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Author Topic: GIVE ME WESTERNS THAT LEONE COULD HAVE DONE A BETTER JOB WITH  (Read 19392 times)
Tim
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« Reply #15 on: April 27, 2006, 11:36:22 PM »

  How about Red River, or at least the ending?  Its a great movie, one of Wayne's best, and then that really lackluster ending. 

  Figure Leone rarely used women in his movies with a few exceptions, so I'm thinking there's no way Joanne Dru even makes an appearance in Red River with director Sergio Leone.

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« Reply #16 on: April 28, 2006, 05:17:22 AM »

Well I'm sure Leone would've gotten rid of (or at least shut up) Kim Darby.  Grin

Here Here! She pretty much ruined this movie for me. + I like the ending of Red River though I agree it does divert and differ in tone to what has become before it. But did you know the only version released on DVD at the moment is the television version with shots of a book inserted in for narration instead of a voice over by Walter Brennan.

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« Reply #17 on: April 28, 2006, 06:52:53 AM »

I think the jist of the question was Westerns that weren't all  that good that could have benefitted from Leone
I'm not convinced that Leone would be up to the job of improving any of the American westerns mentioned so far and certainly ones like True Grit or Sons of Katie Elder because for one thing Leone appeared to not like or be able to handle properly involving women in his westerns(Jill McBain was a concession i understand).When you look at his westerns the women were either a whore or a barmaid - his emphasis tended to be on action,pace and innovative camera angles and this sort of agenda would not have fitted in with the" moms apple pie " like American storylines.
Now the substitution of a Morricone soundtrack-that would be another matter altogether!

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« Reply #18 on: April 28, 2006, 12:51:05 PM »

I think the main problem with True Grit is that the casting of Kim Darby

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« Reply #19 on: April 28, 2006, 04:06:17 PM »

  How about Red River, or at least the ending?  Its a great movie, one of Wayne's best, and then that really lackluster ending. 

  Figure Leone rarely used women in his movies with a few exceptions, so I'm thinking there's no way Joanne Dru even makes an appearance in Red River with director Sergio Leone.
Believe me, you want Joanne Dru in Red River. You want women in every Hawkes film.

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« Reply #20 on: April 28, 2006, 04:11:57 PM »

I think the main problem with True Grit is that the casting of Kim Darby
And yet, it's her greatest role. Kim Darby was never one of my favorite actresses (by a long shot), but she is faithful to the character she played in True Grit (again, read the book). Consider the young actresses available to an American director in 68-69, then tell me who would have been better casting.

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« Reply #21 on: April 28, 2006, 04:24:01 PM »

Dont get me wrong I love "High Noon", but Leone could have improved on it. Especially the pay-off gunfight at the end which is a bit of a disappointment.
High Noon is entirely antithetical to Leone's method. In fact, it is People's Exhibit #1 in the case to be made against the Hollywood westerns of the 50s. Why wait through the whole movie just to get to a single gundown? Leone knew that his audience wanted gunplay at least every 10 minutes, and he devised films that would provide just that. And he wasn't interested in delivering a civics lesson disguised as entertainment, either. SL might have referenced High Noon in OUATITW, but the film was really far, far beneath him.

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« Reply #22 on: April 28, 2006, 04:33:58 PM »

  How about Red River, or at least the ending?  Its a great movie, one of Wayne's best, and then that really lackluster ending. 

The original ending...from the novel written by Charles Schnee...was changed...& should not have been...it's my only problem w/ Red River...but I guess the studio powers that be figured the darker ending wouldn't have gone over in 1948.


In the original story, Dunson's wound - from Cherry - causes him to collapse, and he soon dies. Matt and Tess bury him in Texas beside the Red River.

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« Reply #23 on: April 28, 2006, 08:18:49 PM »

And yet, it's her greatest role. Kim Darby was never one of my favorite actresses (by a long shot), but she is faithful to the character she played in True Grit (again, read the book). Consider the young actresses available to an American director in 68-69, then tell me who would have been better casting.

That is true but for me it still doesn't change my mind that I don't like her in that role and her stilted and unconvincing line delivery does more harm to the film then good. This is my opinion and I know people who don't agree with me.

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Tim
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« Reply #24 on: April 29, 2006, 12:24:47 AM »

  dave, I'm curious, why do you think Joanne Dru should be in Red River?  I'm a big fan of Hawkes westerns, Rio Bravo is one of my faves and I like Angie Dickinson, but I really dislike Dru's performance in Red River.

  That ridiculous little wince she makes when she gets hit by the arrow and that just too happy of an ending with her reaming Tom and Matt is just too concise.

  So why do you feel the opposite?  Like I said, just curious.   Smiley

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« Reply #25 on: April 29, 2006, 02:30:27 AM »

Surely a better Italian candidate for improving an American western would be Ducci Tessari because on evidence of the wonderful Pistol For Ringo,like most of the American directors Tessari was able to employ all the hallmarks of the American western but with the added sw ingredient of the Fernando Sanchez led bandits,the extra violence and of course the Morricone soundtrack.Tessari proves here he is more than able to effectively use the family and women(without portraying them as a whore or lusty barmaid) in his westerns and like the best American directors his emphasis is more on character rather than action although theres still plenty of this in both Pistol For Ringo and also the Return Of Ringo.

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« Reply #26 on: April 29, 2006, 02:33:11 AM »

Fernando Sanchez

Fernando Sancho.

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« Reply #27 on: April 29, 2006, 02:35:39 AM »

Smartass Grin

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« Reply #28 on: April 29, 2006, 02:39:57 AM »

Smartass Grin


 Wink

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« Reply #29 on: April 29, 2006, 11:18:04 AM »

  dave, I'm curious, why do you think Joanne Dru should be in Red River?  I'm a big fan of Hawkes westerns, Rio Bravo is one of my faves and I like Angie Dickinson, but I really dislike Dru's performance in Red River.

  That ridiculous little wince she makes when she gets hit by the arrow and that just too happy of an ending with her reaming Tom and Matt is just too concise.

  So why do you feel the opposite?  Like I said, just curious.   Smiley
I don't mind Dru's performance, but I wasn't really thinking of her over other possible actresses. I'm sure that any number of women could have done the job (although Dru really knows how to take an arrow in the arm). I was just saying that in RR (as in all of Hawkes's films) a female lead adds a lot (and is perhaps essential).

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