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Messages - Lil Brutto

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16
Sergio Leone News / Re: Fixing GBU Without Permission/Authorisation
« on: July 17, 2019, 03:59:55 PM »
Great stuff!

 Anyone here involved in this?  ;)

No. We're working with scans of 35mm elements (i.e. first release theatrical dye transfer "IB Tech" prints) to preserve the International Cut (IC).

Three years ago one of the members of our team already recreated the IC using primarily the Italian Mondo BD and sync'd to the English mono audio from the MGM LD.

Here's a list of all the work involved in recreating the IC:
Quote
-Removed Italian credits and replaced with 4K's credits. Regraded 4K's credits to better match the Mondo (kept one Mondo shot)

-Removed shot of single gunfighter on horse in the intro. Remove close up of the two gunfights

-Removed Italian "il brutto" title. Replaced with the 4K's English "The Ugly" shot and regraded to the Mondo's colors.

-Removed shots of Angel Eyes filling his bowl with food

-Removed shots of Angel Eyes eating

-Removed Italian "il cattivo" title. Replaced with the 4K's "The Bad" and regraded to the Mondo's colors.

-Kept extra shot of Blondie's gun after "rescuing" Tuco. Lil Brutto confirmed this was on the 98 LD but accidentally left off the 98 DVD even though its the same master. Its on the 93 LD

-Kept "flip cut" transition from Tuco talking to Blondie to being hung.

-Removed Italian "Il buono" title. Replaced with the 4K's English "The Good" and regraded to the Mondo's colors.

-Removed shots of confederate soldiers leaving town. Removed shots of bandits sneaking up on Blondie. Removed shots of Blondie cleaning his gun

-Removed longer hold on Blondie when confronted by Tuco

-Removed shot of wall being destroyed by cannon fire [Should have remained.]

-Removed Angel Eyes's visit to the Confederate fort.

-Removed Blondie's and Tuco's interaction in the desert, where Tuco eats and taunts Blondie.

-Removed the Confederate guard post scene. Restored fade in from black as the coach arrives at the monastery.

-Kept fade out/fade in at the monastery from when Blondie passes out and Tuco is bringing him water. This is present in the 93 LD but not in 98 DVD/EE/4K

-Removed additional dialogue scene in the coach between Blondie and Tuco.

-I re-cut the Mondo's arrangement of the "Tuco Torture" scene into its individual shots and rearranged them to match the IC/TC scene arrangement. I then added 6 shots from the old American Extended Edition that the Mondo was missing and regraded them to better match the Mondo's colors. I used the audio from the 4K and thehutt's audio restoration to sync the audio to the new arrangement.

-Removed Blondie meeting Angel Eyes' gang by the river and restored the shot of the train leaving the station cutting to Tuco in the train.

-Removed part of a shot of Tuco preparing his bath

-Removed the extra dialogue interaction between the Union commander and Blondie and Tuco.

-Removed extra scene extension of the Union commander moaning from his gun wounds.

-Removed extra scene extension of Blondie and Tuco setting up the dynamite on the bridge.

-Removed shot of Blondie chewing on his cigar while waiting for the bridge to blow-up

-Removed and replaced 4 shots from the Mondo with the old American Extended Edition's shots. This is the "Sorry Tuco" scene and not only that shot but the adjacent shots are different in the Mondo vs the 4K/98/93. Regraded to better match the Mondo's colors.

-Removed the end Italian il brutto, il cattivo, Il buono and replaced with the old American Extended Edition's The Ugly, The Bad and the Good. Regraded to better match the Mondo's colors.

-Removed Tuco's "Son Of A Bitch" Italian shot for the IC's version of the scene from the EE.

-Removed final Italian shot of Blondie riding off with the old American Extended Edition''s shot to get the English The End graphic. Regraded to better match the Mondo's colors.

-Removed restoration credits.

17
The Good, The Bad and The Ugly / Re: Tarantino Speaks
« on: April 26, 2019, 03:06:44 PM »
Quote
Almost whenever they open their mouths, you hear some of the funniest lines I have heard in my life. To think that it was written in Italian and then we hear the translated version and it is still that funny—it just blows me away. . . .

This comment implies that somehow the humour was not lost in translation. I've always been curious about what was really said in the Italian dialogue given that Mickey Knox claims to have translated the GBU script into English so that the dialogue matches the lip movements of the actors. One would think that would require significant massaging of the dialogue in some areas.

Cenk Kiral interviewed Mickey Knox back in 1998 about his role in GBU and OUATIW. Here's an excerpt:

Quote
Can you please explain the function of your job when you were working with Leone and how you met him?

Well, I think it was through Eli Wallach, who is an old friend of mine. His agent was also my agent, and he convinced Sergio to use me to direct the dubbing of GBU in New York, which means I had to adapt the whole movie into the proper English. I did all the dialogue. United Artists came to me and said "this is America, everything has to be in perfect synch". I mean the dialogue with the lips. That wasn't an easy job for that picture. Sergio didn't give a damn about the sound, because all of his films were dubbed after the pictures were finished anyway. Many times different actors doing the dialogue part. So this gave him the freedom to shoot a picture without worrying about the sound, meaning visually he can do anything he wanted. And, in fact he did.

How was the script writing process working? - Did the scripts already have the dialogue, or did you write them all?

How it worked was this way: he had a very poor translation from the Italian, and in most spots the American actors changed the dialogue when they were doing it. So in many cases I had to re-lipped if I could. German actors had to speak German, Spanish actors spoke Spanish, Chinese actors spoke Chinese. In the end, all had to be done in English. I knew what they were saying, because I had the Italian script. I knew the sense of what they were saying. But I had to find out the right dialogue not only in terms of move the story along, but also to fit the lips. It's not an easy thing to do. As a matter of fact, it took me six weeks to write, what they say, 'the lip-synch script'. Normally I would have done it in seven to ten days for a normal movie. But, that wasn't a normal movie (GBU).

So, when you started working with Leone, the Italian version of the scripts already had the dialogue, right? Let's take OUTIW for example, since your involvement is much more than GBU throughout the making of it. How exactly process worked in that film?

In that film, it already had all the dialogue in Italian. I had to adapt it to English, meaning that in many cases, especially in a Sergio Leone picture, where there are peculiar phrases, I had to find the equivalent, but not the same, in English. Because if you translate it directly from Italian, it makes no sense.
How about those ever-famous one-liners, like "there're two kinds of spurs..."? Were they your inventions?

In GBU, I tried to follow his intentions all the time. I didn't want to intrude my ideas of what the script should be. Most of them were his ideas. Sometimes, it was the actors' ideas. But, he was pretty good about that. He knew what he wanted and he did have a sense of humour. So, he did those type of one-liners in Italian which had to be translated to English. Some of them couldn't be. That's when I had to invent things that were American. A lot of the Italian quips, wits, and what you call as one-liners, weren't easy to translate, like in any language.

There is one quite famous of those "one-liners" in OUTIW, which goes like 'people like him have always something to do with death'. I am particularly curious about it. Was that line one of your adaptations, or was it already in the original Italian script as it is?

Well, I wrote it obviously, but it was probably the same in the original Italian, but I don't remember exactly. All the English dialogue is mine. I mean, in terms of adapting it from Italian, but I didn't originally write the Italian script. Somebody else did it, like Sergio Donati, but the English version is all mine.

But, I must say that you've done an excellent job. Many fans of Leone still remember those famous one-liners. There are even books about Leone referring to those famous one-liners. Prof.Christopher Frayling, who wrote one book on Spaghetti Westerns, and who is about to release a huge book on Leone's biography, is anxious to hear from you regarding to your efforts for Leone pictures.

Well, actually the only two films I've worked for Leone were GBU, and OUTIW.

A couple of years ago an Italian fluent in both Italian and English generously agreed to provide a DIRECT translation of the Italian language track. I was surprised to learn that his direct translation was nearly identical to the English language track. There were very few discrepancies.

18
For a Few Dollars More / Re: New 4K Restoration Blu-Ray (March 2019)
« on: April 04, 2019, 09:22:42 PM »


Looks like it is. (RHV on the disc)

19
Like I said it was "something" like what I posted the "UA" but without the United Artists below. I saw the films on Times Square in 66-67 and it definitely wasn't the colorful one.

Good to know! Maybe this one?



This logo appears at the end of the GBU trailer on the MGM laserdisc. I'll have to check our scan of the IB trailer to see if it's also there.

The same website says the black background variant can be seen on some trailers and B&W films.

20


I remember something close to this logo for the films.

Over the past few decades, home releases have included a logo that was being used by the studio at the time of release. The UA logo (9th logo) that you posted was used from 1982 to 1987.

21
Are you saying that the UA logo was NEVER on prints of the movie, or only on the first run prints? Because if it's the latter, and UA later put the logo on for subsequent releases, I'd rather have it along than not. It's part of the film's history. If the difference between first run prints and those that came immediately after is only that logo, then let's have the logo.

According to this website: http://www.closinglogos.com/page/United+Artists, this particular logo (4th logo) was used from June 13, 1967 to August 3, 1968 so, if used, it would have been the one included for the first theatrical release.

However, I have not come across any evidence yet that this logo was used for the first run IB TECH prints. As I mentioned before, the continuity script does not list it. It's possible that it was spliced in before the first run prints were distributed to theatres but none of the 4 IB prints I've personally seen (3 plus a screening of QT's personal print at the NewBev) have it. Perhaps the logo was lost at some point over the past 52 years on all 4 prints? I don't know. Maybe.

Also keep in mind that the opening titles/credits were unique to the US/UK/Canada in addition to the obvious translation from Italian to English. The sequence of credits to actors such as LVC and Eli Wallach was reordered. Also, the "United Artists presents" title card was inserted just before PEA, whereas the Italian version credits only PEA. Perhaps this explains why the 1967 UA logo may not have been used for GBU?

One thing's for sure, based on their track record with this film I cannot rely on KL's decision to "restore" the logo as evidence that it was included in 1967.

22
The great part is that the research continues! There's still much to learn about this film...

Bumping this thread because my statement above still rings true to this day.

With Kino Lorber's recent BD release of FAFDM, I noticed that KL once again included the 1967 logo (aka "The UA-Transamerica Circle", "The UA Ovoid"). This is not correct for 2 reasons: 1) the film debuted in the US on May 10, 1967 but the logo didn't appear until about a month later on June 13, 1967 when You Only Live Twice was released; and 2) more definitive proof, the FAFDM continuity script (page 1) shows that this logo, which would have been part of the pre print element and therefore at the head of reel 1 of the theatrical print, was not included.

As for GBU, ever since MisterLime of KL posted that they "restored" the 1967 UA logo, I've been wondering whether or not the 1967 UA logo is supposed to precede the opening credits of GBU. I've come across 3 US first release prints now and none of them have this logo. Again, if it were printed in, it should have been accounted for in the continuity script. I checked my copy of the continuity script today and it shows no UA logo before the opening titles, only "United Artists presents" that is part of the opening titles.

Also, while doing some digging I came across a website that independently verifies my findings. It states, "The original U.S. theatrical run of The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly did not originally have this logo, as confirmed by the original 1967 continuity script which described the first reel as going straight to the title sequence from the leader."

Cool logo but it doesn't belong.



23
Is the footage still available?
ICE

Yes it is, but the link provided in the original post is now dead. Updated now.

Here's the new link: http://theeditroomfloor.blogspot.com/2017/04/current-issues-with-good-bad-and-ugly_15.html

Here's a direct link to the 35mm scan of the "Skeleton Shot": https://vimeo.com/169704930

The complete footage sourced from the original negative is available as an extra on the Kino Lorber GBU blu ray released in 2017. The other unseen footage has not surfaced anywhere else yet.

24
My favorite moment, though, was the archival clip of Leone explaining the plot of GBU while devouring a bowl of pasta. That's entertainment!

My favourite moment too!

25
For a Few Dollars More / Re: New 4K Restoration Blu-Ray (March 2019)
« on: March 12, 2019, 04:14:42 PM »
Working on a part 2 that looks at the many different cuts of the beating scene...it's very complicated! Ideally I can get it out before the release date so that people can see what the "correct" version is. Even the Italian Blu is missing a few seconds in the beating scene...


Sounds like your goal is to show the full history of  beating scene cuts/edits on home release formats over the decades.

In the interest of time and to avoid a lot of unnecessary work why not limit your comparison to the various BD releases vs. the 1982 LD (or LeoneNut vid or CVC DVD, which is also complete)?

It will still educate those who were not aware that the full beating scene hasn't seen a proper release since the 80s (English language CBS LD) or 90s (Italian language CVC DVD).

26
For a Few Dollars More / Re: New 4K Restoration Blu-Ray (March 2019)
« on: March 12, 2019, 04:01:20 PM »
Not that it is important in any case. It is one of the weaker scenes anyway, and it doesn't get hurt the slightest with a few parts missing or not.

The missing footage of the beating scene should be included given that Leone intended for it to be included.

The brick wall explosion in GBU is an example of footage of obvious unimportance that was deleted in some home releases. However it should be there.

Yes, I'm guilty of being obsessive.

27
For a Few Dollars More / Re: New 4K Restoration Blu-Ray (March 2019)
« on: March 10, 2019, 09:01:32 PM »
You mean we should be focusing on the real issues. GBU issues ;)

Lol no! I was just trying to be a smartass by directly quoting the moron on bluray forum (johnysurfin) that accused you of being obsessive when you asked about the timing of the thunder clap.

You know I'm passionate about getting it right. ;)

28
For a Few Dollars More / Re: New 4K Restoration Blu-Ray (March 2019)
« on: March 10, 2019, 04:16:50 PM »
 >:D

29
For a Few Dollars More / Re: New 4K Restoration Blu-Ray (March 2019)
« on: March 10, 2019, 03:13:13 PM »
Here is a link to my first draft of an in-depth analysis of all the home video releases of the film. (8 min) Just looking at one scene, (Manco's entrance) we can see how the edit and sound have been tampered with repeatedly. I look forward to seeing/hearing if Kino has finally restored the film to Leone's intentions.

https://vimeo.com/322543630

I'm sorry but this seems a bit obsessive.

30
Off-Topic Discussion / Re: Happy New Year!
« on: January 01, 2019, 02:54:56 AM »
Happy New Year, SLWB  ^-^

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