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Author Topic: Zapata Westerns  (Read 44847 times)
mike siegel
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« Reply #45 on: November 19, 2006, 04:39:51 PM »

Howdy Tim!

great still. I have about 300 on DUNDEE - this one not Smiley
I have great problems with the film. Before the DVD we need to sell it to some (bigger) channel, to pay for the clips in the film. Although everybody seems to love it and it already plays internationally on Festivals, nobody wants to buy it.
Either way there'll be a DVD next year (not before spring). PASSION premiered in Munich last year. Along the festival launched the new DUNDEE cut in Europe, on a HUGE screen. That was something. Much better film now, isn't it?

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mike siegel
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« Reply #46 on: November 19, 2006, 04:44:41 PM »


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Tim
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« Reply #47 on: November 19, 2006, 11:09:32 PM »

  Hi Mike, great photo there of Heston and Harris.  Thanks for sharing!  And I've always been a fan of Major Dundee, but I love it even more after seeing the Extended Version with those 12 additional minutes, especially the strategy scene toward the end.

  Keep us updated with your film and its dvd release.  I know I'm not the only Peckinpah fan around here who would be interested in buying a copy.  Good luck finding a bigger company!

  And thanks again for sharing that still!  Would love to see more if you don't mind posting them, but no pressure.   Grin

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mike siegel
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« Reply #48 on: November 20, 2006, 03:07:40 AM »

yeah, it's another film now. still only the mutilated version that made him shaking after the preview in 1964 ('it's only a movie, Sam..' 'It's my fucking life!');
but so much better than the version they then released. He probably (hopefully) never saw that.
The new soundtrack is better (especially since some scenes by now do not have any music anylonger - they don't need them - battle etc.) but sounds a bit like silent film music. still an improvement over 'Folllloow behind the major..' Smiley

Maybe you'd enjoy my book on Peckinpah (1050 stills)..


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Tim
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« Reply #49 on: November 21, 2006, 10:17:29 AM »

  Is that a wrap party, mike?  From Harris' and Coburn's outfit, and Senta looking great  Cheesy, it looks like it is near the fandango scene.

  And I may be in the minority, but I like the original score better.  At first, I really liked Caliendo's score but on future viewings, it wasn't as good.  The most notable scene is the final battle in the river, it seems SO QUIET!  I do agree the Major Dundee March is out of place, but other than that I prefer the original score.

  What's the title of your book?  I'll be sure to look for it, amigo!

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mike siegel
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« Reply #50 on: November 21, 2006, 10:59:12 AM »

Garner Simmons writes in his book it was Harris' birthday party. I disagree, by October shooting was over for months. I'd say they celebrate his Academy Award nomination early in '64...

The book is called
PASSION & POETRY - SAM PECKINPAH IN PICTURES
there's a look inside on my website 
www.eldorado-film.de

Well, the music... as with PAT GARRETT - films doomed from the beginning. There you have 3 cuts - al wrong, here you have two scores, both mediocre.


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cigar joe
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« Reply #51 on: October 10, 2007, 09:52:42 PM »

I think I'll be reviving this thread on films that we call Zapata Westerns and those that reference the MexRev.

will add:

The Wild Bunch
The Professionals
And Starring Pancho Villa as Himself
They Came to Cordura
Pancho Villa

Still need to see "The Treasure of Pancho Villa" with Brian Kieth

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Ben Tyreen
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« Reply #52 on: October 10, 2007, 10:39:55 PM »

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Still need to see "The Treasure of Pancho Villa" with Brian Kieth

  joe, do you mean the movie of the same title with Rory Calhoun and Gilbert Roland?  The only Villa related movie with Brian Keith I could find is called "Villa!"  Treasure of Pancho Villa is an excellent, way above average B-western, and a great ending too!  I caught it on TCM last summer and loved it, but haven't seen it in their schedule since.

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« Reply #53 on: October 11, 2007, 06:34:17 AM »

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joe, do you mean the movie of the same title with Rory Calhoun and Gilbert Roland?  The only Villa related movie with Brian Keith I could find is called "Villa!"  Treasure of Pancho Villa is an excellent, way above average B-western, and a great ending too!  I caught it on TCM last summer and loved it, but haven't seen it in their schedule since.

Yea got them mixed up Kieth is in "Villa!" still have to see those two and all of "The Wrath of God" (just caught the beginning of that), then I think my Zapata viewings will be complete.

Also forgot to add Louis Malle's Bardot & Moreau film the name of which escapes me for the moment.

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Ben Tyreen
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« Reply #54 on: October 11, 2007, 11:38:58 AM »

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Yea got them mixed up Kieth is in "Villa!" still have to see those two and all of "The Wrath of God" (just caught the beginning of that), then I think my Zapata viewings will be complete.

  I'm a big fan of The Wrath of God so hopefully you enjoy the rest of the movie.  It kinda goes haywire a little past the midway point, but it's just an entertaining film, and Robert Mitchum is excellent.  Come to think of it, I like the whole cast. Grin

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« Reply #55 on: October 11, 2007, 08:09:53 PM »

As I said in the Rate the Last... thread, I watched Bullet for the General today. As this is generally considered one of the better spaghettis I was hoping I'd enjoy it more than I did.

Now really, this movie had an intriguing premise but just didn't have the interest necessary to keep it going for two hours. The version I saw of it had terrible dubbing (although I assume that comes with the territory), the guy they got to do Gian Maria Volonte was horrible (or maybe I'm just too used to Paul Frees from his Leone work). The action scenes were good but not spectacular. And the political commentary was at best sophomoric.

That being said, I found it reasonably entertaining, and would give it a lot higher of a score if it weren't for the stupid ass ending. Why does Chuncho give a long rambling speech on why he has to kill Tate but he doesn't know why? That scene completely bombed for me. From what I'd read of the scene beforehand I had expected that Chuncho would shoot him in the back as he were leaving or something, certainly the fact that he telegraphed what he was going to do, not only to the audience but to his victim, significantly lessened this scene's impact. GMV was good in the lead (well, what got through the dubbing), Lou Castel was as bland and wooden as humanly possible, and Klaus Kinski was wasted, although his grenade-throwing scene was excellent.

I'll be generous and give it a 6/10.

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Silenzio
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« Reply #56 on: October 11, 2007, 08:18:43 PM »

I like the last scene.


I agree that it's an interesting premise that could have been done a lot better, I gave it a three out of four.  Check out SARTANA next if you want to see real spag excellence.

P.S. Yes, poor dubbing comes with the territory.

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« Reply #57 on: October 11, 2007, 08:27:53 PM »

I like the idea of the last scene. I knew beforehand it was going to happened, but I just think it was dumb that Chuncho gave a long speech on "Oh, I must kill you. Why? Quen Sabe?" blah blah blah and then shot him in the stomach. I would have liked it if he had shot him in the back or something as he was getting on the train.

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Jill
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« Reply #58 on: October 12, 2007, 04:04:49 AM »

Well, I like ZWs. They had an unique world. And very typical elements  Wink

- the gringo (have anybody seen a ZW ever without a gringo who does a lot of confusion?)
- the sadist mexican general/colonel (typically on the bad side, but I've seen some bandits too who say themselves freedom fighters... like Mongo in Companeros.
- the car (almost red)
- the explosions
- the machine gun
- the firing squad... (they can only shoot lesser characters. Never a hero, he would be saved.)
- the good, but a bit naive Mexican Rebel who befriends with the gringo
- in some cases, German officers
- the little Mexican boy

This historical timeline is very good. I think I will save it and learn it... I'm writing stories about it, I must know the fact, who, where, when...

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Ben Tyreen
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« Reply #59 on: October 12, 2007, 11:41:11 AM »

Quote
- the gringo (have anybody seen a ZW ever without a gringo who does a lot of confusion?)
- the sadist mexican general/colonel (typically on the bad side, but I've seen some bandits too who say themselves freedom fighters... like Mongo in Companeros.
- the car (almost red)
- the explosions
- the machine gun
- the firing squad... (they can only shoot lesser characters. Never a hero, he would be saved.)
- the good, but a bit naive Mexican Rebel who befriends with the gringo
- in some cases, German officers
- the little Mexican boy

  That's pretty dead on, jill.   Smiley  Anyone making a Zapata western now could use that list as a Moviemaking 101 class.  Just about any movie I think of has at least seven or eight of those characteristics. Grin

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