Sergio Leone Web Board
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
October 23, 2017, 10:12:19 PM
Home Help Search Calendar Login Register
News:


+  Sergio Leone Web Board
|-+  Films of Sergio Leone
| |-+  Other Films (Moderators: cigar joe, moviesceleton, Dust Devil)
| | |-+  Westerns:Eastwood versus Peckinpah
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 ... 7 Go Down Print
Poll
Question: Who's westerns do you prefer?
Clint Eastwood   -7 (53.8%)
Sam Peckinpah   -6 (46.2%)
Total Voters: 10

Author Topic: Westerns:Eastwood versus Peckinpah  (Read 21292 times)
The Firecracker
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 9672


Rub me the wrong way, and I'll go off in your face


View Profile
« Reply #15 on: June 05, 2006, 06:00:37 PM »

Wow can't wait to see that.


dont get your hopes up! look what happened to Arizona Colt when he saw CWC.

Logged



The Official COMIN' AT YA! re-release site
http://cominatyanoir3d.com/
Banjo
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4428


Don't you like music with your supper?


View Profile
« Reply #16 on: June 05, 2006, 06:04:54 PM »

yeah I would have to say the opening to the Wild Bunch is wonderful but when the bunch visits the mexican village the film is a bust and after that nothing remotley interesting happens until the final climax.
I hate the opening with that "We're go marching down the river" crap.The intro to something like Pistol For Ringo is light years superior and you get Morricone .
Yes what follows the intro is even more dire-sorry even the main actors Holden and Ryan lack any charisma to rescue this movie from tedium-i'd rather watch Gods Gun. Grin

Logged
Banjo
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4428


Don't you like music with your supper?


View Profile
« Reply #17 on: June 05, 2006, 06:07:05 PM »

dont get your hopes up! look what happened to Arizona Colt when he saw CWC.
Yeah but we're talking Corbucci here not Peckinpah Grin

Logged
The Firecracker
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 9672


Rub me the wrong way, and I'll go off in your face


View Profile
« Reply #18 on: June 05, 2006, 06:08:53 PM »

Yeah but we're talking Corbucci here not Peckinpah Grin

true.

Logged



The Official COMIN' AT YA! re-release site
http://cominatyanoir3d.com/
Leone Admirer
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2476


Filmmaker with a fiery passion for films


View Profile
« Reply #19 on: June 05, 2006, 07:15:47 PM »

My mind won't be changed, but I respect all your opinions regarding the Bunch.

Logged

Films: You cant just love them, you've gotta adore them!
Banjo
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4428


Don't you like music with your supper?


View Profile
« Reply #20 on: June 06, 2006, 03:06:09 AM »

I notice that Peckinpah with Major Dundee went the dumbass route in relying on false stereotypes by insultingly portraying Native American Indians as savages.
In Outlaw Josey Wales Eastwood sets right that tired out old cliche and i just love the old Indian chief character(with the top hat) who Lincoln has tried but ultimately failed to "civilise"  by telling him to  "endeavour to persevere".

Logged
Leone Admirer
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2476


Filmmaker with a fiery passion for films


View Profile
« Reply #21 on: June 06, 2006, 05:21:42 AM »

It has to be admited that Peckinpah was way over his head when he made Major Dundee. I agree the stereotyping is off and I wont make any excuses for it. Whilst I'm not comparing the two, (and I love Stagecoach more), Stagecoah also goes for the stereotype route regarding Indians.

Logged

Films: You cant just love them, you've gotta adore them!
Banjo
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4428


Don't you like music with your supper?


View Profile
« Reply #22 on: June 06, 2006, 06:26:18 AM »

The lack of a decent supporting cast didn't help much either. 
You have got to be kidding.I don't know the actors name(but the same faces tend to appear in Clints films) but the dwarf ,bungling sheriff,neurotic barber,greedy hotel manager and his remorseful wife, hypocritical priest,scheming Stacys girl,Stacy and his cronies etc are all very colourful characters and extremely well performed by the actors.
I read Clints biography and its said that he(like Leone) as a director was an expert in getting the best out of his staple of actors,he was never controlling-prefered to rely on instinct to let the scenes flow and was very well respected.Apart from maybe Coburn and Kristopherson i gather that Peckinpah wasn't very much liked or respected at all by his actors and had major falling outs with the likes of Charlton Heston(didn't Heston have to take over the helm with Major Dundee or something?) and Susan George.
I think the results of the actors respect for Eastwoods technique shine throughout his movies which never lull in entertainment value unlike Peckinpah.

Logged
Groggy
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 11458


This post gets Agnew's stamp of approval!


View Profile WWW
« Reply #23 on: June 06, 2006, 07:31:07 AM »

But they're either bad actors or had poorly written parts.  I didn't care one bit for any of the characters, including Clint.  I know that was the intent, but that doesn't make the film better.

The criticisms of TWB and "Major Dundee" are just off.  Do we really need to get into the "evil Indians" argument again?  Suffice it to say, there WERE Indians that were bloodthirsty killers, and Southwestern Indians like the Apaches and Comanches committed a great number of atrocities against whites and other tribes as well.  The movie never posits that every single Indian is a savage, just the ones being pursued by Dundee.  My God, it's a movie!

And I'm not sure how I can rebut the criticisms of TWB presented here.

Quote
Any idiot can spend millions to provide the biggest bunch of shootouts and explosions like Peckinpah.Bigger does not mean better.


No offense, but have you even SEEN "The Wild Bunch"?  You complain about "lack of" character development, yet you find everything between the bookend shootouts boring?  I don't know what to say to that.

Logged


Saturday nights with Groggy
dave jenkins
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13637

"One banana, two banana, three banana, four...."


View Profile
« Reply #24 on: June 06, 2006, 10:14:43 AM »

The acid test: whose films can you watch over and over again with enjoyment? The answer: Peckinpah's.

By contrast, there are many Eastwood films (perhaps all?) that do not bear repeat viewings. I have watched HPD several times, but I don't particularly ever want to see it again. The same goes for TOJW and PR. Unforgiven has sequences that I enjoy, and I sometimes play those on the DVD, but I never feel the need to watch the film through from start to finish.

Eastwood's mise-en-scene tends to be about as interesting as what you get on TV, and characters written for him would seem to be intended for that enervated medium as well.  Eastwood as an actor does really well in other people's films (Don's and Sergio's, particularly), but he's pretty dull in his own projects. As a director, he's right up there with Ron Howard.

Logged


That's what you get, Drink, for getting out of bed this morning.
Beebs
Guest
« Reply #25 on: June 06, 2006, 10:47:22 AM »

Because it was crap.  Grin

I can't put my finger on it, but it just rubbed me the long way.  I think it was mostly that I thought the storyline was rather stupid, and Eastwood's character was rather poorly written.  The lack of a decent supporting cast didn't help much either. 

Never grabbed me either. Don't know what it is. But it's one of Eastwood's favorites.

Logged
Banjo
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4428


Don't you like music with your supper?


View Profile
« Reply #26 on: June 06, 2006, 11:13:10 AM »

No offense, but have you even SEEN "The Wild Bunch"?  You complain about "lack of" character development, yet you find everything between the bookend shootouts boring?  I don't know what to say to that.
No offense but did you read my posts on this thread Grin ?-i can't see any comments about "lack of character development" - only charisma and Holden,Ryan,Borgnine,Oates and all the rest are totally forgetable.Yes i seen that sorry excuse of a western at least 3 times including last Sunday when it was on tv again and its pure TEDIUM  and both Major Dundee
 and Pat Garrett don't fare any better.
Apart from the Indians(i was only using this as an example of Eastwoods class over that drunken bufoon Peckinpah),exactly  which are of my criticisms are "off" and why?I feel they are all valid points so i'm real curious to hear more Roll Eyes

« Last Edit: June 06, 2006, 04:40:42 PM by banjo » Logged
Banjo
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4428


Don't you like music with your supper?


View Profile
« Reply #27 on: June 06, 2006, 11:26:27 AM »

The acid test: whose films can you watch over and over again with enjoyment? 
Good question! Wink The answer is obviously Eastwood.Just like i got into the Dollar trilogy over 25 years ago soon afterwards i got hooked on Eastwoods own westerns and have been watching them repeatedly ever since without them ever losing their original sparkle.For Leone fans films like HPD and PR are an absolute must because as we know Eastwood as well as Morricone were highly instrumental in making those early sws are good as they were-Clint invented the anti-hero look,the stare and the pared down dialogue(just ask Bronson)-the whole character really.Anyone that truly loves the man with no name should surely enjoy Clints westerns to almost the same extent.
    Other than on this site i've never truly met anyone thats even heard of Sam Peckinpah! Cheesy THATS THE REAL ACID TEST  Grin

« Last Edit: June 06, 2006, 11:29:10 AM by banjo » Logged
Leone Admirer
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2476


Filmmaker with a fiery passion for films


View Profile
« Reply #28 on: June 06, 2006, 03:38:22 PM »

that drunken bufoon Peckinpah),

 Shocked, that's a bit thick isn't it  Embarrassed

Logged

Films: You cant just love them, you've gotta adore them!
Banjo
Bounty Killer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4428


Don't you like music with your supper?


View Profile
« Reply #29 on: June 06, 2006, 04:33:27 PM »

Shocked, that's a bit thick isn't it  Embarrassed
No worse than what you said about Peckinpah on the 3rd June Leone Admirer!:-

"but yes later on in his life he seemed to be one of the biggest a**holes in the film industry"

And i've heard worse from actors who have worked with Peckinpah so i suppose they're a bit thick too then? Undecided
With respect my friend,I may have seen one or two documentaries more than you in my lifetime to draw my
conclusions about Peckinpah to lead to this admittedly ineloquent comment.

« Last Edit: June 06, 2006, 04:36:49 PM by banjo » Logged
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 ... 7 Go Up Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  



Visit FISTFUL-OF-LEONE.COM

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines
Page created in 0.041 seconds with 20 queries.