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: Esteban's departure  ( 9235 )
titoli
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« : May 30, 2007, 05:11:53 AM »

Apparently Joe forgets about him after the final shootout. Which is strange as he couldn't but have seen him sliding away from the scene.


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« #1 : June 15, 2007, 03:26:38 PM »

As soon as the explosion goes off signaling Joe's entrance,Esteban slides away. Joe is still in the dustbowl caused by the dynamite,and quite a ways away,so it would've been close to impossible for him to see Esteban leave.

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« #2 : June 15, 2007, 03:51:27 PM »

it was esteban's idea to shoot joe in the back when he first came to town. don miguel had to remind him what if your hand should shake and that gringo so fast on the draw. joe hear's estaban talking to his older brother and promptly moves out.

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« #3 : June 15, 2007, 04:23:18 PM »

Apparently Joe forgets about him after the final shootout. Which is strange as he couldn't but have seen him sliding away from the scene.


I believe it was Frayling that said that characters in Leone films tend not to be able to see anything unless it is on the screen.

This explains Eastwood's introduction in GBU after Tuco has been ambushed by the three bounty hunters. In reality he would have been seen for miles.

 LVC's sudden arrival at Sad Hill ccemetery can also be lumped into this catergory.

When Esteban slipped out of the screen he also slipped out of Eastwood's vision.




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« #4 : June 15, 2007, 07:04:31 PM »

i wonder why joe didn't notice estaban missing at some point remembering estaban is a back shooter.  how many time does TMWNN gets the drop on himself ? blondie gets caught in his hotel room and at the shorty lawson hanging. tuco and blondie both by angel eyes at sadhill.

angel's horse is a good 50 ' away and w/ the boots w/ spurs on isn't noticed approaching them. roger ebert's first impression is that characters just suddenly materalize which is an effect leone could really master.

also, both manco and col. mortimer working undercover, shoot apples apples off a tree  thus blowing their cover  right in front of indio.

it's so untuco for for him to realize, after  the 3 way duell, that his revolver wasn't loded. ???

« : June 15, 2007, 07:21:38 PM cisco »
titoli
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« #5 : June 15, 2007, 07:12:28 PM »

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Joe is still in the dustbowl caused by the dynamite,and quite a ways away,so it would've been close to impossible for him to see Esteban leave.

The dustbowl has long vanished when Eastwood is visible to Ramon's gang (and so the reverse, also):

http://youtube.com/watch?v=LiQntJC-Efw


Quote
I believe it was Frayling that said that characters in Leone films tend not to be able to see anything unless it is on the screen.

I don't think this has much to do with the case at hand. In the other cases you mention (one could also add Tuco and Blondie walk into the Union Army) the scene it is not as well defined as in FOD last scene, where you know exactly where the people are. In the other cases the appearance out of nowhere is made credible by the fact that you don't know where the character  gushes forth from.


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« #6 : June 15, 2007, 07:21:52 PM »

The dustbowl has long vanished when Eastwood is visible to Ramon's gang (and so the reverse, also):

You're right...I stand corrected.

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« #7 : June 16, 2007, 02:39:55 AM »

TITOLI, thanks for FOD link.  ;)

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« #8 : June 16, 2007, 06:09:16 AM »

The dust bowl has long vanished when Eastwood is visible to Ramon's gang (and so the reverse, also):

http://youtube.com/watch?v=LiQntJC-Efw

You could also say that even Ramon and his gang didn't realise Esteban had disappeared. I'm sure Ramon would have said something had he seen him sneaking off.
        You also see him start to move away to the left as Joe is walking towards the camera after the dust has gone. The only person who obviously remembers Esteban has gone is Silvanito. I'm sure after the beating he was getting, all of them would have been well imprinted on his mind, so 'HE' new one was missing.......

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« #9 : June 16, 2007, 03:55:02 PM »

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You could also say that even Ramon and his gang didn't realise Esteban had disappeared. I'm sure Ramon would have said something had he seen him sneaking off.


No, I disagree. I think he knows him for the vicious character he is and so he trusts him to come up with something unexpected. Also, Ramon he's still sure of himself before the shooting starts, and wouldn't mind being left one man short.

« : June 16, 2007, 04:06:52 PM titoli »

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« #10 : June 17, 2007, 01:10:37 AM »

keeping in mind that the GB&U was a prequel to FOD AND FAFDM, i can see why blondie wanted a clean break w/ tuco. in FOD it's esteban that almost gets joe. in FAFDM it's groggy sneeking around behind manco / amanda b. deltwith, trying to shoot him in the back.   :-X 

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« #11 : June 17, 2007, 07:37:26 AM »

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keeping in mind that the GB&U was a prequel to FOD AND FAFDM

I do not believe this business of the trilogy: for me every movie stands to itself. And anyway, assuming you're right (and if I have understood what you mean) then experience has taught nothing to Eastwood's character.

Who's amanda?


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« #12 : June 20, 2007, 04:46:27 PM »

 trilogy sort of sticks in my mind as eastwood stars as basicly the same but different
 nick names.
   
 

 joe.   a samurai
 manco,  bounty killer. w/ LVC as a partner
 blondie & tuco,  treasure hunters

 amanda b. deltwith ? MWNN = a man to be deltwith.    ^-^

« : June 20, 2007, 04:52:47 PM cisco »
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« #13 : August 14, 2007, 05:36:23 PM »

But... why didn't Esteban shot earlier? He could save the others... or was he not fast enough?



I imagine Esteban searching in the house: "Where is my gun... isn't here... no... I can't find it... where the hell... (shots from outside) Can't you wait? These young men of today. Always the killing, and the sex. Always! Oh, finally. Wait, you gringo SOB. I'll shot you in the b... (this is the point Silvanito shoots him) ;D


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titoli
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« #14 : August 14, 2007, 07:34:42 PM »

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But... why didn't Esteban shot earlier? He could save the others... or was he not fast enough?

Give him time to reach position. And also Eastwood maybe was not in his line of fire until later. 
And maybe he was also fascinated by the show.


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