Region 1 DVD - Correct mono mix?

[The clint]

To any of you that have the region 1 DVD, does the mono mix have the correct flashback and end title music, or is it just a folded mix of the incorrect 5.1 mix? I'd like some feedback on it before I buy a copy.

[The Peacemaker]

It's like no one ever wants to answer this topic.

A few people mentioned this a few times on the DYS board at imdb and no one ever answers.

[cigar joe]

Maybe nobody knows.

[The Firecracker]

I've been lead to believe, by MGM, that it is the correct Mono.

[dave jenkins]

But what is "correct"? When Mallory saves Juan from the firing squad, there are two different English audio tracks. On one he says "duck, you sucker;" on another he says "short fuse." I have no idea why there's a difference, or whether one is the be preferred over the other.

Nonetheless, I'd like an answer to the clint's question as well.

[The clint]

Correct mono mix would have:

-Juan saying: Why am I mixed up in this fucking revolution...

-John saying: Short Fuse (John saying Duck You Sucker was added when the short version was prepared and it was taken from the scene when John blows up the stagecoach)

-The music during the final flashback should be track 1 on the Giu la Testa soundtrack.

[The Peacemaker]

-The music during the final flashback should be track 1 on the Giu la Testa soundtrack.

I knew it.


Track 1 was never featured in the movie, so that must be why.

[Poggle]

Wait a minute, I thought when he saved Juan he whistled the main theme? Or is that another scene?

[The clint]

Wait a minute, I thought when he saved Juan he whistled the main theme? Or is that another scene?

Yes the main theme is still in the film, just not the track 1 version of it.

[The clint]

I just bought the R1 DVD since no-one was willing to confirm one way or another whether the English mono track included on the DVD is legit or not. I have inspected the mix, and have reached a conclusion:

THE ENGLISH 1.0 MONO MIX INCLUDED ON THE 2005 (REGION 1 NTSC) SPECIAL EDITION OF DUCK YOU SUCKER IS NOT THE MIX THAT WAS PREPARED FOR THE FILM WHEN DUBBING HAD BEEN COMPLETED IN LATE 1971 - EARLY 1972, BUT RATHER, A "FOLDED" MONO VERSION OF THE 5.1 REMASTERED VERSION PREPARED BY MGM IN AROUND 2003

This means three things a) the audio still has incorrect musical cues to certain scenes, b) several expletives are still edited out and c) the newly introduced sound effects are stuck in the mix. But worst of all is that we are not getting the original presentation!!!

There can be several reasons for why MGM have done this. One is pure lazyness of not wanting to uncover the mono track, another is the possibility that the mono masters they had to work with did not contain audio for the entire film (the flashback scene may not have been present in the master tapes. Whatever reasons they had, they are no excuse for such artistic disrespect.

On the plus side, the 5.1 mix is so badly mixed (voices jump from left to right, following speakers around) that the mono folding is actually preferable.

[dave jenkins]

This is troubling news. Either MGM can't be bothered to give us the original mono track, or a complete version of it no longer exists. That mean I have to hope that John Kirk and the boys are lazy jerks . . .

[cigar joe]

I wouldn't even know how you would go about figuring it out.
I guess you must have to have an original print of the film as a control no?

the clint, tell us how you go about figuring this out.

[dave jenkins]

-John saying: Short Fuse (John saying Duck You Sucker was added when the short version was prepared and it was taken from the scene when John blows up the stagecoach)

I've been thinking about this some more. The 1996 MGM Laserdisc had "short fuse" on the audio track, so maybe the LD had the correct mono mix throughout (I no longer have my copy of the LD so I can't check). In other respects, the LD was like the current DVD version of the film, except it had the shorter final flashback. But if the LD did have the correct audio track (and again, I don't know), I really have to wonder why it isn't present on the DVD.

[cigar joe]

So you are using the LD as the control? How would you know if that was right?

What would be the definative way of knowing?

[The clint]

It is pretty obvious which is correct and which has been tampered with. I use for reference a) the italian 2 disc Giu La Testa soundtrack b) the 2003 MGM disc (which has the original master audio, untampered with) c) A UK Pre-Cert tape from the early eighties which contains the altered 138 minute version with censored soundtrack, but correct music (apart from some minor edits). I also have an avi of the original italian flashback ripped from the CVC version of Giu La Testa. It's quite obvious that the SE soundtrack is incorrect because all the older editions agree, where the SE disagrees.