agitated and Cobb comes with his men.  Lancaster attempts to ride out, and one of the merchants attempts to shoot him in the back.  Someone shoots the merchant and Lancaster is drawn into a confrontation with Cobb and his men.

I guess I didn't think of Lancaster as a jerk off.  He sees things very black and white.  Perhaps to a degree a lawman had to be that way in those times.  It actually makes his character more interesting and also flawed, instead of having an overly righteous good guy coming into town to serve justice.   I think the film was interesting because typically the Lee J. Cobb character (the baron that owns everything is typically the heartless villain).  Cobb's character is sympathetic.  He had no idea nor did he condone the violence of his men that resulted in the death in the other town.  He seems to want to resolve the conflict without further violence or death.  Because the Cobb character is depicted this way, it definitely provides a different kind of contrast to the Lancaster role.  Maybe highlights how his inability to see things outside the letter of the law, and his own rigid personal code, has prevented him from being nothing more than a lawman.

In the end, North's cowardly man runs away from the scene.  Lancaster reverts back seeming to accept that it's too late for him, maybe disgusted that a coward has everything that he would want, shoots him in the back.  In a way he finally lets his emotions get the best of him,  he sees things through his rigid standard of what a man should be, and ironically in the process seems to violate the letter of the law by gunning the guy down that way. His act seems to be symbolic of his inability to serve his idea of the law and his own personal code and personal life.   That he shoots North's man, I didn't take it as a sign that the Lancaster character wasn't sincere about wanting to change.  I think the film shares that theme of personal regret with other westerns. The character wants a different life but the way of the time period, circumstances or passage of actual time have them convinced it's impossible.  I think you see that in The Magnificent Seven a bit with Chris, Vin and Bernardo....you see that with Will Penny....I think you see that in Harmonica and Cheyenne in OUATITW...and others.



Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: dave jenkins on February 06, 2009, 05:53:17 PM
Michael Winner: Somebody please take that man's zoom lens away from him.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: The Firecracker on February 07, 2009, 01:30:18 PM
, Winner is a not a good director.

I think he's wonderful when doing mindless garbage

Death Wish 2, 3


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: titoli on March 02, 2009, 01:23:30 AM
Watched the dvd. I don't think is as good as Ulzana's Raid, but it is one of the best westerns of the '70's anyway. The movie is remarkable because people are thrown in a situation from which they could deliver themselves easily (and Lancaster tells it in plain words that the circuit judge who'd be in charge of the case can be easily bought off), but for different reasons all the characters (including Lancaster himself) do  not choose the easiest course which is to follow Lancaster to his towns and stand trial. The reasons for this behaviour are not contrived but believable and that's what makes the movie good, apart from the other particulars noted by CJ. The OST is mediocre, but the performances of Lancaster, Cobb and Ryan (I rank him with Mitchum and Bogart as my all-time american favourite actor: here one can see why) are great in delineating rounded characters. 9\10     



Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: dave jenkins on May 11, 2009, 06:05:44 PM
The new Cinema Retro (Volume 5: Issue #14) has an interview with screenwriter Gerry Wilson, titled "Back Off, Lawman." He speaks about the two Michael Winner films made from his scripts, Lawman and Chato's Land. Very interesting reading.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: stanton on May 12, 2009, 02:10:14 AM
Rewatched Lawman recently

Interesting story

Pretensious dialogues

Great cast with lots of familiar faces

Robert Ryan is outstanding

A tired Burt Lancaster with an astonishingly weak performance, his only weak one in a western

Winner's directing does not help the film, does not hurt it either

The alternative bad end (if it really exists) would be a great mistake

Ambitious but only partially succeeding

6/10 (but only on a good day)


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: dave jenkins on May 12, 2009, 06:15:39 AM
The alternative bad end (if it really exists) would be a great mistake
Tell me more. I have no idea what you are referring to.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: stanton on May 12, 2009, 01:34:30 PM
Someone claimed to have seen Lawman once with an alternative end, in which Lancaster got shot in the back by his ex- lover while riding away.

Not sure if this really is true. It would have been a bad melodramatic ending anyway, and far more conventional than the one we have.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: dave jenkins on May 12, 2009, 04:15:14 PM
Gerry Wilson doesn't say anything about that in the interview I referenced above. Of course, sometimes the writer doesn't know everything about a film he has written. There's a Samuel Taylor interview from the late 80s in which he swears up and down there was no alternate ending to Vertigo, and yet it's on all the home video releases after 1997 as an extra. Taylor didn't know about it cause he didn't write it and it didn't make the final U.S. cut, but it was shot and it was on some European cuts of the film. So Wilson could similarly not know about an alternate ending that Winner shot for Lawman. But, gee, how come no one else knows about this? I think the Cinema Retro interviewer would have brought the matter up if for no other reason than to get Wilson's take on it. But there's nothing about it in the article . . .


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: uncknown on May 23, 2009, 12:34:13 PM
WATCHED IT LAST NITE.
really good piece of work,

Question: Lancaster shooting North's man in the back at the end; he was running away and posed no threat
Not sure why Maddox did this unless he wanted to get back with her but he left without her?
So, was this his way of cutting himself off from his past completely, before starting a new life OR his way of letting her know he cant change after all.


??????????? :-\


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: uncknown on May 23, 2009, 12:37:48 PM
I'd have to pop in the DVD again to tell you for sure.  But doesn't Lancaster tell Robert Ryan in the sheriff's office that he through and that he's heading back without taking in the rest of the culprits, right before he goes out into the street?

Lancaster tells Ryan he is dropping his vendetta.
As he is leaving town Cobb's men let him go w/o provoking or starting the shooting.
The irony of the ending is the fact thatit is the cowardly shopkeeper who tries to shoot him in the back which starts the tragic chain of events.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: stanton on May 23, 2009, 01:02:24 PM


Question: Lancaster shooting North's man in the back at the end; he was running away and posed no threat
Not sure why Maddox did this unless he wanted to get back with her but he left without her?
So, was this his way of cutting himself off from his past completely, before starting a new life OR his way of letting her know he cant change after all.



I think, there is no rational reason for killing this man. For me it's simply, when the violence starts, he gets overwhelmed by it, and so he also does this unnecessary killing. One of the better ideas of Lawman, and maybe the only really surprising one.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: dave jenkins on May 23, 2009, 10:18:52 PM
Let's see what the screenwriter says, shall we?

Quote
One question often asked about the ending of Lawman (and a subject of recent debate on the internet), is why Maddox, a man defined by his rigid adherence to the law, shoots the fleeing and unarmed Hurd Price (J.D. Cannon) in the back? Wilson laughs before replying: "Burt Lancaster asked, Michael Winner asked. Everybody wants to know! And the answer is because I wanted him to do it. And that is the real answer. The justifiable answer is that Maddox tried to walk away, and Laura (Sheree North) is going to come with him, right? He wants out. Maybe, as he says to her, it's time. Or maybe I can get a town like you do, Cotton, that pays a little dividend and I sit out my years easy. Or maybe quit altogether. And these people call him back. For no reason at all they call him back. And it's over! Then Luther Harris (Walter Brooke) tries to shoot him in the back. And then the one gunman (William Watson) draws a gun and comes firing at him. I mean, the whole thing comes back. And then Maddox wants to stop even then. And Bronson's son (John Beck) pushes it even farther. He can't get out of this morass. And in the middle of this morass is this coward (Price), who stands in the way, who is married to--or not married, but who has his woman in a sense--and he's ruined everything. He's one of the people who've ruined everything! So why the fuck should he live? And Maddox has a personal hatred against this one man. Remember, this one man tried to bushwhack him, [and] he was standing there with the others, ready to kill him, wasn't he? But it is a personal thing [and] it is an act of murder. It's a coldblooded murder. There's no way around it. And there's no going back from it. . . ."

--Gerry Wilson in Exshaw, John, "Back Off, Lawman," Cinema Retro, Vol 5: Issue #14, 2009, p. 15.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: uncknown on May 23, 2009, 11:37:38 PM
Let's see what the screenwriter says, shall we?

--Gerry Wilson in Exshaw, John, "Back Off, Lawman," Cinema Retro, Vol 5: Issue #14, 2009, p. 15.

did you get permission to reproduce that excerpt?  >:(


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: dave jenkins on May 24, 2009, 07:54:06 AM
You've heard of fair use?


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: uncknown on May 24, 2009, 12:15:43 PM
You've heard of fair use?

just byb
:)


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: dave jenkins on May 24, 2009, 07:26:06 PM
just byb
:)
;D


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: cigar joe on December 05, 2013, 03:49:21 AM
Watched this on the 50 inch, Winner's zooms are a bit more noticeable but the film is still great, regardless. Give it a go if you haven't already.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: mike siegel on December 05, 2013, 06:03:58 AM
Does everybody here loves that film ?  Over ten thousands hits for a thread about LAWMAN, I find that fascinating :)

To me Winner always was a film maker with a modest amount of talent. Somehow Bronson got something out of it (and I myself like Bronson, therefore I saw all these films more than once). But his films felt dated even back in the 70s.
I thought LAWMAN is one of his better films of course, but it wouldn't appear in my Top 50 Westerns list. The dialogues, Winners direction,
Lancaster looks rather bored - not even Robert Ryan can save it. I think.
I saw VALDEZ IS COMING on Blu-ray recently for the very first time, now that was an interesting film I thought, much
better than LAWMAN.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: T.H. on July 23, 2014, 02:19:31 PM
I gave this another view recently and I was way off here, though I've known that for a long time. I had to delete my comments where I said Winner wasn't a good director, when I'm a big fan of The Mechanic, Death Wish, Lawman and Chato's Land.

This has a very tight script, and the love interest scenes actually add to the plot and character development. This could have been close to a masterpiece if there was a new composer, some better set/costume design and if Winner held back the zooming a bit (and some other shots were distracting). His direction wasn't nearly as on point as in the other three aforementioned films listed above.

That's not to say this isn't a very good film, it's morally complex, quickly paced and has a great cast.

Lawman is a winn...worthy movie.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: dave jenkins on June 20, 2017, 04:53:05 PM
TT is bringing it to blu in September.


Title: Re: Lawman (1971)
Post by: Spikeopath on June 21, 2017, 04:36:29 AM
I'll add some timely thoughts.

I'm a lawman. Do you know what a lawman is, Crowe? He's a killer of men.

Lawman is directed by Michael Winner and written by Gerry Wilson. It stars Burt Lancaster, Robert Ryan, Lee J. Cobb, Robert Duvall, Sheree North and Richard Jordan. Music is by Jerry Fielding and cinematography by Robert Paynter.

The Lawman of the title is Jared Maddox (Lancaster), who arrives in the town of Sabbath to serve warrants on the group of rowdies responsible for the death of an old man. His cold hearted approach to his work, however, doesn't endear him to the townsfolk.

A man gets caught in his own doing. Can't change what you are, and if you try, something always calls you back.

Traditional Western that deals in the conflict between law and justice, Lawman, like the leading man, broods significantly. The overriding theme of if Maddox's enforcement of the law justify's the means, is tailor made for Winner's affinity for all things vengeance flavoured. Violence is not in short supply, the director gleefully keeping things gory, and the characterisations of the principal players are smartly complex. The excellent cast turn in equally great performances, the Durango locales are beautifully utilised by Winner and Paynter, and the production design is grade "A" quality.

It's an anti-backlash movie of some substance, where spicy and thoughtful dialogue comes forth from the mouths of deftly shaded characters. Highly recommended to Adult Western fans. 8/10