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Messages - Sucker

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Duck, You Sucker / Re: Irish Locations
« on: November 01, 2011, 11:53:21 AM »
Hi Guys, haven't been here in a while but thought I'd update you all on this subject - Irish locations - and ask a question.

As mentioned elsewhere on the Board, DYS/FOD is showing in Dublin this evening at the IFI with Prof. Frayling in attendance. Regrettably, I cannot be there. However, in the blurb issued by the IFI they referred to the fact that John Boorman (who lives in Co. Wicklow) had assisted Leone in finding suitable locations in Wicklow for the flashback sequences. Now, as most of you will have seen on the youtube link posted above, these locations are not in Co. Wicklow but in Co. Dublin and Dublin City. I emailed the IFI last week about this and they have come back to me today with the news that they queried the matter this afternoon with both the Prof. and John Boorman and "they say that they definitely used Wicklow in the flashback sequences". Now, no more than NYC can be in LA, Howth Castle in Dublin cannot be in Wicklow. I have emailed them back with a request to ask them:

1. What scenes were shot in Wicklow?
2. Where in Wicklow were they shot?

Now, this raises the possibility (probability?) that scenes WERE shot in Wicklow but were not used in the final cut. If so, did these scenes expand on/clarify the exact relationship between the three that has raised some disagreement here over the years?

Oh, how I wish I could be there tonight!!!!

Duck, You Sucker / Re: My DYS Review
« on: August 10, 2009, 05:37:10 PM »
We've already seen Nolan's betrayal and the consequences thereof, I don't see a need for further emphasis of this point

Up until the final scene we have been led to believe that Sean had been betrayed to the British by Nolan, had killed him and the soldiers and fled Ireland. The purpose of the final flashback is to tell us that there was more to it than that. We could not possibly assume from the pub killing that the girl had anything to do with it. In that final flashback we see in retrospect that with the love aspect betrayal by the girl and Nolan the killing in the pub was a kind of double revenge (the judgment "once in my life") after which Sean knew he could never remain in Ireland with both Nolan and the girl gone from his life forever. (Apart from being a wanted man).

I just watched the final flashback and Coburn continues to smile until the end of it.  You just can't miss that famous grin.

If you watch the sequence closely this is my interpretation of it as it happens:

1. The three run to the tree. Sean kisses girl up against the tree. Nolan is close up.

2. Sean pauses kiss, looks up at Nolan and pulls girl away - Nolan moves close again.

3. Sean/Girl kiss passionately again.

4. Now things begin to happen. Girl in middle of kiss glances up at Nolan but resumes kiss.

5. Nolan taps Sean on shoulder - girl looks up at him again - Sean kisses girl.

6. Nolan pulls at Sean - girl looks at Nolan again.

7. Now more begins to happen. Sean looks around inquisitively at Nolan and then looks back at girl whom he tries to recommence kissing but but she goes to Nolan instead as Sean is moved aside. Nolan and girl kiss passionately. The hat goes across the screen.

8. Sean looks on with huge grin but then there is an ever so minutely noticeable fading of the grin as he begins to realise what has been going on. As the scene goes out of focus his pained expression and lip movements are on the lines of "oh fxxk".

I just can't see that if the final flashback was there just to make things cuddly for Sean at the end it would have ended with Sean/girl's first kiss at the tree as, indeed it did in the trimmed versions. Hollywood likes luvvy duvvy endings. But, no, it goes on until the love betrayal is revealed and, with that memory, he blows his unhappy life to smithereens.

The above is taken from some notes I made a while ago. Sorry to go into such length and I know I said earlier that I rest my case but, well, there it is.

Now, it's way past my bedtime. :) so goodnight to you all!!

Duck, You Sucker / Re: My DYS Review
« on: August 10, 2009, 12:34:58 PM »
OK, I rest my case based on what I saw first time round and what I see in the full DVD.
However, just to add that if I was in Mallory's position my happy memories of that day would end when I kissed the girl under the tree and I wouldn't be reminding myself who she passionately kissed after me :)  O0

And it really kills me when they all start calling his friend Sean

Agreed 100%.

Duck, You Sucker / Re: My DYS Review
« on: August 10, 2009, 11:39:44 AM »
when it comes to deeper interpretations

It's not a deep interpretation at all. When me and my friends first saw the film in the cinema that's what we saw. However, in later years the versions in the video rental shops and those on TV were the trimmed crowd-pleaser versions that were distributed in the US. 30 years of these versions being shown over and over have left an impression that all was luvvy-duvvy so I was very pleased when the special edition DVD was issued as it showed what really went on.

Also Coburn smiles as the girl and the friend embrace and kiss.  How do you explain that?

Have another look. He does smile at first but then..........?
You could even, if you wanted to  :), lip-read Coburn's faded out last words as "Oh, fxxk".

Duck, You Sucker / Re: My DYS Review
« on: August 10, 2009, 10:18:04 AM »
Thanks, Groggy for your interesting review, however,

John's flashbacks are also a bit overdone - the final one in particular goes on beyond all reason and goes from poignant to ridiculous.

I could not disagree more with this comment. It is necessary for it to go on like that and here's the reason. The final flashback is the piece de resistance, the sucker punch. We are led on to believe as it begins that Seán, in his death throes, is recalling the wonderful, carefree days back in Ireland with his girl and his friend. All looks so idyllic until just before the end the girl brushes him aside and kisses his friend. The movement of the hat across the screen is almost like a barrier being erected between them. You can see the sudden change in Seán's expression as he realises he has been two-timed. Leone doesn't reveal all until the "point of dyin' when we get hit by a hammer blow. (By the time Seán gets betrayed in the pub it is a lot easier for him to shoot his friend having, in effect, being screwed twice). After this betrayal and the shooting in the pub there was nothing left for him in Ireland. I mentioned this aspect before in some older thread but some didn't agree, wanting to believe that it was a simple menage-a-trois to the end, with which I can never go along with.

If I was cast away on a desert island and was allowed to have only one Leone movie it would be DYS not because it is the best one but for what it is.

BTW, being Irish I adore James Coburn's accent :)

Once Upon A Time In The West / Re: Anyone Else Notice???
« on: August 02, 2009, 01:07:28 PM »
That's a fake. There is no music in that scene!!

I'll check it out later just to be sure.

Duck, You Sucker / Re: Irish Locations
« on: August 02, 2009, 11:13:53 AM »
Just for fun I made a small video/slide show of the Irish Locations and have now stuck it on youtube.

You can watch it here:

« on: July 28, 2009, 02:20:13 AM »

It's "Seán, Seán, Seán"  :)

Duck, You Sucker / Irish Locations
« on: July 26, 2009, 05:00:02 PM »
I haven't been here in a long time but thought I'd let you know that the link for the slideshow of the Irish locations for DYS/FOD is now as follows:

Just to recap that the outdoor scenes were filmed in Howth Castle Demesne near Dublin and Toner's Pub was used for the indoor scenes.

Other Films / Re: Unforgiven (1992)
« on: February 11, 2007, 07:24:35 PM »
I love the westerns Leone loved and I love Leone's westerns.
I think Leone would have, like me, gone to see UNFORGIVEN hoping for something really good.
Like me he wouldn't have liked it at all  ;D
It did absolutely nothing for me even though I'm a great fan of Clint as a director - but not this time. A most disappointing western.

Sergio Leone News / Re: Fistful of Dynamite on Film 4 tonight!!!
« on: February 11, 2007, 07:05:31 PM »
I haven't sat down to watch Film4 since opening night. I can't stand ads breaking up my movies  >:(

How right you are. FilmFour used to be the No. 1 Movie channel when it cost 9 Euro a month. No ads and movies shown in proper widescreen 2.35:1 aspect ratio as required. Now, as a Freeview channel, it's all ads and many if not all 2.35:1 movies shown only in 16:9. And they still claim to be THE movie channel - rubbish.

As a matter of interest did they relent and show Dynamite in 2.35:1?

Ennio Morricone / Re: MORRICONE CONCERT!!!!!
« on: February 05, 2007, 01:19:27 PM »
Well.Guys, I'm sitting here at JFK ready for my 3000 mile journey home. Was it worth it? You bet it was. OK, it was a shorter concert but similar in length to the last one in London. Prior to that it was always about 3 hours with an interval but don't forget Ennio is 78 now. Sorry, I didn't get to meet any of you but I had a prior arrangement with long-time EM fellow-fans some going back 9 years. We had a ball.
I'm not going to even try to compare the NYC concert with others. It was a great and never-to-be-forgotten night. I hope all who attended enjoyed it as much as I did.

There are two parties of Morricone fans have already made reservations in Virgil's. Probably about 18-20 in all. It was thought best to reserve prior.
So, if you are there too we can all break out into "Sean, Sean, Sean" together. I don't know how big Virgil's is - never been there. However, don't book any one party exceeding 15. If there's more than 15 divide the party in two for separate reservations under different names.

Hope this helps a bit.

we got to decide soon

Brooklyn Diner
Virgils BBQ
Oyster Bar

Virgil's already has a crowd of true-blue Morricone fans booked in so you guys had better be quick  ^-^

General Discussion / Re: Who is the new Morricone?
« on: December 22, 2006, 11:06:28 AM »
John Williams could not really be considered the new Morricone. He's been around for just as long as Morricone and has a completely different style. Although I enjoy William's work in the movies, for some reason it never appeals to me as stand-alone apart from something special like Schindler's List which I adore.
If anybody is going to be the new Morricone it will be Andrea Morricone. Although he has a big act to follow and will always be compared to his Dad I believe, based on his work so far, that he has the potential to go all the way. However, being an "orchestral" composer he won't get many opportunities with today's American style blow-em-away directors  :)

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