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Author Topic: What`s with the fly?  (Read 18219 times)
Bill Carson
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Where`s that damn fly...!?


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« on: August 01, 2007, 03:34:46 AM »

Of course, Leone “used“ the fly in the scene with Jack Elam at the begining of the OUATIW, but what`s the story with fly in this movie?

I don`t know how many of you noticed that, but in GBU fly was “acting“ in several scenes, very important ones. Just to remind you:

1. In the scene when Tuco enters the coach in which are dead soldiers and Bill Carson stil alive – there was a fly;
2. After that, in the scene when Tuco trying to make Blondie tell him about the grave – there was a fly (on Tuco`s face);
3. After that, in the scene in monastery, when Blondie lying on the bed – there was a fly (“walking“ on the Blondie`s mouth and face);
4. After that, in the scene in the prison camp, when Angel Eyes (now as Union officer) talks with sick captain who is lying on the bed, on his pillow (the whole time of their conversation) – there was a fly...

I hope that I didn`t forgot some other scenes...

Anyway, what do you think that is the fly`s “role“? Why is the fly always around? Does maybe Leone uses the fly as some kind of “simbol of deth“, because fly is always around someone that suffers or dieing:

in the 1. scene, all of the soldiers are dead (except Bill, who is practically half-dead, and who dies later);
in the 2. scene, Blondie practically dieing while the fly is on Tuco`s face (Tuco doesn`t even notice it at first, because he only wants to hear the name of the grave from Blondie);
in the 3. scene, Blondie is in same condition as in previous scene, with that difference that the fly is now on his face;
in the 4. scene, Union captain is dieing because of his sick leg.

So, is the fly some kind of metaphor for dieing and death, or just a Leone`s artistic “touch“, or something else...?

Sorry for this very long question,  Smiley   but I wanted to explain what I mean, so you could gave me your opinions about this.

Well, what do you think?

« Last Edit: August 01, 2007, 03:40:02 AM by Bill Carson » Logged
noodles_leone
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« Reply #1 on: August 01, 2007, 03:42:03 AM »

So, is the fly some kind of metaphor for dieing and death, or just a Leone`s artistic “touch“, or something else...?

Only artistic touch IMO...

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marqkin
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« Reply #2 on: August 01, 2007, 05:37:32 AM »

Having just spent 2 weeks on holiday in Almeria (visiting the Leone filming locations), I was pestered by flies practically every day that I was there...whether it was when I was trying to eat my food, take my photos, or drink my wine....
yes......I discovered that Spanish flies are b**gers for trying to nick your wine!!!!
I understand where you're coming from regarding the flies in the 'Good, Bad, Ugly'; however, after my recent experiences in Almeria, I realistically think that the flies in the film were more a 'pain in the a**, than an actual artistic expression on Leone's part.....
..however.....I could be wrong.....
Adios, Amigos....

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Bill Carson
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Where`s that damn fly...!?


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« Reply #3 on: August 01, 2007, 05:54:58 AM »

Only artistic touch IMO...

I said myself that is one of the possibilitys, but you know, that fly appear in many scenes (not just by accident), so I simply don`t know if that could be just "an artistic touch"... It must have some meaning...

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titoli
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« Reply #4 on: August 01, 2007, 06:36:40 AM »

Let's also give its due to the poor beetle in FADM.

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Jill
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« Reply #5 on: August 01, 2007, 07:16:00 AM »

I think there was a fly on Angel Eyes' hat, near the end...

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Bill Carson
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Where`s that damn fly...!?


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« Reply #6 on: August 01, 2007, 11:54:19 PM »

Let's also give its due to the poor beetle in FADM.

Yeah. Afro

I think there was a fly on Angel Eyes' hat, near the end...

I don`t remember that. I must check that out. Thank you. Smiley

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marqkin
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« Reply #7 on: August 02, 2007, 03:50:30 AM »

Of course, Leone “used“ the fly in the scene with Jack Elam at the begining of the OUATIW, but what`s the story with fly in this movie?

I don`t know how many of you noticed that, but in GBU fly was “acting“ in several scenes, very important ones. Just to remind you:

1. In the scene when Tuco enters the coach in which are dead soldiers and Bill Carson stil alive – there was a fly;
2. After that, in the scene when Tuco trying to make Blondie tell him about the grave – there was a fly (on Tuco`s face);
3. After that, in the scene in monastery, when Blondie lying on the bed – there was a fly (“walking“ on the Blondie`s mouth and face);
4. After that, in the scene in the prison camp, when Angel Eyes (now as Union officer) talks with sick captain who is lying on the bed, on his pillow (the whole time of their conversation) – there was a fly...

I hope that I didn`t forgot some other scenes...

Anyway, what do you think that is the fly`s “role“? Why is the fly always around? Does maybe Leone uses the fly as some kind of “simbol of deth“, because fly is always around someone that suffers or dieing:

in the 1. scene, all of the soldiers are dead (except Bill, who is practically half-dead, and who dies later);
in the 2. scene, Blondie practically dieing while the fly is on Tuco`s face (Tuco doesn`t even notice it at first, because he only wants to hear the name of the grave from Blondie);
in the 3. scene, Blondie is in same condition as in previous scene, with that difference that the fly is now on his face;
in the 4. scene, Union captain is dieing because of his sick leg.

So, is the fly some kind of metaphor for dieing and death, or just a Leone`s artistic “touch“, or something else...?

Sorry for this very long question,  Smiley   but I wanted to explain what I mean, so you could gave me your opinions about this.

Well, what do you think?
Well Bill Carson....you've done what I like to do....you've tried to analyse the movies.....
...and good on you for doing so......
..re-reading your thoughts on the 'flies'...yes.....it's too much of a 'co-incidence' that flies played such an 'important' role in the Maestro's movies....
...it reminds me...forgive me if I don't get this 100% correct.... of a critic who commented on the work of that other great maestro, Akira Kurosawa.....that "even the rain appears to work for him".....
...I recall that the critic, in this particular case, was referring to Kurosawa's magnificent work on 'Seven Samurai'....
...Just a thought....but: in the same way that the rain 'worked' for Kurosawa, perhaps the flies 'worked' for Leone'...Huh?
Whatever.....congratulations for your thoughts on this matter.....
Adios....happy spaghetti eating....happy viewing.....

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« Reply #8 on: August 02, 2007, 08:11:18 AM »


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tucumcari bound
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« Reply #9 on: August 02, 2007, 08:47:34 AM »

Bill. I think you're just obsessed with fly's.  Grin

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« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2007, 08:50:37 AM »


I agree with Marqkin, it difficult to avoid flies in Almeria. I remeber once in the early evening at Cortijo Fraile (Father Antonio mission) there were thousands of the things, made it difficult to even stop for a few minutes and take a few stills. When I got back in the car at least 20 of them sneaked in, must have liked the cool air conditioning.

 I was very surprised when I read that they put jam on Jack Elam's beard to attract them. I've never had any trouble attracting them, maybe I should change my soap  Cry.


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« Reply #11 on: August 02, 2007, 10:35:04 AM »

This is called making a virtue of a necessity. We know from interviews that SL was not above using the ideas of his collaborators (and then later taking credit for those ideas), so when a tribe of pesky flies showed up at Almeria demanding their close-ups, SL saw an opportunity to add a bit of extra protein--er, texture--to his mise-en-scene. The flies lend, shall we say, a "seedy" quality to the proceedings. But like the dust and the color brown, they mean nothing more than themselves.

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« Reply #12 on: August 02, 2007, 10:37:54 AM »

Dave, I completelly agree with you. That's what I thought after I noticed the flies: they are there everywhere, but they probably would have been there everywhere in the old West, too. So it's just part of the atmosphere of the whole dirty West, as Leone had it, most possibly no symbol at all.

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« Reply #13 on: August 02, 2007, 11:14:27 AM »

We should wait patiently for Christopher Frayling new book, "The History of the Fly in Spaghetti Westerns". Complete with interviews with the relatives of the fly that landed on Jack Elam.  I'm sure that book will cause a real buzz within the SW community and no doubt will fly off the shelves.

Perhaps next time I'm in Almeria I'll catch a few and sell them on eBay as genuine Spaghetti Flies.


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« Reply #14 on: August 02, 2007, 11:18:13 AM »

 Grin

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