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Author Topic: So what title best fits this film?  (Read 40914 times)
stanton
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« Reply #60 on: July 05, 2011, 02:05:15 AM »

I have to disagree with you here: IMO, "OUAT in the Revolution" would sound very weird; "OUAT... The Revolution" is a great title.

The theme of the film is how revolutions may initially seem great and romantic, but ultimately just cause death and destruction. The focus is not on the Mexican Revolution per se, nor on a specific incident or story that occurred in the film; rather it is on the whole concept of revolution itself, which Leone was taking a stand against ( my understanding is that Leone was opposing the film industry in Italy at the time  which was dominated by pro-revolutionary hardcore Leftists). Leone's "Once upon a time" titles in general connote the combination/juxtaposition of fantasy and reality; in the context of this film, it refers to how revolutionaries may view revolutions as all wonderful and romantic -- like a fairy tale ("once upon a time") -- but they are ultimately just violent and tragic.

"OUAT in the Revolution" seems to me to imply a reference to a specific incident that happened during the revolution, which IMO does not properly convey the theme of the movie, which is a reference to revolutions in general.

You may counter this by noting that OUATITW and OUATIA both use the word "in." The title and theme of both of those films also refer to a fairy tale involving a real place/time (ie. the Wild West and America, respectively, from Leone's foreign perspective). But since both of those titles refer to a specific place (the West and America), it makes sense to use the word "in." However, "the revolution" is more of a concept/idea and not a specific place; hence,  the word "in" sounds very awkward. IMO "Once Upon a Time... the Revolution" is a terrific title.


But the original title is in fact Once upon a Time the West, and not "in the West"  like it was slightly changed for the English title.
You also have to note that Leone used the English word West (C'era una volta il West, not C'era una volta il ovest). And that he wrote west with a capital letter. This all clearly refers to a mythical west.

For me DYS is a too different film to really deserve the Once upon a time title. And I still see much sense in making it part of a trilogy, even if it is a loose one. My Name Is Nobody is much closer to OuTW than DYS.

« Last Edit: July 05, 2011, 02:07:26 AM by stanton » Logged

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« Reply #61 on: July 05, 2011, 02:59:46 AM »

But the original title is in fact Once upon a Time the West, and not "in the West"  like it was slightly changed for the English title.
You also have to note that Leone used the English word West (C'era una volta il West, not C'era una volta il ovest). And that he wrote west with a capital letter. This all clearly refers to a mythical west.

For me DYS is a too different film to really deserve the Once upon a time title. And I still see much sense in making it part of a trilogy, even if it is a loose one. My Name Is Nobody is much closer to OuTW than DYS.

I am only discussing the English version; that's all I understand. It may well be that something else makes sense in Italian or French; but in English, "OUATin the Revolution" wouldn't sound right IMO. "OUAT... The Revolution" is a great title

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Novecento
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« Reply #62 on: July 07, 2011, 11:46:17 AM »

Seeing as the original script was simply titled "Mexico", it should have "Once Upon a Time in Mexico", although that now refers to a completely different movie of course.

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« Reply #63 on: July 07, 2011, 03:27:53 PM »

Seeing as the original script was simply titled "Mexico", it should have "Once Upon a Time in Mexico", although that now refers to a completely different movie of course.

Leone wasn't interested in the literal place; he was interested the idea and mythology. There is that with the "West" "the Revolution," or "America." What's the mythology of Mexico?

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« Reply #64 on: July 07, 2011, 03:41:40 PM »

But the original title is in fact Once upon a Time the West, and not "in the West"  like it was slightly changed for the English title.
You also have to note that Leone used the English word West (C'era una volta il West, not C'era una volta il ovest). And that he wrote west with a capital letter. This all clearly refers to a mythical west.

For me DYS is a too different film to really deserve the Once upon a time title. And I still see much sense in making it part of a trilogy, even if it is a loose one. My Name Is Nobody is much closer to OuTW than DYS.


 OUATITW is to the American Western what MNIN is to the Spaghetti Western (and to the spoofs on the Spaghetti Western)... so yeah, MNIN definitely could have had some sort of "Once Upon a Time" title. However, I am sure Leone did not want that; enough people confused this for a Leone film without the OUAT title!

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« Reply #65 on: July 08, 2011, 12:50:42 AM »

"OUAT in the Revolution" seems to me to imply a reference to a specific incident that happened during the revolution, which IMO does not properly convey the theme of the movie, which is a reference to revolutions in general.

Well it goes without saying that "C'era una volta la rivoluzione" is the best title. It's just a shame that it doesn't translate in English. Most literally, it is "This was a time the revolution" although the French "Il était une fois la révolution" is more literally "It was a time the revolution", but neither work in English nor capture the right sentiment without using "Once upon a time..."

« Last Edit: July 08, 2011, 12:59:04 AM by Novecento » Logged
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« Reply #66 on: July 08, 2011, 01:00:10 AM »

For me DYS is a too different film to really deserve the Once upon a time title. And I still see much sense in making it part of a trilogy, even if it is a loose one. My Name Is Nobody is much closer to OuTW than DYS.

You really think so Huh

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« Reply #67 on: July 08, 2011, 02:06:33 AM »

Yes, I don't see much connection between DYS and the 2 OuT films. I always thought that it was very constructed and forced to press DYS as middle part of a triology. And remember it was also a film Leone did not wanted to direct initially.
The re-use of the title works for OuTA, but not for DYS.

And I think that DYS lacks the brilliance of the 4 predecessors, while MNIN has this brilliance, and even if it is a flawed film in parts, it is a much better film than DYS. That doesn't mean that DYS is a bad film. It shows how much Leone has developed his style since FoD, but also the film still shows why Leone did not wanted to direct it himself.

DYS was an underrated film, but now it becomes an overrated film.

« Last Edit: July 08, 2011, 05:29:08 AM by stanton » Logged

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« Reply #68 on: July 08, 2011, 02:08:20 AM »


 OUATITW is to the American Western what MNIN is to the Spaghetti Western (and to the spoofs on the Spaghetti Western)... so yeah, MNIN definitely could have had some sort of "Once Upon a Time" title. However, I am sure Leone did not want that; enough people confused this for a Leone film without the OUAT title!

As it is for me a Leone film anyway the confusion is only the other way round.

What is OuTW to the American western?

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« Reply #69 on: July 08, 2011, 04:32:01 AM »

As it is for me a Leone film anyway the confusion is only the other way round.

What is OuTW to the American western?

OUATITW is a homage to the myth of the American Western; I believe the "goodbye to the OLd West" theme was actually just a metaphor for the true theme, which is Leone's comment/homage to all the American Westerns (and its mythology) that he loved

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« Reply #70 on: July 08, 2011, 09:41:07 AM »

Leone wasn't interested in the literal place; he was interested the idea and mythology. There is that with the "West" "the Revolution," or "America." What's the mythology of Mexico?

What does the Revolution in DYS have to do with America?

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« Reply #71 on: July 08, 2011, 05:50:40 PM »

What does the Revolution in DYS have to do with America?

nothing. "OUAT... the Revolution" has nothing to do with America.... it was the idealism of the "Revolution" that Leone was arguing against

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« Reply #72 on: July 09, 2011, 08:05:58 AM »

Arguing against, or For?  It seems both sides are seen: The "improvement" to the peons, and the same peons tiring of fighting. Like, Juan's deserved rant in the cave: "The whole thing starts all over again".  This is brought out in the  Young Indiana Jones chronicles,  too. 

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« Reply #73 on: July 09, 2011, 08:46:55 AM »

nothing. "OUAT... the Revolution" has nothing to do with America.... it was the idealism of the "Revolution" that Leone was arguing against

Then how does it fit into this alleged "trilogy"?

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« Reply #74 on: July 09, 2011, 11:05:57 AM »

Here's what I posted earlier on a different thread if it's worth anything:

Actually, I'd always viewed the trilogy as Leone's broad yet localized take on the development of America: the Wild West of the late 19th century; the Mexican revolution of the early 20th century; the second wave of immigrants in the first half of the 20th century.

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