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Author Topic: 30 Westerns in Once  (Read 107009 times)
cigar joe
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« Reply #105 on: April 15, 2007, 08:31:30 AM »

Quote
no, it's not.

I ment that it sounds remarkably like the coyote in Red River, but then I suppose most coyote's sound alike  Wink

The ones I used to hear in Montana and here in the Catskills are not "lone" coyote calls but usually a cacaphony of yelps and howls when they are hunting in a pack and make a kill.

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« Reply #106 on: April 15, 2007, 08:49:59 PM »

cigar joe, it's in the audio artifacts around the coyote sound.
i'm an audio expert - and it's easy to suss these things for me.
ask yourself the question, why; why would anyone commit such sounds to tape if there wasn't a reason for it.
the reason is: these sounds were needed for a production. the production was SL soundtracks.

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« Reply #107 on: April 15, 2007, 09:22:46 PM »

sounds reasonable to me thanks

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« Reply #108 on: April 16, 2007, 03:21:20 AM »

I dont know if you discussed this earlier, but there is one reference in OUATIW from the movie Shane. I think maybe even direct quote. In the scene where Frank and his man appear from the bush, and as they walking towards little boy, we see the tree stump, that looks like the stump that Shane and Joe tried to cut of.

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« Reply #109 on: April 16, 2007, 03:27:17 PM »

Yea, pod you are right, that's mentioned someplace that Leone wanted it to look like there were trees around the homestead just like in Shane.

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« Reply #110 on: April 16, 2007, 04:44:40 PM »

I kinda-sorta understand why they keep all those stock sounds around, but I really think it's ridiculous.  I like some of these, like the Wilhelm Scream for instance, but others are just annoying. The *BLAM!* gunshot noise used by 20th Century Fox in pretty much all of their movies from the '50s-'70s is particularly obnoxious, especially when they indiscriminately use it for every type of gun imaginable.  I remember watching "Patton" once and being distracted by them using the same sound effect for every single gunshot. Rifle - BLAM! Pistol - BLAM! Tommy gun - BLAM! Come on, people - is it really that expensive to go out into the canyon and record your own gunshots? If Leone could do it on a $200,000 budget, why can't a big production by a major studio like "Patton"?

For that matter, when you have an extravagantly-budgeted movie, why does it matter if you can save a few hundred bucks at most by recycling a sound effect when you're already putting millions into the film?  Maybe on a lower-budgeted movie I can understand, but come on. . .

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« Reply #111 on: April 17, 2007, 05:46:17 AM »

In the commentary abot the movie OUATIW, Christopher Frayling said that their is a reference from Shane and Sergeant Rutledge. Does any of you guys know  exactly what and where in the movie that reference was?

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« Reply #112 on: April 17, 2007, 08:43:50 AM »

dave you should update this topic to correct, add, etc., to the list to get an up to date consensus, if you are up for it.  Cool
I'm your huckleberry.

Here's where I think we are at this point, and we still aren't up to 30. I'm ignoring Frayling's nuttier ideas and sticking with what is more or less the consensus here. I'll be happy to consider suggestions to add.


Ace in the Hole (1952). The belt-and-suspenders remark comes from here.

The Comancheros (1961). The names McBain and Sweetwater come from this film, as does the image of a man drinking two-handed and slowly revealing that he is handcuffed.

Firecreek (1967). A ruthless Henry Fonda and his gang come to town to torment part-time lawman Jimmy Stewart and his fellow citizens. The town of Firecreek is compared unfavorably with a prosperous nearby community, Sweetwater. Fondaís character is undoubtedly a prototype for Frank in OUATITW (SL may not have seen this film).

Fort Apache (1948). According to Sergio Leone: ďThe glacial Henry Fonda of Once Upon a Time is the legitimate son . . . of the intuition that John Ford brought to Fort Apache.Ē

Forty Guns (1957). A cinemascope Western, it employs several devices that would become SL staples, notably the ultra-close close-up of a characterís eyes. The film also ends with the title re-appearing; SL would later adopt and adapt this practice, making his audience wait for the conclusions of OUATITW and DYS to see those films christened.

High Noon (1952). Three baddies wait at a station for the noon train bringing Frank, similar to what happens at Cattle Corner at the beginning of OUATITW.

How the West Was Won (1962). There is an auction scene where Debbie Reynolds has to sell an expensive mansion for a song. The film concludes with Debbie Reynolds traveling in a four-wheel buggy through Monument valley with the Prescott family and a horse named Sam.

The Iron Horse (1924). The prototype for all railroad-building Westerns, inevitably referenced in OUATITW. The arrival of the locomotive, which travels over the top of the camera, is a direct quote. The shots of the rail gang at the end also seems inspired by the Ford picture.

Johnny Guitar (1954) Much of the plot for OUATITW comes from this picture, but there are also specific visual references. Vienna has a model of the railroad and the surrounding town; Johnny Guitar rides through railroad workers, much as Sam rides through railroad workers in OUATITW. And possibly Harmonicaís harmonica is a nod to Johnny Guitarís guitar.

Jubal (1956). Not a reference as such, perhaps, but a reaction to an exchange that occurs between Ernest Borgnine and Glenn Ford.

--You know much about women?
--I canít say I do. Why?
--Mae. Things ainít right between us. Youíve been around. Youíve seen us. You know anything I can do to make her like me better? Of course, I canít change this ugly face none but maybe some things I do, I donít do right.
--Thereís a lot of things a man does that bother a woman.
--Like what?
--Like slurping coffee out of a saucer.
--Yeah?
--Spitting. Scratching. Whacking her on the behind when she isnít looking.
--Why, I always do that.
--You mean, in front of company?
--Why sure, if I just swat her in privateó
--Do you think she likes being swatted?
--Donít all women? Shows them you love them, donít it?
--There are other ways, you know, Shep.
--Of course! Why, thatís exactly whatís been bothering her.
--Thatís right. Sheís just fed up with being whacked on the rump.
--Thanks for the tip, Jube.

Itís likely that SL used the following speech, from Cheyenne to Jill, as his response to the above: ďYou know what? If I was you Iíd go down there and give those boys a drink. Canít imagine how happy it makes a man to see a woman like you. Just to look at her. And if one of them should, uh, pat your behind, just make believe itís nothing. They earned it.Ē

The Quiet Man (1952). The final flashback in OUATITW is shot and edited in such a way as to resemble the flashback of John Wayne killing a man in the ring.

The Last Sunset (1961). Kirk Douglas and Rock Hudson square off for a duel at the end that some feel was the model for the showdown between Harmonica and Frank.

Last Train From Gun Hill (1958): Anthony Quinnís son does not approve of his fatherís remarriage to an ex-dance-hall girl. In OUATITW, the oldest McBain boy similarly objects to his fatherís remarriage.

Man of the West (1958) Julie London has her dance hall clothes ripped off her; perhaps this inspired the scene in OUATITW where Harmonica tears off part of Jillís clothing.

The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance (1962). Lee Marvin, Lee Van Cleef, and Strother Martin terrorize town residents during a local election meeting, similar to the way Frankís men act in the auction scene in OUATITW.

My Darling Clementine (1946). The climactic shoot out at the OK Corral unfolds with sound effects but no music, undoubtedly a precursor to the ďsilentĒ opening sequence in OUATITW. Menacing men in dusters appear here as well.

Night Passage (1957). Jimmy Stewart is The Man With the Accordion.

The Paleface (1922). Jack Elamís duel with the fly in OUATITW is an homage to Buster Keatonís butterfly problem in this film.

Pursued (1947). Frayling suggests the recurring flashback structure in OUATITW is copied from the one used here. Since SL had already used the device in FAFDM, however, it might be just as appropriate to say Leone is quoting himself.

Red River (1948). There is a moment in the film when Clift slides a lantern across a darkened room to dramatically reveal Joann Druís face, an effect later used by Leoneówhen Cheyenne first confronts Harmonicaóin OUATITW.

Run of the Arrow (1957). Charles Bronson plays a mute Indian boy who communicates by playing his harmonica. This is a  possible inspiration for the character Harmonica in OUATITW.

The Searchers (1956). Aaron Edwards sees suspicious signs in the desert surrounding his house just prior to the massacre (for example, the partridges fly away as if spooked). This is clearly referenced in OUATITW just prior to the McBain massacre. Also, the shot of Scar from the girlís POV after the massacre is similar to the one Timmy has of Frank after his family is killed. Finally, it may be Ford's use of back-lit doors in this film that inspired SL to begin his own doors fixation.

Shane (1952). Joey Starrett mimes the stalking of a deer, rifle in hand. In OUATITW, Timmy McBain mimes shooting birds.

3:10 To Yuma (1957). Glenn Ford whistles the title theme to pass the time. The sequence in OUATITW where Fonda is stalked by his own men in the streets of Flagstone is appropriated and adapted from the climactic sequence in 3:10 where Fordís men come to free him. And of course, in OUATITW, Keenan Wynn decides to send Cheyenne to a ďmodern jailĒ in Yuma.

Warlock (1959). Fonda kicks a crutch out from beneath a cripple who has annoyed him, similar to what he does to Morton in OUATITW.

« Last Edit: April 17, 2007, 05:58:38 PM by dave jenkins » Logged


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« Reply #113 on: April 17, 2007, 07:29:45 PM »

great job and thanks!

Well we are up to 25 for sure, I do think the big tree stump should go in the Shane quote also.

I haven't seen Sergeant Rutledge is such a long time pod so I don't know about that one, I barely remember it.

« Last Edit: April 17, 2007, 07:35:41 PM by cigar joe » Logged

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« Reply #114 on: April 19, 2007, 04:26:31 PM »

In the commentary abot the movie OUATIW, Christopher Frayling said that their is a reference from Shane and Sergeant Rutledge. Does any of you guys know  exactly what and where in the movie that reference was?

The "Sergeant Rutledge" reference was the scene where Jill stands vigil at night with her shotgun. Constance Towers does basically the same thing in a scene after an Indian attack.

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« Reply #115 on: April 19, 2007, 05:27:09 PM »

Is it a clear reference, or something that's merely coincidental? (I haven't seen it so I can't judge.....)

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« Reply #116 on: April 20, 2007, 05:32:41 AM »

Thanks alot Groggy, I didn't know that Wink

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« Reply #117 on: April 20, 2007, 05:27:48 PM »

Is it a clear reference, or something that's merely coincidental? (I haven't seen it so I can't judge.....)

I've not seen the film in a long time, but I vaguely remember it. It's at least as clear as the Liberty Valance reference with the auction scene (though as I said the dusters worn by Lee Marvin and Co. is the more recognizable reference).

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« Reply #118 on: April 23, 2007, 12:50:30 AM »

I watched commentary again and I think that Frayling said OUATIW has the same ending  as "Sergeant Rutlidge" and Shane. That "Someday" line at the end of the movie. So  does anyone know what kind of "goodbye ending" Sergeant Rutlidge has?

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« Reply #119 on: April 23, 2007, 04:39:37 PM »

There was a line where Woody Strode and one of the other black troopers were discussing something, and Strode said something about "Some day". I remember the line by the other trooper: "It's always someday, isn't it, Brax?" or something to that affect.

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