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: Odds Against Tomorrow (1959) New York Tail Fin Noir  ( 6132 )
moorman
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« #30 : April 19, 2018, 05:21:40 PM »

I saw this on Eddie Mulllers top 25 film noir list.  I'm gonna try and screen this and see if it will become a part of my collection.

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« #31 : May 02, 2018, 10:29:30 PM »

http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Odds-Against-Tomorrow-Blu-ray/203387/

Yes.



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« #32 : May 03, 2018, 02:50:46 AM »

cool


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« #33 : May 03, 2018, 06:43:25 PM »

I finally saw this. I loved it all the way up till the end.  Everything about this film was fantastic.  Ed Begley and Harry Belafonte were superb in this.  Robert Ryan was great also, but he was very slimy, lol.  He was worst in " Bad Day at Black Rock ", but he wasn't too far off here. I loved the cinematography, the music, the plot, the directing, everything was first rate.  This film should be better known. Thanx to Cigarjoe for posting this.  My only quibble, and its the SAME quibble with a lot of the noirs i have seen, is the ending.  I didn't care for the ending.  The ending WAS setting up to be great, but the director just threw it completely away.  Still, i give this a solid 8 out of 10.  This was a fantastic movie.

« : May 03, 2018, 06:44:33 PM moorman »
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« #34 : May 04, 2018, 02:48:04 AM »

I finally saw this. I loved it all the way up till the end.  Everything about this film was fantastic.  Ed Begley and Harry Belafonte were superb in this.  Robert Ryan was great also, but he was very slimy, lol.  He was worst in " Bad Day at Black Rock ", but he wasn't too far off here. I loved the cinematography, the music, the plot, the directing, everything was first rate.  This film should be better known. Thanx to Cigarjoe for posting this.  My only quibble, and its the SAME quibble with a lot of the noirs i have seen, is the ending.  I didn't care for the ending.  The ending WAS setting up to be great, but the director just threw it completely away.  Still, i give this a solid 8 out of 10.  This was a fantastic movie.

Hollywood and independents were all still under the (even though it was weakening) Motion Picture Production Code. If you wanted distribution in theaters, you needed their seal. Your only other option would be to take your film on the road, rent halls, sets up tents, label it "educational" and show yourself. You could almost stop these films a minute or two before they actually end and think up your own ending. ;-)


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« #35 : May 04, 2018, 04:40:14 PM »

Hollywood and independents were all still under the (even though it was weakening) Motion Picture Production Code. If you wanted distribution in theaters, you needed their seal. Your only other option would be to take your film on the road, rent halls, sets up tents, label it "educational" and show yourself. You could almost stop these films a minute or two before they actually end and think up your own ending. ;-)

Its obvious the code was still in effect.  Its still a great movie though.  Dave's BIG mistake was including Earle in on the heist, ESPECIALLY after he saw that Earle was gonna bring his issues with him.  It was doomed from the start because of that.  When Johnny asked for the keys to the car and Earle ignored him, THAT was THAT.  He sealed their failure.  Ed Begley was superb in this.  I couldn't remember where i saw him so I looked it up and yes, it was in Hangem High with Clint Eastwood.  He is a great actor.

I can't get over how good this film is. I see why Eddie Muller has it in his top 25.  Great post you made here. :)

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« #36 : May 05, 2018, 02:44:31 AM »

Its obvious the code was still in effect.  Its still a great movie though.  Dave's BIG mistake was including Earle in on the heist, ESPECIALLY after he saw that Earle was gonna bring his issues with him.  It was doomed from the start because of that.  When Johnny asked for the keys to the car and Earle ignored him, THAT was THAT.  He sealed their failure.  Ed Begley was superb in this.  I couldn't remember where i saw him so I looked it up and yes, it was in Hangem High with Clint Eastwood.  He is a great actor.

I can't get over how good this film is. I see why Eddie Muller has it in his top 25.  Great post you made here. :)

Begley is in quite a few Noirs, On Dangerous Ground, The Street with No Name, Backfire, to name a few, and he's great in 12 Angry Men.


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« #37 : May 05, 2018, 10:54:40 AM »

Begley is in quite a few Noirs, On Dangerous Ground, The Street with No Name, Backfire, to name a few, and he's great in 12 Angry Men.

I have seen The Street with No Name. I can't remember what role he played. Its been a while.  I got that on my to purchase list because I remembering it being pretty good.  I'm gonna check out On Dangerous Ground and I already have 12 angry men on my watchlist.  On Dangerous Ground looks like its gonna be good.  Thanx...

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« #38 : September 27, 2018, 02:55:43 AM »

Calling the girl a little "pickaninny" is a racial slur, it's not friendly, at that point I knew the character was a racist son-of-a bitch. It would be the equivalent of somebody calling Italian kids a bunch of little greaseballs.  ???


Interesting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWcbGecDNpU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6Dmn9g10hE


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« #39 : October 01, 2018, 04:08:37 AM »



Interesting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWcbGecDNpU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6Dmn9g10hE

If you are black you take on the worst racial slurs and OWN them, I suspect that is what is going on with those songs. Just like the N-word today, you deflate it's power to hurt and demean.


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« #40 : October 01, 2018, 08:53:29 AM »

If you are black you take on the worst racial slurs and OWN them, I suspect that is what is going on with those songs. Just like the N-word today, you deflate it's power to hurt and demean.

So you think Gigli could have sung "Sleep, little greaseball, sleep"? Well, I doubt it. Especially if you sing them in a lullaby to a child. If an adult negro (I'm tired of writing black) calls "nigger" another adult negro, it is apparent that they are being ironical. But to do that to a child? To instill racism in somebody who doesn't know a thing about it yet? No, the fact (explored by Nick Tosches in his book on Emmett Miller which made me come back to this topic) is that the word was anachronistic already at the time when Robeson and Waters sang  it, not used in common language, more in the theatrical,  and designing a singing and dancing black child. The word itself derives from portoguese and it means little one. You might assume Ryan is using it offensively only AFTER we come to know the character, not by his using THAT (unusual: that factor should have amazed you) word.


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« #41 : October 01, 2018, 10:34:32 AM »

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickaninny



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« #42 : October 01, 2018, 07:04:57 PM »

So you think Gigli could have sung "Sleep, little greaseball, sleep"? Well, I doubt it. Especially if you sing them in a lullaby to a child. If an adult negro (I'm tired of writing black) calls "nigger" another adult negro, it is apparent that they are being ironical. But to do that to a child? To instill racism in somebody who doesn't know a thing about it yet? No, the fact (explored by Nick Tosches in his book on Emmett Miller which made me come back to this topic) is that the word was anachronistic already at the time when Robeson and Waters sang  it, not used in common language, more in the theatrical,  and designing a singing and dancing black child. The word itself derives from portoguese and it means little one. You might assume Ryan is using it offensively only AFTER we come to know the character, not by his using THAT (unusual: that factor should have amazed you) word.

who is Gigli?

What point are you trying to make?, I'm not following. I know from hearing it used long before I ever saw the film it was derogatory. Ryan wasn't being nice he was being a dick.

Pickaninny (also picaninny, piccaninny or pickinniny) is, in North American usage, a racial slur which refers to a depiction of a dark-skinned child of African descent. It is a pidgin word form, which may be derived from the Portuguese pequenino

Which reminds me of Shine: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdXPrhKdRKk


« : October 01, 2018, 07:44:48 PM cigar joe »

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« #43 : October 01, 2018, 11:58:22 PM »

who is Gigli?

What point are you trying to make?, I'm not following. I know from hearing it used long before I ever saw the film it was derogatory. Ryan wasn't being nice he was being a dick.

Pickaninny (also picaninny, piccaninny or pickinniny) is, in North American usage, a racial slur which refers to a depiction of a dark-skinned child of African descent. It is a pidgin word form, which may be derived from the Portuguese pequenino

Which reminds me of Shine: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdXPrhKdRKk

Gigli was the most famous opera singer of the '30's, when Robeson recorded the song.
The point I'm making is that you cannot say right away (like you said) that Ryan is a racist just by his using the word because its usage is controversial, if you read the whole wikipedia article. But, even more decisive is that the word, as I remarked, has a different impact depending on the era and the circumstance when it was used. You could even assume that Ryan is using an old, controversial and little known (and I'd bet not known by the little girl: which is the point of the scene. If he wants to be offensive toward the girl he should use a word he's sure she will understand or that there's an adult around to explain it to her) derogatory term to make fun of it.     
About the Bert Williams (a black singer) song you linked (from my favourite Cooder album) proves what I am saying: who would have used, in the late '50's, the word "shine", or "darky"? 



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« #44 : October 02, 2018, 03:11:53 AM »

Maybe the girl doesn't know but I knew immediately.


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