Sergio Leone Web Board
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
December 12, 2017, 04:38:30 PM
Home Help Search Calendar Login Register
News:


+  Sergio Leone Web Board
|-+  Films of Sergio Leone
| |-+  Once Upon A Time In The West (Moderators: cigar joe, moviesceleton, Dust Devil)
| | |-+  30 Westerns in Once
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
Pages: 1 ... 7 8 [9] 10 11 ... 13 Go Down Print
Author Topic: 30 Westerns in Once  (Read 106850 times)
dave jenkins
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13703

"One banana, two banana, three banana, four...."


View Profile
« Reply #120 on: April 26, 2007, 05:24:06 PM »

Frayling and others would have us believe that the talk about coffee between Cheyenne and Jill is a reference. I don't believe that it is a specific reference, but may allude to American Westerns in general. If you look at Westerns made in the U.S., especially in the 50s, you will find any number of them with coffee drinking scenes. This can be because coffee drinking was an important cultural activity of the 50s (and this at a time before Starbuck's and the like, when coffee making and coffee drinking were almost the same thing), but also, given the need in stories for characters to huddle about the fire while talking, a convenient bit of business to occupy the actors with.

Last night, while rewatching 7 Men From Now, I was struck by how much coffee drinking is done there. The opening scene has Randolf Scott swilling the black beverage before gunning down his two hosts. Later, in the company of Gail Russell and her husband, Scott gets several cups of joe over the space of a few days. Then there is a scene where Lee Marvin comes in out of the rain to needle Scott about Russell and give everyone generally a bad time. As he leers at Russell, Marvin says something like "Great cup of coffee, ma'am." The scene ends with violence (could coffee have something to do with death?)

I am not suggesting that the coffee drinking in OUATITW references what is done in 7MFN; I just offer that picture as an example of the many Westerns of the period that featured the use of the stimulant. I don't think SL and his screenwriters had any particular film in mind when they worked Cheyenne's coffee comments into the script. They just knew that in order to be true to the spirit of an American Western, they had to have some coffee drinking in their film.

« Last Edit: April 27, 2007, 01:49:35 PM by dave jenkins » Logged


That's what you get, Drink, for being such an annoying Melville fanboy.
marmota-b
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2934


It's perfect timing, large one...


View Profile
« Reply #121 on: April 27, 2007, 06:44:50 AM »

(could coffee have something to do with death?)

Think about the scene in FFDM, where Manco is preparing coffee (I suppose), but lets the mug drop and shoots the three Indio's men...

I agree that the coffee drinking probably wasn't a reference, just a way of having the right Western feel.
And I guess I would add such a scene to my story myself, without knowing much about how the coffee is used in AW's. Just to have the heroes doing something while they are talking.

Logged


There are two kinds of films in this world:those which stay,even when their genre is forgotten,and those which don't.
dave jenkins
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13703

"One banana, two banana, three banana, four...."


View Profile
« Reply #122 on: April 27, 2007, 01:50:34 PM »

Think about the scene in FFDM, where Manco is preparing coffee (I suppose), but lets the mug drop and shoots the three Indio's men...
Yeah, no doubt about it, that black stuff is dangerous...

Logged


That's what you get, Drink, for being such an annoying Melville fanboy.
poderator
Bandido
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 88


View Profile
« Reply #123 on: May 11, 2007, 07:09:23 AM »

I cannot believe I missed this sequence of the movie: Harmonica is ready to leave McBain farm and after "someday"moment,  we can see railroad workers all around McBain farm. Among many, two guys are digging that  tree stump, just like Shane and Joe. This is certainly direct quote from the movie "Shane". But sequence is very short (unusual for Leone Smiley) and I somehow missed it! Sad

Logged
dave jenkins
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13703

"One banana, two banana, three banana, four...."


View Profile
« Reply #124 on: May 11, 2007, 04:43:01 PM »

I missed it too, apparently. Thanks, I'll check that out.

AMC had "Night Passage" on last Saturday and I saw parts of it. A really bad film. The beginning has Stewart playing his accordion during which a fight breaks out, and afterwards he explains that he must have squeezed out some wrong notes. This might, just might, be referenced by Cheyenne in OUATITW when he warns Harmonica to watch those false notes. Interestingly, that first scene is set among a rail gang at the forward edge of a new train line.

Also saw "Last Train From Gun Hill" (1959) which Frayling thinks "West" cites. I didn't really see anything in it that reminded me of Leone (the objection to the new step-mother is a pretty conventional element). Perhaps the moment when Carolyn Jones steps down from the train is reflected in Claudia's arrival in Flagstone . . . Most of the film is a lot like "3:10 to Yuma" (1957), it has the same ridiculous plot about a guy holed up with a desperado in a hotel room waiting to catch a train. "3:10 "is most definitely quoted in "West" (Franks deadly walk on the streets of Flagstone draws from it), but since "3:10" preceded "Last Train" LT was pretty much just ripping it off. Maybe a couple of the shots showing guys on the roofs of the buildings around the hotel getting picked off inspired the similar stunts in OUATITW.....But 3:10 has that kind of thing too.......

Logged


That's what you get, Drink, for being such an annoying Melville fanboy.
dave jenkins
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13703

"One banana, two banana, three banana, four...."


View Profile
« Reply #125 on: May 18, 2007, 02:16:45 PM »

Just reviewed Peacemaker's comments in the "Night Passage" thread, to wit:

Quote
There were even some parallels between this and OUATITW such as a musical instrument to bring back memories to a bad person, railroad baron traveling everywhere in the comfort of his private car, even the bad guy tries to kill a kid  ( the bullet strikes the kid in the arm, but the point is, he tried. that never happens in AWs ).

These are astute observations, and I'm now convinced that something of "Night Passage" lives on in OUATITW.

Logged


That's what you get, Drink, for being such an annoying Melville fanboy.
The Peacemaker
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5106


OH SH*T!


View Profile
« Reply #126 on: May 19, 2007, 01:29:33 PM »

AMC had "Night Passage" on last Saturday and I saw parts of it. A really bad film.

Really?

I enjoyed it very much. One of my favorite AWs.

Logged

Groggy
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 11458


This post gets Agnew's stamp of approval!


View Profile WWW
« Reply #127 on: October 08, 2007, 10:17:02 AM »

I don't think it was mentioned yet, but Frayling says the scene with the dollar in the shot glass comes from "Two Rode Together" (rather than "Gunfight at OK Corral" as stated earlier).

Also, thinking about it, the end scene where Cheyenne/Harmonica leave is DEFINITELY based on "The Searchers", it's done differently but the two gunslingers who have no place in a domestic environment leaving - yeah, that sounds about right to me.

« Last Edit: October 08, 2007, 10:19:05 AM by Groggy » Logged


Saturday nights with Groggy
cigar joe
Moderator
Bounty Killer
*****
Online Online

Posts: 12780


easy come easy go


View Profile
« Reply #128 on: November 08, 2007, 07:14:45 AM »

Just saw another possible reference last night a modern day Western film starring Kirk Douglas called "Ace in The Hole", its about a down and out washed up newspaper reporter who is towed in his broken down convertible into Albuquerque, New Mexico. He goes into a local newspaper office to look for a job as a reporter. When he meets the editor he sees that he's wearing a belt & suspenders and Douglas makes the comment (similar to Fonda's in OUTITW) to the editor about him not trusting anything.

Story is about a man trapped in a cave and Douglas manufactures the story to get back into the big time, it was a pretty good flick.

« Last Edit: November 08, 2007, 08:55:53 AM by cigar joe » Logged

"When you feel that rope tighten on your neck you can feel the devil bite your ass"!
dave jenkins
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13703

"One banana, two banana, three banana, four...."


View Profile
« Reply #129 on: November 08, 2007, 08:00:20 AM »

Also, thinking about it, the end scene where Cheyenne/Harmonica leave is DEFINITELY based on "The Searchers", it's done differently but the two gunslingers who have no place in a domestic environment leaving - yeah, that sounds about right to me.
SL's "door motif" comes from The Searchers also. Famously. at the end of Ford's film, the cabin door swings shut, indicating Ethan Edward's exclusion from the society within. SL empties the image of symbolic content (I think), and then runs variations on doors swinging, mostly for dramatic effect, throughout OUATITW (in a variety of settings: Cattle Corner station, the trading post, Sweetwater ranch, etc.) SL resumes the practice with OUATIA, where the swinging door motif just may have been re-invested with thematic significance (the back door at Moe's, the door on the clock in Moe's back room, the door of the crypt, the choice of doors Deborah offers to Noodles at their last interview, the secret door Secretary Bailey opens for Noodles, etc.).

Logged


That's what you get, Drink, for being such an annoying Melville fanboy.
Groggy
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 11458


This post gets Agnew's stamp of approval!


View Profile WWW
« Reply #130 on: November 08, 2007, 01:12:33 PM »

Just saw another possible reference last night a modern day Western film starring Kirk Douglas called "Ace in The Hole", its about a down and out washed up newspaper reporter who is towed in his broken down convertible into Albuquerque, New Mexico. He goes into a local newspaper office to look for a job as a reporter. When he meets the editor he sees that he's wearing a belt & suspenders and Douglas makes the comment (similar to Fonda's in OUTITW) to the editor about him not trusting anything.

Story is about a man trapped in a cave and Douglas manufactures the story to get back into the big time, it was a pretty good flick.

Already been noted, but thanks anyway.

Logged


Saturday nights with Groggy
cigar joe
Moderator
Bounty Killer
*****
Online Online

Posts: 12780


easy come easy go


View Profile
« Reply #131 on: November 08, 2007, 01:22:40 PM »

I missed that one  Wink

Logged

"When you feel that rope tighten on your neck you can feel the devil bite your ass"!
Cusser
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1562


Remember, I always see the job through !


View Profile
« Reply #132 on: November 09, 2007, 09:57:15 PM »

"Ace in the Hole" sometimes goes by the name "The Big Carnival", same film.

Logged
dave jenkins
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13703

"One banana, two banana, three banana, four...."


View Profile
« Reply #133 on: December 12, 2007, 06:04:56 PM »

Johnny Guitar: The Dancing Kid and his gang enters








Logged


That's what you get, Drink, for being such an annoying Melville fanboy.
moviesceleton
Moderator
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3928


The glance that makes holes in the silver screen


View Profile
« Reply #134 on: December 13, 2007, 09:18:31 AM »

Johnny Guitar: The Dancing Kid and his gang enters

You mean the entrance of Cheyenne's gang is a reference to that scene?

Logged

"Once Upon a Time in America gets ten-minute ovation at Cannes"
Pages: 1 ... 7 8 [9] 10 11 ... 13 Go Up Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  



Visit FISTFUL-OF-LEONE.COM

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines
Page created in 0.042 seconds with 20 queries.