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Le Bon
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« #210 : August 24, 2017, 01:22:45 PM »

Did the original 1967 theatrical cut have the three characters intertitles (Good, Bad Ugly) that come up on their intro and exit scenes, in English?
When I first saw the film which was on UK TV in 1976, they were in Italian.

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« #211 : August 24, 2017, 06:59:52 PM »

Did the original 1967 theatrical cut have the three characters intertitles (Good, Bad Ugly) that come up on their intro and exit scenes, in English?
When I first saw the film which was on UK TV in 1976, they were in Italian.

Yes, the English cut had those three titles in English. Each international territory was given virtually the same print with the credit sequence and those titles as separate elements. Interestingly, the length of those titles varies depending on how the distributor decided to splice them in..the Spanish DVD for instance has the longest tuco intro title out of all the cuts, even the Italian. It has about a second more footage at the beginning of the shot resulting in the action of tuco running towards the window being repeated.

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« #212 : August 24, 2017, 10:40:08 PM »

Yes, the English cut had those three titles in English. Each international territory was given virtually the same print with the credit sequence and those titles as separate elements. Interestingly, the length of those titles varies depending on how the distributor decided to splice them in..the Spanish DVD for instance has the longest tuco intro title out of all the cuts, even the Italian. It has about a second more footage at the beginning of the shot resulting in the action of tuco running towards the window being repeated.


When does Tuco run toward the window? We first see him as he is crashing through the window; the frame freezes with "The Ugly" and then he runs away from the window.


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« #213 : August 25, 2017, 03:32:52 AM »

Yes, the English cut had those three titles in English. Each international territory was given virtually the same print with the credit sequence and those titles as separate elements. Interestingly, the length of those titles varies depending on how the distributor decided to splice them in..the Spanish DVD for instance has the longest tuco intro title out of all the cuts, even the Italian. It has about a second more footage at the beginning of the shot resulting in the action of tuco running towards the window being repeated.


How did the UK TV versions come to have them in Italian?
They screened the Int cut not the UK cinema one which had the gunsmith and Van Cleef and the prison camp commandant scenes cut out.

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« #214 : August 25, 2017, 06:54:38 AM »

It has about a second more footage at the beginning of the shot resulting in the action of tuco running towards the window being repeated.

You mean you see it twice - kinda like a replay? Doesn't that look really odd?

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« #215 : August 25, 2017, 10:07:51 AM »

The Italian RAI TV broadcast presents the Italian home release cut (to be expected) yet English opening credits are used (very unexpected). ???

It appears the TV prints were cobbled together using whatever elements were available/provided. Some of the early home release versions (VHS and LD) were sourced from these elements as well. For example, the 1990 MGM laserdisc had Italian onscreen titles yet it was the International Cut. There is an 80's Warner VHS that had Italian onscreen titles when the 3 characters were introduced but used English titles at the end. The 80s CBS LD used an Italian print that was crudely edited to conform to the International Cut. It has a crude cut where the first few seconds of the "6 is the perfect number" scene is visible before it cuts to Tuco in the boxcar, presumably to allow for the music to play to its entirety as the train leaves the station. These are some examples off the top of my head.


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« #216 : August 25, 2017, 10:49:13 AM »

Did the original 1967 theatrical cut have the three characters intertitles (Good, Bad Ugly) that come up on their intro and exit scenes, in English?
When I first saw the film which was on UK TV in 1976, they were in Italian.

In USA, yes when I saw it in 1968.

However, I have seen a version that had the "intertitles" in Italian even though it was an English-language version; can't remember if that was at a midnight showing in 1979 or on TV.  When I saw the restored version in the theater for UA's 90th anniversary festival in the 2000s, the intertitles were in English.

"From silent era gems (D.W. Griffith’s Broken Blossoms, Buster Keaton’s The General) to westerns (John Ford’s Stagecoach, Sergio Leone’s The Good, The Bad and the Ugly) to 1970s classics (Woody Allen’s Annie Hall, Hal Ashby’s Coming Home), United Artists has been a major player through Hollywood’s diverse eras. Many believe the studio truly hit its stride in 1951, when lawyers Arthur Krim and Robert Benjamin took over the studio for a 27-year run, producing both venerable franchises (James Bond, The Pink Panther) and beloved classics from Hollywood’s greatest moviemakers, including Billy Wilder (Some Like It Hot, The Apartment), John Huston (The Misfits) and John Frankenheimer (The Manchurian Candidate).

The famed New York Film Forum will host an extensive five-week retrospective this spring in celebration of the studio’s 90th anniversary, offering movie fans the chance to revisit an eclectic selection of classics from United Artists’ deep canon. The 54-film festival will kick off with a New York-themed double bill: Martin Scorsese’s Raging Bull (1980), in a new 35-mm print, followed by Woody Allen’s Manhattan (1979). The retrospective programming encompasses a vast variety: West Side Story, Midnight Cowboy, Last Tango in Paris and Sweet Smell of Success are just a few of the films on the docket. 007 fans should take special note of the festival’s Bond-themed evening, which will not only include a new 35 mm print of Goldfinger but a sing-along with the classic theme song. The retrospective concludes May 1st with a Charlie Chaplin double bill of his classics City Lights and Modern Times."


https://www.moviemaker.com/articles-moviemaking/united-artists-90th-anniversary-with-film-forum-retrospective-20080318/



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« #217 : August 27, 2017, 02:44:42 AM »

The Italian RAI TV broadcast presents the Italian home release cut (to be expected) yet English opening credits are used (very unexpected). ???

It appears the TV prints were cobbled together using whatever elements were available/provided. Some of the early home release versions (VHS and LD) were sourced from these elements as well. For example, the 1990 MGM laserdisc had Italian onscreen titles yet it was the International Cut. There is an 80's Warner VHS that had Italian onscreen titles when the 3 characters were introduced but used English titles at the end. The 80s CBS LD used an Italian print that was crudely edited to conform to the International Cut. It has a crude cut where the first few seconds of the "6 is the perfect number" scene is visible before it cuts to Tuco in the boxcar, presumably to allow for the music to play to its entirety as the train leaves the station. These are some examples off the top of my head.


That's interesting about the CBS LD. In the UK an early VHS by Intervision had the same crude cut you mentioned.

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« #218 : August 27, 2017, 08:29:51 AM »

In USA, yes when I saw it in 1968.

However, I have seen a version that had the "intertitles" in Italian even though it was an English-language version; can't remember if that was at a midnight showing in 1979 or on TV.  When I saw the restored version in the theater for UA's 90th anniversary festival in the 2000s, the intertitles were in English.

"From silent era gems (D.W. Griffith’s Broken Blossoms, Buster Keaton’s The General) to westerns (John Ford’s Stagecoach, Sergio Leone’s The Good, The Bad and the Ugly) to 1970s classics (Woody Allen’s Annie Hall, Hal Ashby’s Coming Home), United Artists has been a major player through Hollywood’s diverse eras. Many believe the studio truly hit its stride in 1951, when lawyers Arthur Krim and Robert Benjamin took over the studio for a 27-year run, producing both venerable franchises (James Bond, The Pink Panther) and beloved classics from Hollywood’s greatest moviemakers, including Billy Wilder (Some Like It Hot, The Apartment), John Huston (The Misfits) and John Frankenheimer (The Manchurian Candidate).

The famed New York Film Forum will host an extensive five-week retrospective this spring in celebration of the studio’s 90th anniversary, offering movie fans the chance to revisit an eclectic selection of classics from United Artists’ deep canon. The 54-film festival will kick off with a New York-themed double bill: Martin Scorsese’s Raging Bull (1980), in a new 35-mm print, followed by Woody Allen’s Manhattan (1979). The retrospective programming encompasses a vast variety: West Side Story, Midnight Cowboy, Last Tango in Paris and Sweet Smell of Success are just a few of the films on the docket. 007 fans should take special note of the festival’s Bond-themed evening, which will not only include a new 35 mm print of Goldfinger but a sing-along with the classic theme song. The retrospective concludes May 1st with a Charlie Chaplin double bill of his classics City Lights and Modern Times."


https://www.moviemaker.com/articles-moviemaking/united-artists-90th-anniversary-with-film-forum-retrospective-20080318/




That retrospective article is from 2008  :)


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« #219 : August 28, 2017, 09:57:44 PM »

In USA, yes when I saw it in 1968.

However, I have seen a version that had the "intertitles" in Italian even though it was an English-language version; can't remember if that was at a midnight showing in 1979 or on TV. 
I saw it too. It was on TV.



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« #220 : August 28, 2017, 10:28:48 PM »

That's interesting about the CBS LD. In the UK an early VHS by Intervision had the same crude cut you mentioned.

This one?

http://www.videocollector.co.uk/good-the-bad-and-the-ugly-the/30150


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« #221 : August 29, 2017, 01:47:13 AM »

This one?

http://www.videocollector.co.uk/good-the-bad-and-the-ugly-the/30150

Yes that's the one.

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« #222 : August 31, 2017, 12:16:25 AM »

I just watched the beginning of the "theatrical cut" (until after the second time Blondie shoots Tuco off the noose; approximately 27 minutes in).

I watched with the commentary by Tim Lucas. His commentary is SHIT.

Lucas violates my first rule of commentaries: You better sound like  you are speaking naturally, rather than reading directly off pre-written notes. His voice is not great. Every time an actor appears onscreen for the first time, Lucas proceeds to recite what seems like the actor's entire filmography. Yeah, he spends lotsa time just naming movies. When Angel Eyes goes to Baker's room, Lucas says that on the chair are Union cap and shirt; it's Confederate!
Lucas says that the opening ghost town set was "a village in Tabernas" - I trust Frayling, who says the ghost town was built by Carlo Simi & Co. in a remote area.


One great thing Lucas does: He  read the full text that the executioner reads aloud for Tuco's hanging in the second town – the audience cannot hear the full text, because part of it is drowned out by Angel Eyes's conversation with the half-soldier and the woman in the stagecoach. (Lucas does credit the person who showed him the full text). It is absolutely hilarious.
Oh - he also astutely notes that Stevens is not to be trusted - because he wears both belt and suspenders ;D

Lucas cites Peter Hanley's book - for instance, in  identifying the location of the Stevens farm and citing an interview Hanley did with Chelo Alonso - but he makes no mention of Frayling in the first 27 minutes. I am sure that lots of his info comes from Frayling. For example, he says that Leone insisted his inspiration in casting Wallach as Tuco did NOT come from his role as Calvera in THE MAGNIFICENT SEVEN - that is a tidbit Frayling always mentions. Maybe he credits Frayling later on;  I sure as hell won't listen to the rest of this shitty commentary.

Bottom line: Anytime I want to watch the movie with commentary, it'll be Frayling's.

And, once again, the overall bottom line: We're still waiting for a great BRD version of GBU.

« : August 31, 2017, 12:22:16 AM drinkanddestroy »

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« #223 : August 31, 2017, 07:44:17 AM »

The 80s CBS LD used an Italian print that was crudely edited to conform to the International Cut. It has a crude cut where the first few seconds of the "6 is the perfect number" scene is visible before it cuts to Tuco in the boxcar, presumably to allow for the music to play to its entirety as the train leaves the station.

If only they hadn't bothered... Such butchering was far more common back then than it is now, but we haven't completely escaped it.

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« #224 : August 31, 2017, 08:32:37 AM »

Here's a link to a video captured on my phone:

https://vimeo.com/231886345

Password: GBU

« : August 31, 2017, 10:30:53 AM Lil Brutto »

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