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Author Topic: Vera Cruz (1954)  (Read 16150 times)
Groggy
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« Reply #15 on: October 20, 2007, 11:01:39 PM »

Saw this again today, its ok, nothing all that great except for its influences. Burt has a great smile. The supporting players were ok, not as good as some of Aldrich's other films "kiss Me Deadly" and "Emperor of the North", agreed.


Disagree, I thought it was totally bitchin'. Tongue

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dave jenkins
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« Reply #16 on: October 21, 2007, 02:18:18 AM »

Too bad we don't have this movie is a decent form. The current DVD really sucks.

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« Reply #17 on: October 21, 2007, 11:11:27 AM »

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Too bad we don't have this movie is a decent form. The current DVD really sucks.

  Were you able to watch it on TCM yesterday, Dave?  That looked like a pretty good print of the movie, but I don't know if it's the one used on the DVD.  If you saw it, we could compare.  Maybe there is a really good print out there. 

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« Reply #18 on: October 21, 2007, 11:52:24 AM »

Too bad we don't have this movie is a decent form. The current DVD really sucks.

I found it perfectly adequate, Dave. Are you bootlegging films again? Roll Eyes

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dave jenkins
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« Reply #19 on: October 21, 2007, 08:38:24 PM »

Don't have TCM, so I didn't see it. It's very possible they have a better print, although, do TV networks actually run film anymore? Maybe they have a disc of a better transfer that isn't available to us yet . . .

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« Reply #20 on: October 21, 2007, 10:27:29 PM »

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Don't have TCM, so I didn't see it. It's very possible they have a better print, although, do TV networks actually run film anymore? Maybe they have a disc of a better transfer that isn't available to us yet . . .

  I'm not really sure, and not having the DVD, I can't compare but I thought the TCM print was pretty good for a 50+ year old movie.  But on to my complaints.

  One of the biggest things that bothers me about movies is when what happens to a character isn't resolved, as in whether they lived or died.  It seems lazy to me that a director couldn't just include a quick shot of someone dying or living.  I started a whole debate on the subject at the Major Dundee board at IMDB about which characters made it.  (We figured Dub Taylor gets killed by the way  Wink).

  In Vera Cruz, Joe Erin's gang is not really dealt with in the end.  Pittsburgh, Donnegan, and Ballad all buy it during the attack on the fortress but what about Jack Elam and James Seay (Abilene, the kinda dandy gambler-looking fellow)?  It seems so simple to add something, and granted they're not huge characters but they're seen throughout the movie and have lines.  Maybe things were lost in the editing process, but its one of my big pet peeves when it comes to movies.  Angry  This ends my rant.  Smiley

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« Reply #21 on: October 22, 2007, 09:46:27 AM »

I kind of agree, and I remember participating in that Dundee thread. Wink When I watched the last battle (maybe I wasn't paying attention) I only noticed Borgnine and Archie Savage getting killed, I didn't even see the others.

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Ben Tyreen
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« Reply #22 on: October 22, 2007, 01:16:53 PM »

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I kind of agree, and I remember participating in that Dundee thread.  When I watched the last battle (maybe I wasn't paying attention) I only noticed Borgnine and Archie Savage getting killed, I didn't even see the others.

  We dominated that thread, my friend.   Grin

  And Bronson is real quick.  It's at the first Gatling Gun pit.  He gets shot in a fairly close camera shot and then is shown tumbling over the wall.  It's a "don't blink or you'll miss it" type scene.

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« Reply #23 on: March 15, 2008, 11:45:34 AM »

 Watched the end of this on TCM yesterday morning and noticed something for the first time.  The fortress Coop, Lancaster and Co. attack at the end with the Mexican rebels is the same location/set as Tomas De La Plata's hacienda in The Wrath of God, 18 years or so later.  It's changed a bit obviously but the entrance with the high pillars and the square where Trane and Erin have their showdown at the end is right where the finale to TWOG is.  I don't know how many people have seen Wrath other than FC, but thought I'd point this out. Afro

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« Reply #24 on: March 15, 2008, 04:53:27 PM »

I had it set to record when it was on TMC but I flubbed the time or was recording two films and just got the barest beginning of it maybe 5-10 minutes, but I'd like to see it. Gotta wait for it to be on TCM again  Wink

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« Reply #25 on: March 16, 2008, 05:29:02 AM »

I don't know how many people have seen Wrath other than FC, but thought I'd point this out. Afro
I've seen both WRATH OF GOD and VERA CRUZ fairly recently.

VERA CRUZ is entertaining enough and yeah Leone possibly borrowed the fragile double crossing relationship of Coopers and Lancasters characters for his westerns.

But (again with a Mexican Revolution theme) i'd say  that WRATH OF GOD is the better movie. Afro 

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« Reply #26 on: March 16, 2008, 05:54:06 AM »

I think it's a bit more than "probable" Leone borrowed things from Vera Cruz. I believe he acknowledged the film as one of his biggest influences.

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« Reply #27 on: March 16, 2008, 02:53:29 PM »

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But (again with a Mexican Revolution theme) i'd say  that WRATH OF GOD is the better movie.   

 Agreed, I like Wrath of God more than Vera Cruz.  Now where's the MGM DVD for it?!  Roll Eyes

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« Reply #28 on: September 19, 2008, 03:13:32 PM »

I finally got around to see this, just a few things I noticed:

Lancaster's wristbrace had to be the inspiration for Clint's in FAFDM.

The passage in the VC's opening moments is very reminiscent of the intro to FAFDM.

Leone had to be influenced by the sharpshooting in his dollars trilogy.

The scene in the first 15 mins when Cooper gets into a tiff with Borgnine reminds me of all the bar confrontations in FAFDM.

OUATITW connection: Ernie Borgnine's pants seem identical to Cheyanne's. At the very least, a similar stlye with the stripes.

The bridge scene in which Cooper and Lancaster lose the gold feels very similar to the bridge explosion scene from DYS.

The scene before the raid/shootout seems right out of the Wild Bunch, when Holden and company ride out of the village.

Overall, not a great movie but it has its share of brilliant moments, much like The Last Sunset. Aldrich had to be one of Serge's biggest inspirations, as it seems that his films share more in common with Aldrich than Ford. If anything, a rocky foundation for what was to come for the genre.

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« Reply #29 on: September 19, 2008, 05:51:32 PM »

The scene where our heroes are surrounded by a company of hidden Juaristas was also borrowed for use in The Wild Bunch.

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