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: Do you feel DYS is a western?  ( 8123 )
The Peacemaker
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« : December 30, 2006, 01:35:47 PM »

This topic has been done before, but with so many new people here I'd like to hear different interpretations.

Personally, I think DYS is NOT a western.


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« #1 : December 30, 2006, 03:45:53 PM »

Its a Zapata Western, a sub genre


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« #2 : December 30, 2006, 09:24:25 PM »

Peacemaker, why do you feel that it is not a western?  Do you feel the same way about the Wild Bunch?
To me both have a more modern feel since they use semi-autos, and have motorized vehicles,  yet I would lump them in the western category since that seems to be the setting.

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« #3 : December 30, 2006, 09:35:18 PM »

I feel that The Wild Bunch is, indeed, a western because the events in the film are situations from the western genre. Outlaws on the run, in the twilight of the western frontier. They are and once were gunfighters and only fled to Mexico late in their lives ( even though it was the beginning of the movie ). there is modern technology but that's to show the awkwardness the bunch feels in this new day and age.


DYS, on the other hand, does not take place in America and has nothing to do with the western frontier. Juan Miranda is a bandit, but he's not a western outlaw/gunfighter. The film is about revolution and the politics that fuel it. The characters, the plot, the setting have absolutely nothing to do with the western genre.


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« #4 : December 31, 2006, 08:30:57 AM »

I see what you are saying. but just to dig a little further, how do you feel about Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid?  Half of it takes place in South America.  I think of it as a western. It has outlaws and the west is closing in on them too.
I suppose I think of DYS as a western, only a modern one at that.  Maybe its because of the horses/deserts.

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« #5 : December 31, 2006, 08:39:57 AM »

Its a Zapata Western, a sub genre

Absolutely. This is why I consider it a western, as well as all others that fall into this sub-genre, like The Mercenary, A Bullet for the General, and American Zapatas like Viva Villa.

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« #6 : December 31, 2006, 09:17:32 AM »

I see what you are saying. but just to dig a little further, how do you feel about Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid? 

Of course it's a western.  ::)

It has to do with gunfighters. Yeah, parts of it take place in Bolivia, but the situations are purely western.


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« #7 : December 31, 2006, 09:19:14 AM »

I do think they should be in there own catagory I'll be continuing my Zapata Western thread soon I picked up Pancho Villa with Telly Savalas, Clint Walker, & Chuck Connors, for $3 at FYE at that price I couldn't pass it up, lol, and I do have "and Starring Pancho Villa as Himself" that I've never added to the thread, there is one more film "The Treasure of Pancho Villa" with Brian Kieth that I don't have yet.

But Peace brings up a valid point concerning "The Wild Bunch" it only lurches into the Zapata category during its last 1/4 it seems, so its only a partial Zapata.

BC&TSK is Western all the way even though it ends in Bolivia, the two are never ever involved in Revolution.


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« #8 : December 31, 2006, 09:23:30 AM »

I just don't feel that DYS is a Zapata western because at least the Zapata westerns have something to do with the American west ( a money-hungry gringo for example ).


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« #9 : December 31, 2006, 09:35:32 AM »

Its in Mexico ain't it? Mexico has always been part of the West as much as the US and Canada, I think anyway.


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« #10 : January 02, 2007, 01:39:52 AM »

It is certainly a western. There are some scenes that seem to resemble a Nazi WWII concentration camp (that night in the rain) or even a WWII battle (The finale) but don't be fooled. It is a western.




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« #11 : January 02, 2007, 04:43:43 PM »

Yes.



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« #12 : January 02, 2007, 04:48:00 PM »

I'm not sure I consider Zapata Westerns to be a sub-genre of Westerns. To me, they're more like hybrids, part Westerns but part something else. And when the Western elements begin disappearing from the mix, then it's just a straight Zapata film. I can't really identify anything in DYS that is peculiarly "Western." There are no gunfighters, no Manifest Destiny, no American characters. And Johnny and Johnny have more in common with Max and Noodles than they do with Harmonica or Blondie. So, I'd say Peacemaker has a case.....



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« #13 : January 03, 2007, 06:11:29 PM »

Well sir. Seem's t' me there's this here film called THE PROPOSITION folks round here's bin talking about lately. T' aint no Yankees, Injuns, gunslingers nor nothin' in it neither. Hell, it ain't even set in the Yoo Nited States. But it looks like a West'rn, smells like a West'rn and by Golly most everybody bin callin' it a West'rn.

Now this here Duck Y' Sucker (darn fool name f'r a pict're if yur a askin' me), it's got them big hats, even bigger stagecoaches, horse soldiers, prairie flowers, folk a showin' off with the shootin' irons, robbin' banks and its even got the the damn trains, I tells ya. Yup. It's a West'rn 'n all.


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« #14 : January 03, 2007, 08:58:17 PM »

 ;)


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