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Author Topic: Have a Good Funeral, My Friend, Sartana Will Pay (Buon funerale, amigos!...paga  (Read 20107 times)
The Firecracker
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« Reply #30 on: October 07, 2006, 10:20:28 PM »

I wasn't aware to be vague.

Then you could elaborate.

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« Reply #31 on: October 07, 2006, 10:41:07 PM »

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have only complained that many don't even consider trying to watch quality films from his contemporaries because they have only heard that they are not on par with him. That's snobbery (and ignorance) at it's worst if you ask me.

Actually its truth  Grin

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« Reply #32 on: October 07, 2006, 10:46:50 PM »

Titoli, you were being vague, in the purest sense. Can you explain a little?

First of all, cinema is mainly about escapism, to me. It's about escaping into the world that the director has created for you. That's why I stress a lot on the atmosphere of a film. Film's with such a wonderful atmosphere (like OUATITW) are easier to escape into, and they're just as enjoyable as some action-packed film.

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« Reply #33 on: October 08, 2006, 12:19:28 PM »

If it's pure escapism, then you escape temporarily from reality. You don't take the movie with you, don't ruminate about it, don't care about particulars. The experience ends then and there with the vision.  I thought this was autoexplanatory. I was wrong. Sorry.

 And about granting a b-movie the same degree of attention I concede to  a great movie, that depends on the watcher.  I don't think I need the same degree of attention to watch 8 1\2 or Marienbad that I  need to watch Titanic or Pretty Woman. Exactly as I need a different kind of concentration to read Dante's Inferno  from the one needed to read a comic book. If you don't establish difference as to how you absorb different kinds of movies then you are not discriminating. That means that watching a Fellini movie or your father's home movies is for you the same thing. I think it isn't, though I can easily understand that the argument was brought forth by the apologetes of the B-Movies that pretend to make me believe that there are no valid aesthetic cathegories at all and that the only rule to follow is the one of one's taste, however rough that may be.





 

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The Firecracker
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« Reply #34 on: October 08, 2006, 12:54:35 PM »



 And about granting a b-movie the same degree of attention I concede to  a great movie, that depends on the watcher.  I don't think I need the same degree of attention to watch 8 1\2 or Marienbad that I  need to watch Titanic or Pretty Woman. Exactly as I need a different kind of concentration to read Dante's Inferno  from the one needed to read a comic book. If you don't establish difference as to how you absorb different kinds of movies then you are not discriminating. That means that watching a Fellini movie or your father's home movies is for you the same thing. I think it isn't, though I can easily understand that the argument was brought forth by the apologetes of the B-Movies that pretend to make me believe that there are no valid aesthetic cathegories at all and that the only rule to follow is the one of one's taste, however rough that may be.





 

It's discrimination when you already walk into a movie expecting a crap fest.

"Consider the facts seven times before you suspect someone." -Japanese Proverb

I give the same amount of a attention when watching "Buon funerale, amigos!...paga Sartana!" that I do watching "Satyricon". When both films have been viewed by me I then place them in their own catergories. I don't just go right in and say "okay..."Have a good funeral" is going to be good but certainly not as thought provoking as Fellini's "Satyricon" which will bring the cinematic pompous out of me. Therefore the Sartana movie is nothing more then mindless fun...okay I'm ready to watch".

If you walk in like this you carry that  prejudice (that pre-conception) of the film and later you may find (or rather not find) that you missed something in the movie. In fact I gurantee you will hate an aspect of it that you may have liked only if you walked in with the same expectations as the Fellini film.



And I don't consider my father's home movies (or anybody elses) "cinema". 

« Last Edit: October 08, 2006, 01:07:40 PM by The Firecracker » Logged



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« Reply #35 on: October 09, 2006, 06:16:40 AM »

Actually its truth  Grin
It would only be the truth if Corbucci,Sollima,Parolini,Barboni etc were trying to make a Leone sw because undeniably Leone was the best at doing his own thing.But equally those other Italian directors all had their own distinctive styles which they brought to the genre and i have grave doubts whether Leone could've made a Django or Great Silence.
To make a judgement as to who made the best quality sw's is pretty pointless as it is impossible to measure  except perhaps in terms of enjoyment so is therefore down to personal preference.
You never hear suggestions that non-Ford westerns were inferior,so why build up Leone so much and disregard his Italian contemporaries who have contributed their own brand of equally valid talents.
   Some people would say that no-one could play rock guitar like Hendrix but Hendrix couldn't have played jazz like John McLaughlin who in turn couldn't have played country picking style as well as Albert Lee.Can you really so who was the best guitar player out of these?
No,they all had their own style and were best at what they did Wink

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« Reply #36 on: October 09, 2006, 12:18:44 PM »

Wow. What an interesting episode of GERALDO this would have made-flying chairs and all!

I find it interesting the use of the word B MOVIE by some of the people here, people who although I don't know personally seem to have personal as well as social issues. These same individuals seem to think if the films they watch aren't a 2000 calorie diet of brain food then they have severely starved themselves for the day. This is not an insult just an observation because I've dealt with people like this before not just in the movies they watch but in other daily activities.


In an earlier post someone made some unkind comments about NAVAJO JOE, a fine and entertaining SW. A movie that didn't pretend to be anything more than escapist entertainment but said person felt the need to look at it from the perspective that ALL MOVIES ARE SUPPOSED TO BE HIGH ART. I could care less if what Reynolds wears is authentic or not. If all he had was a tomahawk and a feather I would still assume he was an indian as I'm not a professor of native american dress as some seem to be.

I guess also I should dismiss all my favorite fantasy films like VALLEY OF GWANGI (a western with dinosaurs!) with effects by the revered Ray Harryhausen because the dinosaurs featured are not anatomically accurate or any of the SINBAD films because those things simply never existed.

Does this mean nobody should enjoy a flick that allows there imagination to run wild for 2 hours?

These same hypocrites champion movies by a man who seldom journeyed into realism in the first place!

Anyways, for those that don't know (and it seems many do not) a B MOVIE was the second feature of a double bill usually filmed on left over money from the first feature. The 2nd flick rarely, if ever, got the attention that the first film did in all aspects of the filmmaking process. The co feature, or B FILM, was just an added attraction to give the public some extra bang for the buck. A similar example would be old 45s. The A side was the "hit single" and the B side was the throwaway. Many of you can attest that often times the B SIDE overshadowed the A SIDE.

Also, some of you here seem to miss the fact that since Leone was first to demonstrate the new style of violent western that naturally he will be revered as an auteur since he essentially started the whole cycle so why should 100 other directors go and do the same thing?

Nearly all these movies were seriously low budget and the directors had to work within those parameters so any innovation or creativity in spite of there budget should be noted and appreciated. Leone didn't have a large amount of money with his first film and Corbucci didn't have lots of cash for DJANGO but Corbucci was extemely innovative in his approach and thus once he proved himself was also getting large budgets for his other films but I seem to remember a films budget has nothing TO DO WITH ENTERTAINMENT VALUE!!!

When I sit down to watch a flick I generally have some preconception of what I'm getting into.

If I'm watching a SW I hope to see gunfights (well done hopefully) some decent music cues (and HAVE A GOOD FUNERAL...has an excellent love theme BTW), and some plot twists.

If I'm watching a kung fu movie I hope to see good fights, sets (Shaw Brs. always had the most beautiful sets since early hollywood days), plot twists, etc...

Horror flicks I hope for some good attempts at suspense at the very least or decent make up effects.

If any or all these are met then I'm happy as well as entertained but if certain ones meet all these criteria or make an effort of it I will note it.

These other SWs regardless of technical proficiency should not be compared to Leones work as they for the most part take different approaches to the subject matter although some directors do ape his style and did it very well Giancarlo Santi with GRAND DUEL for example. The openig and closing duels are very reminescent of Leones style and Santi did an admirable imitation (the best form of flattery) of his films whether you think these others as GRAVEL PITTERS or not which I don't remember seeing any gravel or pits.

Oh, and I didn't spend the entire day typing this tirade. It took about thirty minutes, I type fast! Grin

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« Reply #37 on: October 09, 2006, 09:03:19 PM »

wow what an impressive amount of verbal diarrhea, you obviously need to get a life. And I'm glad you are using paragraphs now. Grin

As a Western Navajo Joe sucks, plain & simple, but its obviously entertaining to mindless cretins, I've met people like you before in other daily activities.  Grin

You my friend look at SW's from the perspective that they are MEARLY ESCAPIST ENTERTAINMENT, rather than acknowledge that some escaped the realm of mortal directors and achieved GREATNESS.  Cool

I could care less that you could care less if what you think what Reynolds wears is authentic. I sure that if he had worn a dress that would ok with you as long as it was escapistly entertaining.  Tongue

You can enjoy any wildly imaginative film you like, for as long as you like. I'm not stopping you.  Wink

When I sit down to watch a Western, I expect it to fit into certian universaly preconcieved parameters. A true Western should have the landscape as an essential part of its composition, with plausibly believable charaters interacting with realistic weaponry upon that landscape that depicts the Western part of the North American Continent circa late 1800's early 1900's.  Cool

A gravel pit is not a landscape.  Roll Eyes

Westerns that don't fit the above are hyphenated Westerns, ie., Fantasy-Westerns, SiFi- esterns, Horror-Westerns, Mystical-Westerns, etc., etc., and they are fine in their own right and have their own merits and they should be judged in their own categories. So if they all have their own style judge them by the categories they fit, and let their styles and stories be the factors debated.  Wink

« Last Edit: October 09, 2006, 09:07:47 PM by cigar joe » Logged

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« Reply #38 on: October 09, 2006, 09:12:07 PM »

wow what an impressive amount of verbal diarrhea, you obviously need to get a life. And I'm glad you are using paragraphs now. Grin


Let's not resort to name calling here Joe. AC brought some very valid points to the table here whilst you have only brought insults.

There is no indication that AC needs to get a life (if anything I need one from being on here most of my time) since he is hardly on here to begin with. His preferences to films don't indicate whether he has a life or not either. Your comments were immature.

Let's keep this half way civil.


P.S. and I guess most of us are "mindless cretins" because I can name at least 7 active members who enjoy Navajo Joe.

« Last Edit: October 09, 2006, 09:17:44 PM by The Firecracker » Logged



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« Reply #39 on: October 09, 2006, 09:24:39 PM »

verbal diarrhea is not calling a name, its a "description".

These are not insuts?

Quote
These same individuals seem to think if the films they watch aren't a 2000 calorie diet of brain food then they have severely starved themselves for the day. This is not an insult just an observation because I've dealt with people like this before not just in the movies they watch but in other daily activities.

Quote
but said person felt the need to look at it from the perspective that ALL MOVIES ARE SUPPOSED TO BE HIGH ART.

and....

Quote
These same hypocrites champion movies by a man who seldom journeyed into realism in the first place!

"hypocrites" I think the name calling was started by AC.


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The Firecracker
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« Reply #40 on: October 09, 2006, 09:30:34 PM »

verbal diarrhea is not calling a name, its a "description".

These are not insuts?

and....

"hypocrites" I think the name calling was started by AC.



There is a bit of a difference. AC didn't mention any names. That could be anybody.

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« Reply #41 on: October 09, 2006, 09:40:47 PM »

If you noticed I punctuated everying (tongue in cheek so to speak) with a smiley face.  Grin

"you my friend" wasn't mentioning any names either.... Cool, it could be refering to anybody even you.  Grin

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« Reply #42 on: October 09, 2006, 09:44:22 PM »

If you noticed I punctuated everying (tongue in cheek so to speak) with a smiley face.  Grin

"you my friend" wasn't mentioning any names either.... Cool, it could be refering to anybody even you.  Grin

gangrene is eating my leg away, not my eyes...

 we all know who you were referring to here. Even a blind man can see it just by reading your post.

and a smiley faced  emoticon means nothing after you basically said "go fuck your mother" in so many words.


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« Reply #43 on: October 09, 2006, 09:46:30 PM »

you, you know nothing of cigar joe  Grin

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« Reply #44 on: October 09, 2006, 10:58:31 PM »

Where do you hail marlboro joe? English is my native tongue although I do speak decent mandarin chinese I don't believe 'insut', 'certian' and best of all 'preconcieved' (i before e except after c!) Roll Eyes are actual words of the english language, close BUT NO CIGAR! Grin Grin Grin

Wow, so I've a bad case of verbal diarrhea? Being a MINDLESS CRETIN as you so called me, is vastly preferable to a sniveling, ego minded, self centered, hypocritical little man who apparently is lacking in certain areas and in order to feel better than everyone else gets emblazoned with superiority when he views an obscure piece of high art (not denouncing a classic whether I've seen it or not I do respect the masters and do give respect where it is do unlike YOU!).

Then, said person overhears several friends talking about the GOOD TIME THEY HAD AT THE CINEMA over the weekend seeing whatever MINDLESS CRETINS such as myself watch all the while saying to himself---"THEY ARE SO BENEATH ME! ONE DAY WHEN I HAVE REACHED MY PHYSICAL ZENITH AND BECOME LIGHT IN THE COSMOS THEY'LL STILL BE NOTHING!" Cheesy I AM GREATNESS PLAIN & SIMPLE! Smiley Wink Cheesy Grin

The only thing is, said person is the only one around to hear himself speak! Smiley He has no friends to talk to about the high art just witnessed!  Wink It doesn't matter, one day said person will achieve greatness becoming light in the cosmos Roll Eyes spreading his intellectual garbage throughout the universe! Smiley Wink Cheesy Grin

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