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: MANK (David Fincher, 2020)  ( 3223 )
noodles_leone
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« : October 08, 2020, 09:38:41 AM »

After an excruciating wait, here is the trailer:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_NqUYwngr0

From Wikipedia:

Quote
Mank is an upcoming American biographical drama film about screenwriter Herman J. Mankiewicz and his battles with director Orson Welles over screenplay credit for Citizen Kane (1941). The film is directed by David Fincher, based on a script written by his father Jack, and is produced by Fincher, Ce?n Chaffin, Douglas Urbanski, and Eric Roth. The film stars Gary Oldman in the title role, while Amanda Seyfried, Lily Collins, and Charles Dance also star.

Fincher's father Jack wrote the script in the 1990s, and David originally intended to film it after he completed The Game (1997). It never came to fruition, and Jack Fincher died in 2003. Eventually, the project was officially announced in July 2019, and filming took place around Los Angeles from November 2019 to February 2020.

Mank is scheduled to have a limited theatrical run in November 2020, before being digitally released by Netflix on December 4, 2020.



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« #1 : October 08, 2020, 11:03:43 AM »

It looks fantastic. It's going to be the best movie of 2020.

T.H.
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« #2 : October 08, 2020, 11:55:09 AM »

It looks like a spiritual successor to Ed Wood (1994) and that is a great thing. I was worried this was going to be some Mankiewicz puff piece, but I should have known better with Fincher attached to it.

« : October 08, 2020, 11:58:07 AM T.H. »


Claudia, we need you to appear in LOST COMMAND. It's gonna revolutionize the war genre..
noodles_leone
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« #3 : October 08, 2020, 11:57:42 AM »

Oh good call about Ed Wood. And yes it?s a great thing.


dave jenkins
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« #4 : October 08, 2020, 04:27:47 PM »

So, instead of a snow globe, we see an empty bottle of hooch falling out of Mank's hand?

Haha.

Ed Wood worked because it smothered its subject with a heavy layer of irony. It treated the man as if he'd been a great artist, with all the tropes associated with hagiographic bio pics. Nowhere was the irony more acute then in Burton's meticulous cinematic craftsmanship, on display throughout the film, a craftsmanship Wood himself may have aspired to but never managed. Ed Wood didn't look like an Ed Wood film, it looked like a Tim Burton film treating Ed Wood material. The distance between Burton's production values and those in Wood's films was as far as the east is from the west. Hence the humor.

But the trick doesn't work when you're going up against cinematic greatness. Aping greatness merely reveals one's own paucity of invention. Treating Mank as if he's in Citizen Kane does what exactly? It allows philm phan phucks to cum inside their shorts every time they see something they recognize. The rest of us will simply be reminded that there is a better film out there we could be spending our time on.



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« #5 : October 08, 2020, 11:12:38 PM »

So, instead of a snow globe, we see an empty bottle of hooch falling out of Mank's hand?

Haha.

Ed Wood worked because it smothered its subject with a heavy layer of irony. It treated the man as if he'd been a great artist, with all the tropes associated with hagiographic bio pics. Nowhere was the irony more acute then in Burton's meticulous cinematic craftsmanship, on display throughout the film, a craftsmanship Wood himself may have aspired to but never managed. Ed Wood didn't look like an Ed Wood film, it looked like a Tim Burton film treating Ed Wood material. The distance between Burton's production values and those in Wood's films was as far as the east is from the west. Hence the humor.

But the trick doesn't work when you're going up against cinematic greatness. Aping greatness merely reveals one's own paucity of invention. Treating Mank as if he's in Citizen Kane does what exactly? It allows philm phan phucks to cum inside their shorts every time they see something they recognize. The rest of us will simply be reminded that there is a better film out there we could be spending our time on.

Even though I appreciate this post, I do have to push back on Ed Wood being a standard biopic dripped in irony when Ed Wood is such a sweet and innocent movie at its core. While it hits some marks of the biopic, a subgenre I generally don't care much for, Ed Wood is really a buddy movie about a has-been and a never-was. And even though I more than understand your complaint of referencing one of the most famous moments in the history of cinema, this movie could potentially be great in a multitude of ways - considering the director.

I also do believe a great movie can be made in an Ed Wood type fashion about very talented people. Bela Lugosi was no slouch, so if Welles and Mankiewicz are as complicated and flawed as Fincher and we think, Mank should hopefully be the Ed Wood about 'A' pictures. I would at least hope it would be better than The Disaster Artist (2017) in terms of Ed Wood influenced movies.

« : October 08, 2020, 11:27:36 PM T.H. »


Claudia, we need you to appear in LOST COMMAND. It's gonna revolutionize the war genre..
noodles_leone
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« #6 : October 08, 2020, 11:54:53 PM »

I?m of course with TH here. And I will add two side notes:

(1)

Ed Wood didn't look like an Ed Wood film, it looked like a Tim Burton film treating Ed Wood material.

The Mank trailers (especially the Reddit one: https://youtu.be/4Xwmo4mc_dQ) are so filled up with Fincherisms that I can already guaranty Mank will look first as a Fincher film and then as a Citizen Kane tribute.


(2)

If there is one filmmaker in history who consistently captures the talent and obsession for good work of their characters, it's David Fincher. So yes, I'd rather have him film talented people instead of another Benjamin Button (a project he proved to be particularly ill adapted to).

But hey, we will see.

« : October 09, 2020, 01:09:33 AM noodles_leone »

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« #7 : October 21, 2020, 07:30:53 AM »

New trailer, the story is becoming clearer now:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aSfX-nrg-lI

And gorgeous BTS pics:
https://www.thewhitewinecameupwiththefish.com/

« : October 21, 2020, 09:06:04 AM noodles_leone »

dave jenkins
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« #8 : October 31, 2020, 09:58:05 AM »

Damning if true: https://www.wellesnet.com/mank-todd-mccarthy/



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« #9 : November 01, 2020, 04:49:58 AM »

I've heard conflicting reports on that one, other people mentioning "Welles is left relatively unscathed". But I'm not that surprised wellesnet.com thinks their God isn't treated with enough deference. Now, let me defend my own God with as much good faith as I'll be able to gather:

I have the feeling the film is going to be deeper and more interesting for what it tells about collaboration in moviemaking (or, I hope, about moviemaking as a whole) rather than what it says about the actual situation between Mank and Welles. Just like The Social Network is a much better film once you get it's about entrepreneurship WAY MORE than it is about Facebook (thank God). If you're interested in Mank and the way the Welles/Mank issue is treated, i'd highly advise to read the recent David Fincher interviews, in which the guy proves to have a much more nuanced and subtle point of view than what the article makes of his words (having NOT seen the movie, I  don't know whether Fincher is trying to defend his movie in bad faith or just speaking his mind, but I can tell you he's interesting to read anyway). This one, in particular (and which is quoted in your article if i'm not wrong) is a great read:

https://www.vulture.com/2020/10/david-fincher-mank.html



« : November 01, 2020, 05:01:38 AM noodles_leone »

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« #10 : November 15, 2020, 03:08:29 AM »

Quote
Having only ever worked with other people's scripts, the writer-versus-director clash of perspectives is one Fincher knows all too well. "Did Welles or Mankiewicz deserve the lion's share of the credit for Citizen Kane?" he asks."I don't even care. Did they get the best out of each other? Undoubtedly yes. It's always with the best of intentions that you duel to the death."
- David Fincher, The Telegraph

I was right to trust David.

« : November 15, 2020, 04:18:00 AM noodles_leone »

dave jenkins
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« #11 : November 16, 2020, 12:16:04 PM »

Last night I had a dream in which I met Orson Welles. I guess it was all this reading I've been doing about Mank. In the dream I was living in the house that had belonged to my recently deceased grandmother. Welles had bought the house and was kicking me out. By way of consolation, he'd agreed to let me interview him. Also he wanted us to leave together on a road trip and he was in a hurry. I was worried that I wasn't going to be able to come up with questions to ask on short notice (I'm terrible at Q&As after films), but, as we travelled, questions kept pouring into my head unbidden. Of course we talked about Citizen Kane. I asked, probably as a kind of provocation, whether if he'd had it to do all over again he would bother making Kane at all. I expected a vigorous defense but instead he surprised me and said something to the effect that the project at this point would no longer interest him and, granted a return to RKO in 1939, he'd rather do something else.  I mentioned that I liked the film a lot and that it and Chimes at Midnight were my two favorite films of his. He really brightened at this, and I have to admit I may have been doing a bit of brown-nosing at that point (although, in the non-dream world, those really are my favorites). We spent some time talking about Shakespeare--at least, I tried to, but he was visibly bored by my ideas. Rather than let the whole interview come to a dead halt I cast about for something on another subject and hit upon this: What's the deal with all that dancing we see in movies of the 30s, 40s, 50s, and early 60s? Did men and women really like pushing each other around on the dance floor? Was it a kind of foreplay, or maybe a socially acceptable way for men and women to touch each other when more intimate forms of contact in public were then not acceptable? For some reason this seemed like a really important question, I was really anticipating a retort both witty and maybe even profound. There was a merry look in Orson's eyes as he opened his mouth to speak. And then I woke up.



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noodles_leone
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« #12 : November 17, 2020, 12:33:55 AM »

Great dream. You should have asked him his opinion on Leone. And make him admit Stanton takes lady from Shanghai too seriously.


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« #13 : November 29, 2020, 10:28:05 PM »

https://www.wellesnet.com/mank-welles-mcbride/



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« #14 : December 01, 2020, 09:20:06 AM »

I read it yesterday. Two words: off mark.

I still have to watch the movie, but so far, it looks like it's The Social Network all over again. People projecting the movie they would totally have made (but never did and never will) instead of noticing what's in front of their eyes: a work of art far more ambitous than a (bland and stupid) filmed essay about "Who's right: Eduardo or the Winklevoss? Welles or Kael?"
And i really don't understand what's so hard to get about this obvious fact.

« : December 01, 2020, 09:50:46 AM noodles_leone »

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