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Author Topic: Why 3D doesn't work and never will. Case closed.  (Read 19425 times)
Novecento
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« Reply #120 on: February 14, 2016, 05:19:00 AM »


- Hugo (only the Melies montage toward the end, but damn that's the only time 3D technology became art)


I haven't seen it in 2D or 3D and probably never will in 3D at least.

I think the only thing I have ever seen in 3D is Avatar and doubt I will ever see anything in 3D again. However, here is your chance to convince me... I am curious as to what you mean by "3D technology became art" because to my admittedly ignorant in all things 3D perspective, 3D is killing the small amount of art that is left in cinema.

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« Reply #121 on: February 14, 2016, 03:25:57 PM »

3D is killing the small amount of art that is left in cinema.

some people still say that sound killed cinema, that cinema reached its peak in the late 20's and visually has never recovered from the advent of sound

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« Reply #122 on: February 14, 2016, 07:29:02 PM »

some people still say that sound killed cinema, that cinema reached its peak in the late 20's and visually has never recovered from the advent of sound

There's a actually a lot to be said for that argument. Didn't Alexander Mackendrick once say that a good film should be able to be mostly enjoyed by anyone even if they don't understand what is being said? I would certainly go along with that.

Another argument can be made for the advent of color film stock.

Basically every time a step is made to bring cinema closer to real-life (sound, color, 3D) there is a risk that some of the original artistry will get depreciated. I think good directors understand this and endeavor to retain it. With sound (take Leone with Morricone) or color (take Bertolucci with Storaro), I see how these technological advances can create incredible films that would not have been possible before; with 3D I just don't understand what good it could possibly serve.

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« Reply #123 on: August 29, 2016, 04:20:51 PM »

Looks like the format is done for now (and hopefully for good):

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-37212239

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« Reply #124 on: September 01, 2016, 02:47:58 AM »

Looks like the format is done for now (and hopefully for good):

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-37212239

Only suicidal lunatics go see a BOURNE MOVIE in 3D: you already need to seat in the very last row when you watch them in 2D.

There's a actually a lot to be said for that argument. Didn't Alexander Mackendrick once say that a good film should be able to be mostly enjoyed by anyone even if they don't understand what is being said? I would certainly go along with that.

Just like any "a good movie should..." rule, this one is plain false. I can name 10 masterpieces that heavily rely on dialogues and cannot possibly enjoyed if you don't understand what they're saying. Of course, I can also name 10 masterpieces that follow the rule... but as a rule and as a defense of having only silent movies, it doesn't stand a second.
Last, even in, say, OUATITW, which doesn't rely on dialogues that much:
- music is tremendously important
- sound is almost literally essential
- do you really think the movie would be that powerful without the "keep your loving brother happy" line being actually said by Fonda?

Basically every time a step is made to bring cinema closer to real-life (sound, color, 3D) there is a risk that some of the original artistry will get depreciated. I think good directors understand this and endeavor to retain it. With sound (take Leone with Morricone) or color (take Bertolucci with Storaro), I see how these technological advances can create incredible films that would not have been possible before;

Some stories require naturalism. 60fps in 3D can bring naturalism. Some stories don't. Most of the sound in "good films" isn't used in a realistic way. Just like colors. I'd say cinema is often about creating something that looks/sounds/feel like "some kind of" reality. All of the nuances in my sentence are important: it's not about being close to reality, it's about being believable.

with 3D I just don't understand what good it could possibly serve.

At the very least, immersion. I've told it before and I'll tell it for a long time, AVATAR is watchable only because of 3D. Not because it's showcasing the technology, but because something is expressed there by 3D: the audience is actually entering this imaginary world. And it works, although the movie is shitty. The other great example is, of course, Gravity, which is so far the best use of 3D I've ever seen.

Now, the fact that immersion is the main way 3D has been used, even by great directors, after years of the technology being available is kind of disappointing and may end the trend once and for all (not that much movies need that kind of immersive quality)... but from time to time, we see 3D used in another way and it can be incredible. For example, the Melies montage in the end of Hugo by Scorsese is absolutely stunning, and, ironically, greatly innovative.

« Last Edit: September 01, 2016, 02:52:01 AM by noodles_leone » Logged


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« Reply #125 on: September 01, 2016, 06:08:03 AM »

Good points from noodles_leone (as per usual). My one caveat: Immersion doesn't last. The first 20-30 minutes of Gravity were truly immersive, but then the novelty wore off and the 3D was from that point forward no more effective than 2D would have been. Which is too bad because when one is no longer immersed, one has the leisure to think about deficiencies in the plot, acting, etc.

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« Reply #126 on: September 01, 2016, 08:01:59 AM »

Is this another rant aimed at Miss Detective?

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« Reply #127 on: September 01, 2016, 11:06:12 AM »

Just like any "a good movie should..." rule, this one is plain false. I can name 10 masterpieces that heavily rely on dialogues and cannot possibly enjoyed if you don't understand what they're saying. Of course, I can also name 10 masterpieces that follow the rule... but as a rule and as a defense of having only silent movies, it doesn't stand a second.

Whoa, hold up there. Mackendrick wasn't arguing in favor of silent movies per se. He was saying that any decent movie should be watchable and enjoyable to a decent degree even if you don't understand the language. Of course it won't be as good as if you understand the language, but the language is the cherry on top and that is all. Remember this is coming from the man who directed "The Sweet Smell of Success" which is celebrated a lot for its dialogue.

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« Reply #128 on: September 01, 2016, 12:33:20 PM »

Orson Welles said this also.

And Truffaut wrote if there were no dialogues in films anymore 80 or 90 % of the directors would lose their job.

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« Reply #129 on: September 01, 2016, 12:36:53 PM »

Still Smiley

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« Reply #130 on: September 01, 2016, 12:38:35 PM »


- do you really think the movie would be that powerful without the "keep your loving brother happy" line being actually said by Fonda


Yes, in Germany the film was an incredible success without that line. And I watched the film 20 times or more without knowing about that line. And the German dialogue is so much better (Leone would have loved it) that knowing about the original was a big disappointment. (Still, why his brother, not his father? Had Leone a brother complex? Or did he confused them?)

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« Reply #131 on: September 01, 2016, 03:51:26 PM »

The French line is different too. They're all great. The particular wording isn't very important.

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« Reply #132 on: September 01, 2016, 07:55:36 PM »

And Truffaut wrote if there were no dialogues in films anymore 80 or 90 % of the directors would lose their job.

Just found Truffaut's comment on Psycho:

"It's a half-silent movie; there are at least two reels with no dialogue at all"


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« Reply #133 on: September 04, 2016, 06:49:17 PM »

3D works for me
Although, I admit, as a novelty.

A film like HOUSE OF WAX hasn't been fully experienced if only seen in 2D.
Unfortunately, only crap lately have been given the 3D treatment.
(Yeah I know some of you would think HOW is crap)
I've never seen Avatar cause' that film sounds like crap to me
 
As someone said earlier sound a color were novel once too.
Nostalgic sentiments often derails any advancement.

Still, I don't think 3D will catch on beyond a gimmick and will probably die out completely. (if it hasn't already)
Perhaps if someone made a good film with a new technology where we don't need to wear glasses with half the people getting sick.
But I highly doubt that will happen since it's now cemented in our minds as just a gimmick.  (an unnecessary one for most)

btw~It's been said that BluRay is "dead" too.

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« Reply #134 on: September 05, 2016, 02:28:21 AM »

The French line is different too.

And it is ... ?

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