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Messages - franksgrandson

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Duck, You Sucker / Re: quality of film
« on: April 05, 2006, 05:25:34 PM »
I think you see the same things in the film as I do and I always get a wave of depression watching it, its my least liked Leone film and I only watch it when I am in the mood for its kind of message and story.
Its funny but west also has these overtones in places but it never hangs heavy in fact a viewer feels a lot for the protagonists in West while not in DYS maybe its a fact that most people think little or nothing about the Mexican revoloution or know much,where's stuff on the civil war or US revoloution is much more known.
If there was a period I would have liked to see Leone film that would have been the North American English/ French/Indian wars
I am a great fan of what Micheal Mann did with his version of Last of the Mohicans

Duck, You Sucker / quality of film
« on: April 05, 2006, 04:56:17 PM »
is it just me or is the quality of the film used in once upon a time the revoloution lower than that used on west and others it just seems to be different or was that an effect Leone was trying to capture in places it gives me a feel of a sepia photograph wheres west and gbu scream epic.

Once Upon A Time In The West / Re: Favourite moment
« on: April 05, 2006, 04:47:08 PM »
for me its right at the end when Harmonica comes into the house all three of them Jill, harmonica and cheyenne have like a thing between them Jill wants one of them or both but she knows nothing will happen but the air is alive with tension its like she has fallen for these men who are her protectors but she knows they are going to vanish like a dream.

Its all in the eyes and that cute lost little smile

Once Upon A Time In The West / Re: Alternative Casting
« on: March 27, 2006, 10:00:12 AM »
I think peck or stuart would have worked well as Frank  and Fonda would have been fine as Morton Loren would have been passable as Jill and Coburn as Cheyenne but I like the Wayne idea as Frank hardest part is Harmonica and I keep thinking about Wallach it would have been miles away from a Tuco type role but seeing his non western movies I think he could have given it a good shot.
Leone got it right the first time.

Now if we are talking remake
I would look at the following

Harmonica   Wes Studdi
Frank           Tom Hanks
Jill                Zeta Jones
Cheyenne   Daniel Day Lewis
Morton        Ken Stott

now I can sit back and await the howls of derision.

Oh and to get rage up even further

Director   Tarantino (but with man with no name holding a gun to his head) to stop any messing with this hallowed movie

This is good stuff maybe we can get a clearer idea of what was intended when Eli speakes at the NFT in May its a good question to ask him

Off-Topic Discussion / Re: Your worst book ever
« on: March 25, 2006, 12:47:41 PM »
must agree on Hitlers little ditty its the pits how did you ever manage to get to page 40 the history of Nazi Germany can be very intresting read William Sheirer
I suppose most of Germany in the thirties found the Fuhrers scribble drivel but an award must be given to him for a writer of crap to sell so many mind you when the Gestapo is hanging around all the time I suppose it is prudent to have a copy on the dinning room table.

General Discussion / Re: Once upon a vote
« on: March 24, 2006, 05:02:38 AM »
Once upon a time in the west
this film has it all and as good as duck you sucker is I always feel depressed after watching it people are right when they say that this movie shows that the violence is not fun anymore or a myth.
Once upon a time in America is a film on a different level its a gangster movie not a western.
I would place it next to Goodfellas as the top two films of that genere and before anyone starts praising the Godfather to much I personally don't like it even though its always held up as the best gangster movie I think Leone could have done better with it

General Discussion / Re: We need more Euro Westerns...
« on: March 13, 2006, 06:35:08 PM »
I do not think its just a fact that we need more euro westerns and I do not think at the end of the day that there is a lack of stories or ideas for production it seems to me that Hollywood is just chicken shit scared to take risks thats not to say good movies don't come through once in a while when Hollywood makes a cracker it is always a good one but inbetween there is so much rubbish.
The studio system back in the golden era made for actors careers John Wayne, Robert Mitchum, Burt Lancaster and a host of others cut there teeth on all types of films but in the end stuck to the genere that suited best for each.
Its just these days where are the big stars the ones that you craved to see, think back when a new Wayne or Eastwood movie was announced on the theatre hoarding you used to drool at the mouth now Cruise Pitt or Will Smith don't raise the blood pressure.
I think as well the huge attraction of Leone and other non American directors is the fact that the West to them as to us is a fantasy Leone gave us the west like we always knew it to be a dirty nasty place full of the desperate gunslingers we used to dream about Leone even said as much in interviews.
Try as I might I cannot imagin T.Cruise getting filthy for a spag western he would need sixty or more helpers to get him on set and three more to spray on sweat.
To me the only actors today that could carry out a spag in the same spirit would be Johnny Depp, Ray Winstone and maybe Tom Hanks.
I personally would love to see Eastwood do just one more western as  director, head back to spain and produce for all of us the Western that only he and the Ghost of Leone could give the movie world

General Discussion / Re: Eastwood's other Greatest movies...
« on: March 12, 2006, 04:52:29 PM »
With Eastwood movies I keep going back to Tightrope very edgy movie with Eastwood showing a very tormented side worth a second look.
and Pale Rider should be in the list

General Discussion / Re: What are your favourite leone films in order
« on: February 27, 2006, 06:19:31 PM »

many years ago as I was sitting an English exam we were asked to pen a sequel to a favourite movie just for fun and of course I thought over the Leone films, at the time I did nothing finally writing somthing about the Eagle has Landed, but the thought has always nagged me and it aways seemed to me that West is the only Leone film that a sequel could come to frutition although it would have to be done quick.


Sweetwater as a thriving town run by Jill who is almost reclusive.
It starts with Jill in bed years have aged her and she is ill, sitting with her is her daughter and now death is knocking on her door she tells the girl she is Harmonica,s daughter, he had come back once to see her.
She tells of her love of both Cheyenne and Harmonica and the story of why this came about, but then she tells of her Rape by Frank and how she had born a son to him and how she cursed the son of a bitch as she dug Franks shallow grave out the back of the ranch house.
The Child Jill had she placed in an oprhanage run by priests and Jills daughter had always to be careful of all men.

Old type Prison a young man with scars all over his back pulls on his shirt after a guard tells him he is to be released that day his back is scared by whip marks, looking over to his cell mate an old man he nods, "You say you rode with my father and that he died at a place called Sweetwater.
The old thug coughs badly nodding he took a bullet on the Morton train in the shoot out with Cheyennes gang but survived. "Frank the man you lookin for aint got no name but plays a damm Harmonica he's like death himself with a pistol but hell that was years ago you want revenge on the bastard he won't be so fast no more nor that half breed Cheyenne.

If you want more of what I thought for a sequel let me know


Once Franks son is out of Jail we see him in his real light  the evil of the man has gone on to his son who is a sadistic sex killer and wastes no time in gunning down a few saddle tramps in El Paso and murdering a whore in an upstairs room of a saloon he is the start of the American serial killer.
In El Paso he hears news of Cheyennes death and the real bad news of Harmonicas passing and the soon to be burial at Sweetwater.
Franks son will make his way to sweetwater in a ramage of Killing.

Jill is almost at the end of her life when she hears of Harmonicas death from a very old Sam who tells her that Harmonica left papers saying he wanted to be buried on the Hill above Sweetwater next to the place he buried Cheyenne near the woman he loved

At the burial attended by only Jill and Sam the daughter being at finishing school in San Fransisco Franks son appears he guns down Sam kicking the old mans body into the hole Harmonicas coffin has been placed, in a murderous rage he confronts his mother.

more later dinner is ready
dinner tonight was a vegtable stew in a wooden bowl that I ate with a toothpick while discussing lumps of gold that could be hidden in my property afterwards the wife asked me if I wanted to throw her across the table?


Franks son attacks Jill by the grave and leaves her for dead and it is at this point that the real secret of Sweetwater becomes apparent on the side of the grave where Sams body has scrapped away the earth as a huge streak of gold its like Harmonica knew this was the place to be buried and has only given the secret to Jill at the point of dyin.

Jill dies after leaving a note for daughter who comes back to find that Sweetwater is now being run by Franks son and already feels like the town from hell with killings rapes ect
before Jill passed away she closed the grave as well as she could and telegrammed the news of Franks son and the secret of the grave.

Jills daughter gets captured buy Franks sons men and a brutal beating and  rape takes place which she only survives by luck she drags herself away and the whores from the saloon get her out of town back to Flagstaff where the wood merchant looks after her .
As she gets better she starts to learn how to shoot revenge deep in her heart.
Her first act is to slip back into Sweetwater at the dead of night and dig up the bones of Frank and place them at the well (clothes hat ect on) but the most importaint thing she keeps for herself the Harmonica.
And its the sound of that that wakes Franks son who is sleeping next to a strangled whore in the house, its like a dream that noise to him he knows its not real just the stories he had been told of his fathers time in his battle with Harmonica.
The next morning going out front of the ranch he sees the bones of his father sitting at the well and he starts to understand that the Harmonica he heard in the night was not just a bad dream
The daughter takes her first direct action in the Saloon in Flagstaff where the Sweetwater Auction took place gunning down three of Franks sons men.
One she lets live and tells him to tell Frank that Jill Mcbain is back to get him.
Franks son is livid with rage he knows he Killed his mother so no Jill Mcbain exisits he has no knowledge of having a sister.
He sends more men to flagstaff to find the woman and Kill her this leads to a big gun battle in Flagstaff where Jills daughter is helped for the 1st time by the Navaho indians who take her back to the caves after the shootout that has her wounded.
The indians tell Jills Daughter that Franks son has found out that she was the woman the whores of sweetwater helped and he is killing them one by one to draw her out.
Jills daughter is drawn back to Sweetwater where a furious gunbattle takes place between franks son and his men and the indians that are helping her.
its a close run thing and for the first time Franks son and Jill face each other he thinks its Jill they look so much alike even though this woman is much younger.
Jill has to flee the odds are two much
Frank and the last ten of his men give chase into the desert where another shoot out takes place at the inn in monument valley the bartender and a couple of others there help Jills daughter but all die with only her escaping, the place burns to the ground leaving Franks son thinking that his little problem in no longer a problem.
Jill rests up a while then sends word to Franks son to meet her at the cattlecorner railroad station.
The end of the sequel should be a react of the cattlecorner shootout but this time Franksson turns up with two henchmen waits for the train and then the shootout which she wins and instead of getting shot she walks over to the dying Frank and places the harmonica in his mouth telling him that as she is Jill and Harmonicas daughter she will make sure that both he and his bastard father will never be laid to rest at sweetwater.
End of movie sees Jills daughter moving her mothers coffin into the space between Cheyenne and Harmonica, she sees the gold and understands what has been left to her but she covers it over knowing that a gold find at sweetwater would just bring her more evilmen.

Well thats the basic idea needs a lot of work on dialogue and continuity. I have a pretty strong idea over who should be in this and a director what do you think I would like opinions and feedback   

Once Upon A Time In The West / new here
« on: February 07, 2006, 07:03:24 PM »
at last found a place to talk to others about the best movies ever made.
I am the nut that went to see once upon a time in the west every day for 3 months at the Odeon Leicester square London when it was show there in 1980
this is the best film ever made with no other comming near.
As good as Eastwood is he would have not done justice to the Harmonica role although it would have been great if he had done the three killers at the start with Eli and Cleef.
I personally do not think that Bronson ever had the same platform either before or after that Leone gave him it was the zenith of his acting career.
One last thing is it time someone got hold of James Woods and got him to point us in the direction of the mythic 4 hour version of Once Upon a time in the west
as it seems to me that the amount of stills that are appearing hint at a lot more than we have dreamed of even if a rough longer version is around us poor sons of bitches deserve it someday

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