Sergio Leone Web Board

Films of Sergio Leone => Other Films => Topic started by: Jon on August 26, 2003, 10:22:57 AM



Title: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Jon on August 26, 2003, 10:22:57 AM
Has anyone else seen these two films directed by Robert Rodriguez,they are SO Leone-influenced but extremely cool in their own right.El Mariachi was made on the smallest budget ever but looks 10 times that amount.Desperado is both a sequel and a remake,it's such fun that I can forgive blatant steals from Leone's films and other spaghetti westerns[i.e.match lighting on face[FAFDM],guitar case with gun[Django].There is a third film,Once Upon A Time In Mexico[this could have been a good title for A Fistful Of DYnamite!]out soon.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: cigar joe on August 27, 2003, 05:09:30 AM
I've only seen Desperado, but its great and very Leonesque and the sequence with Cheech Marin and Tarantino in the bar is hilarious!


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Angel Eyes on September 01, 2003, 11:06:19 AM
They're both good, but Deperado fails to live up to it's brilliant start. But El Mariachi is superb.
Rodriguez is good, Dusk Till Dawn is excellent.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: cigar joe on September 01, 2003, 02:25:41 PM
I just saw El Mariachi, its actually the better of the two, Desperado gets a little far fetched.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: cigar joe on September 01, 2003, 02:26:51 PM
I saw a promo for "Once Upon A Time In Mexico" is that out yet or not?


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Cuchillo on September 08, 2003, 02:25:12 AM
I saw a promo for "Once Upon A Time In Mexico" is that out yet or not?

Hi, It comes out in England on Sept 26th. Looking forward to it. ;)


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Groggy on September 08, 2003, 10:29:31 AM
I saw a promo for "Once Upon A Time In Mexico" is that out yet or not?

It comes out in the states September 12th.  It looks okay, but I don't know that I'm going to rush out and see it.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: cigar joe on September 20, 2003, 03:24:09 AM
Saw OUTIM last night first impression, crap, like a re-remake of the first two, I was expecting much better, I have to float the Delaware River today, will elaborate later.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Groggy on September 20, 2003, 05:39:39 AM
Saw OUTIM last night first impression, crap, like a re-remake of the first two, I was expecting much better, I have to float the Delaware River today, will elaborate later.

Yeah I know.  Certain promos of it have dissuaded me from seeing it.  I might check it out when it comes to video, but I don't think I'm gonna watch it in theaters.  ;)


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: cigar joe on September 21, 2003, 05:56:02 AM
El Mariachi was great, a nice twist and a believable story.

The Desperado remake of it with Banderas had a bigger budget and better production values, the bar sequence with Tarantino was great but then it turned the original plausible story into a real cartoon, El Mariachi the Superhero would have been a better way to go at least you would then view it in that framework.

OUTIM just has more shootouts and even less of a story you care about.

What a let down, Leone kept getting better and better with his bigger budgets and Rodrigues gets worse, Leone made masterpieces that were butchered for distibution and Rodrigues makes crap. What injustice!


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Angel Eyes on September 25, 2003, 11:00:54 AM
All the reviews of OUATIM have been good in the UK (or at least the ones I read). I'm going to see it next week, I reckon it looks good (although I've not seen any footage)


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: cigar joe on September 25, 2003, 07:43:42 PM
Good then give us your opinon then, and try and catch Open Range if it shows up too.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Angel Eyes on September 27, 2003, 04:16:15 PM
which one is Open Range CJ, is that the one with Michael Marsden??


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Angel Eyes on September 27, 2003, 04:21:21 PM
OK CJ just seen you're thread on Open Range, dont think it's reached these shores yet, but my eyes are peeled.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Garry Cowell on September 30, 2003, 04:20:35 AM
Cool flick! 8)

First off I'm not a huge fan of Desperado and while I do like El Mariachi it more for the fact it was made for so little by Robert Rodriguez' one man band techniques.

So I wasn't expecting to really love this but it easily won me over. It's still a one man band effort - even the credits are cool (shot, chopped and scored by Robert Rodriguez) :)  There's a lot more going on in the movie that in the previous films and this really does feel like an epic (albeit a short one). It's definitely got a spaghetti western feel (revolution, revenge flashbacks, weirdo weapons)  to it - although mainly referenced via John Woo - feel free to tick off Rodreguez' Woo homage's (Hard Boiled, The Killer, Hard Target, Face/Off) :P

The performances are great as is the cast. Stand outs (as always) Johnny Depp, but Willem Dafoe, Mickey Rourke, and the great (but rarely used) Ruben Blades put in memorable performances.

Antonio Banderas also plays a lot more serious 'El' and has a stony constipated look to him that was absent from Desperado. It was either a knowing nod to make him very reminiscent of Charles Bronson's Harmonica / or due to the film been shot on video. I like to think the former as it also no coincidence as he's very much out for revenge!

I could go on but I've got a inkling to go for a Pork Chilli with Tequila and a Lemon!

Go see it! ;D


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: KERMIT on September 30, 2003, 11:23:28 AM
OK CJ just seen you're thread on Open Range, dont think it's reached these shores yet, but my eyes are peeled.
micheal gambon reminded me of richard boone for some reason. costner & duvall plan their strategy like a generals.  don't tread on me additude is a duvall trait.



Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Angel Eyes on September 30, 2003, 06:32:14 PM
I'm going to see it Thursday, but "shot on video", Garry you've just put me off.

Bon appetite.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Garry Cowell on October 01, 2003, 05:53:16 AM
I'm going to see it Thursday, but "shot on video", Garry you've just put me off.

Bon appetite.
LOL! Don't be, it still looks great. It's Hi-Def Video same as what Star Wars: Episode II - Attack of the Clones was shot on. :)


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Jon on October 02, 2003, 03:22:34 AM
Saw it yesterday,I thought it was very good in parts but overall a bit of a mess.Rodriguez is still good at shooting action on a low budget but here the best story,that of the Mariachi,was sidelined in favour of various other,confusing plots.Rdoriguez isobviously best when telling a simple,straight,story.here,he seems to overreach himself.i actually think a better movie might have been made out of the flashback scenes.Stll,it's worth seeing for some good action and performances,


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Angel Eyes on October 03, 2003, 11:11:18 AM
went to see it last night, and like Desperado , the start was superb but I soon got that sinking feeling that this was as good as it got and it was. If it was on tele I'd of turned over, oh dear!

A swallow doesnt make a summer.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Christopher on February 17, 2006, 09:00:37 PM
I just watched El Mariachi this past week in Spanish class (how cool is that? ;D). I liked it better than Desperado. I think Desperado is cool, and I like the over the top gun fights, but I think I prefer El Mariachi to it.

Haven't seen Once Upon a Time in Mexico yet, but might get around to that sometime.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: cigar joe on February 17, 2006, 09:42:17 PM
That's what I thought, I like El Mariachi better simply because its more realistic, (thought I did like Steve Buchemi, Cheech Marin, and Tarantino in Desperado)and I didn't like OUATIM at all seems like the same old same old with just a bigger cast.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Tim on February 18, 2006, 10:10:16 PM
  I liked Once Upon a Time in Mexico, not as much as Desperado, but it was still a lot of fun to watch.  The main attraction was Johnny Depp's corrupt Agent Sands.

  I love his "clever" disguises and he has some of the funniest one-liners I've ever heard.  And can you beat the end with him after the torture sequence?  I really didn't see that coming.

  I would love to see Rodriguez do a prequel with how Sands ends up in Mexico.  Then, you could end it right where OUATIM begins, with Sands meeting Cheech Marin.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Kurugen on November 26, 2006, 09:44:59 PM
This is obvisouly a Leone tribute except not as excuted as Leone. For instances the flashbacks are kinda incoherent to the viewer unless they know its a Leone tribute film.Has anyone else seen this?


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: The Firecracker on November 26, 2006, 10:02:44 PM
This is obvisouly a Leone tribute except not as excuted as Leone. For instances the flashbacks are kinda incoherent to the viewer unless they know its a Leone tribute film.Has anyone else seen this?

Yes, an entertaining but stupid film.The editing has problems.

There is a reference to "W Django" (Depp's three arm gag) and some references to what could be "Blindman" I suppose (Depp's loss of eyes at the end)?


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: pixelated on November 26, 2006, 10:39:25 PM
i recently picked up the "Mexico trilogy" box set for about $10

El Mariachi, Desperado and Once Upon A Time In Mexico

not necessarily the best movies ever, but as FC said, entertaining. Tarantino refers to these as Rodriguez's "Dollars Trilogy"

not that anyone cares what Tarantino has to say  ::)


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: The Firecracker on November 26, 2006, 11:38:35 PM


not that anyone cares what Tarantino has to say  ::)


I do. He is a competant director and surly the best American screen writer we have at the moment.
Used to be a bigger fan of his but he's somebody you grow out of.


Can't agree with him on Rodriguez though...he's a hack.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: The Firecracker on November 26, 2006, 11:40:22 PM


El Mariachi, Desperado and Once Upon A Time In Mexico





"Desperado" being the best of the three in my opinion (even though the ending is unsatisfying) and "El Mariachi" being the worst. It's really dull.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: pixelated on November 27, 2006, 12:43:35 AM

"Desperado" being the best of the three in my opinion (even though the ending is unsatisfying) and "El Mariachi" being the worst. It's really dull.

yeah, i agree with you on Desperado.. always loved that movie. i'm with you on the ending though. those freakin rocket launching guitar cases are just too ridiculous for me. and i've always hated the way Rodriguez uses explosions, with them happening in the background while a guy is launched in the air.. looks completely stupid



Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Blueberry on November 27, 2006, 07:33:08 AM
Well, I thought it was Once/Mexico was really, really bad. No soul, no decent script, lousy characters. It's been a long time since I saw it, though.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Amaze on November 27, 2006, 07:45:41 AM
it's been some years since I saw it too, but I didnt like it. and I seem to remember it was horribly edited.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: The Firecracker on November 27, 2006, 08:22:49 AM
yeah, i agree with you on Desperado.. always loved that movie. i'm with you on the ending though. those freakin rocket launching guitar cases are just too ridiculous for me. and i've always hated the way Rodriguez uses explosions, with them happening in the background while a guy is launched in the air.. looks completely stupid




I liked the guitar case rocket launcher and the guitar cased machine guns. It was a quirky idea (though it made little sense) and I saw it as an reference to "Django". That was fine.
The ending I disliked was Bandera's never has a proper gun fight with his brother (the villain). He just fires at the screen just as he meets him and everything goes white.

Rodriguez must have run out of money at this point and could not shoot a decent final fire fight or he was just too lazy or out of ideas.

It feels unfinished and unsatisfying.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: Tim on November 27, 2006, 08:46:18 AM
  I like Desperado and OUATIM, but Desperado is better.  Johnny Depp's Agent Sands is a great character though.  I would love to see a prequel with him that explained how he got posted to Mexico or a sequel with him coping with no eyes.  Like Firecracker said, it could be a homage of sorts to Blindman.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: pixelated on November 27, 2006, 01:14:10 PM

I liked the guitar case rocket launcher and the guitar cased machine guns. It was a quirky idea (though it made little sense) and I saw it as an reference to "Django". That was fine.

i always felt that "El" was an obvious Django inspired character. carrying around the guns in the guitar case, the killed love, dark clothing, the General character that killed his love... i always liked the guitar case.. i just never went for the ones at the end, and in OUATIM, that are actual weapons.. maybe it had more to do with the way the Rodriguez shot the explosions from the rockets that turned me off so much, i just wrote the whole idea off..


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: The Firecracker on November 27, 2006, 01:14:47 PM
.  Johnny Depp's Agent Sands is a great character though. 

Yes. The only thing that was pulled off well in that whole flick.


Title: Re: El mariachi (1992), Desperado (1995) and Once Upon a Time in Mexico (2003)
Post by: The Firecracker on November 27, 2006, 01:17:42 PM
i always felt that "El" was an obvious Django inspired character. carrying around the guns in the guitar case, the killed love, dark clothing, the General character that killed his love... i always liked the guitar case.. i just never went for the ones at the end, and in OUATIM, that are actual weapons.. maybe it had more to do with the way the Rodriguez shot the explosions from the rockets that turned me off so much, i just wrote the whole idea off..

According to Rodriguez he got his inspirations from the Mel Gibson "Mad Max" movies, not from SL or spaghetti westerns in general.

He got the Leone esq influence from the directors of the MM pictures (who were fans of SW).

Not sure of how much of that is true...surly the "W Django" reference in OUATIM cannot be coincidental.