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Author Topic: Shenandoah (1965)  (Read 7123 times)
Groggy
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« Reply #15 on: April 09, 2011, 09:34:50 PM »

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he just says: this is not my war. I owe nothing to the State of Virginia and I'm not gonna fight to maintain slavery when I thrived only on my forces and those of my children.


That's not pacifism?

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« Reply #16 on: April 09, 2011, 10:35:50 PM »



That's not pacifism?

No, it's pure individualism.

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« Reply #17 on: April 09, 2011, 10:47:12 PM »

Not inherently opposed ideas.

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« Reply #18 on: April 10, 2011, 02:09:36 AM »

Not inherently opposed ideas.

In the case in object they are very distinct.

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« Reply #19 on: July 25, 2013, 03:11:12 AM »

As I see it, pacifism is basically being against all wars, period.

But if someone just says, 'I don't want to fight a war that I don't believe in, this has nothing to do with me, just cuz some politicians in Virginia or the South or anywhere wanna fight, I don't have to fight if I see no reason to,' that's not necessarily pacifism. I could see the Stewart character fighting in another war that he does believe in. So, I wouldn't necessarily call him a pacifist.

some of you mentioned comparisons to The Patriot. The Mel Gibson character in The Patriot, him I definitely call a pacifist (at least in the beginning of the movie, of course). Though he believes in the cause of liberty and is against taxation without representation, he does not agree that just because you believe in a cause, that justifies fighting over it. IMO, Gibson's character can definitely be called a pacifist, Stewart's in Shenandoah not necessarily.

Was The Patriot ripped off of here? Could be, although there's a very important difference between the two: Stewart never joins the war he just leads his own army; I thought that was pretty funny, how he is like a general leading his own army! while Gibson's character actually joins the militia and becomes a big war hero.

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« Reply #20 on: July 25, 2013, 03:17:15 AM »

Anyway, I just saw Shenandoah for the first time, and IMO, y'all are way off base. This movie definitely gets a 7/10. I can appreciate how much you hate A.V. McLaglen, and  believe me, I have nothing good to say about the director of Bandolero!, but this is a good movie. Not without some glaring flaws,But I liked it a lot more than some of y'all.

IMO this is not really a war movie, nor is it a Western. This is a family drama, plain and simple. About an individualist, as titoli said above. A guy who just cares about family. I see this above all else as a family drama.

First things first: Jimmy Stewart is simply unbelievable here. As always, he is a joy to watch from the first moment to the last.
But hey, it's superfluous to even mention that. I mean, he is Jimmy Stewart.


I don't know all the Civil War history, so I can't comment on that; I'll leave that to the history buffs; but yeah, I had an idea that all males in the South would have been drafted into the Confederate Army; that's way to big to ignore - that is awful.

One of my biggest problems with the movie is the music that plays during the scene where the family is fighting with the government horse thieves: it could be a good serious fight, but they have this comedic music playing that turns the scene into a big joke, as if this was McLintock or something. This movie is a drama all the way, and that music turning the scene into a comedy is absolutely unforgivable.

The scene with George Kennedy - come on, this guy walks into the camp, gets an immediate audience with the general or captain or whomever he is, and says his boy was taken away though he's not a soldier, and Kennedy instantly writes him a letter? In middle of a war, he just takes the man's word for it that his son really isn't a soldier, and writes him a letter saying he should be freed? Come on. Puhleez. And once he does write him the letter, then he gives it to the captain or whomever that was at the station, and the guy ignores the letter from Kennedy, some big military officer? No friggin' way. No friggin' way. And then the family burns the track - and all the soldiers guarding the train - every one of them - leaves the train and runs to look, and with their rifles pointed at the family, suddenly the family points their rifles at the soldiers and say "drop your weapons!" and all the soldiers do so! n  Roll Eyes Grin

Finally, when the Boy escapes the POW camp, why the hell does he spend all that time hiding and running away with the other escaped POW's? he should just throw away that damn cap that got him in trouble in the first place, and boom!, he's a free man! Throw away that cap and walk home! But of course, it works conveniently for the cinematic moment when he's on the battlefield and discovered by his black friend in a Union uniform.

They got really nice locations for the movie, it was beautiful to look at, the image on the dvd is perfect. For the most part, the performances were very solid up and down the line (with the exception of Patrick Wayne, who is my least favorite actor in the history of Westerns), and overall, I think this movie works well about a family man and individualist. I don't think the anti-war stuff ever got too preachy; as I said, Stewart's point wasn't so much about how evil war is (until his final "chat" at his wife's grave), but much more about how it's damn foolish to blindly follow the state into a war just because it declares war. His discussion with that Confederate captain who comes to try to take his sons, that I really liked, and that's the key point: they're not Virginia's sons, they're my sons! I think that brief conversation, nothing too long or preachy, just those brief few lines beautifully sum up his belief on war, which I think is that he is not against war per se, but against the idea that you have to join the war that you don't believe in, just because the state declares war.

« Last Edit: July 25, 2013, 03:52:41 AM by drinkanddestroy » Logged

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