Author Topic: Italian CVC 175 minute version, original or latter day tinkering?  (Read 12146 times)

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Offline The clint

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Does anyone know whether the 175 minute cut was the cut released in Italy in 1968 or was it a cut cobbled together later on, perhaps for a re-release or just the DVD of the movie? I've always been a bit confused about this subject.

Offline SeanSeanSean

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Re: Italian CVC 175 minute version, original or latter day tinkering?
« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2008, 01:44:40 PM »
Does anyone know whether the 175 minute cut was the cut released in Italy in 1968 or was it a cut cobbled together later on, perhaps for a re-release or just the DVD of the movie? I've always been a bit confused about this subject.
I have the 165 min. box set. So, what more do we see in the extra 10 minutes?
If it's a revolution, it's confusion

Offline Le Bon

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Re: Italian CVC 175 minute version, original or latter day tinkering?
« Reply #2 on: April 28, 2008, 02:24:10 AM »
They are mostly alternate and extra takes of existing scenes with more close ups in the opening scene, and Jill entering the way station and a few others. And theres the scene where Mortons chess piece falls over.

Offline Jordan Krug

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Offline The clint

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Re: Italian CVC 175 minute version, original or latter day tinkering?
« Reply #4 on: September 13, 2008, 12:24:38 PM »
So does anyone know, whether the 175 minute version was the one that premiered in Italy in 1968 or not?

Offline piribiriboing

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Re: Italian CVC 175 minute version, original or latter day tinkering?
« Reply #5 on: September 22, 2008, 02:04:55 PM »
No, the CVC is the 1990-92 restoration by Claver Salizzato. In addition it has at least Harmonica raising after the gunfight at Cattle Corner. Not sure about other scenes.

Offline Novecento

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Re: Italian CVC 175 minute version, original or latter day tinkering?
« Reply #6 on: May 12, 2009, 06:11:44 AM »
here's a list :

http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film/dvdcompare/onceuponatimeintheest/ouatitw-ext.txt


I have a copy of the Italian DVD (http://www.ibs.it/dvd/8032442214679/henry-fonda-charles-bronson-claudia-cardinale-paolo/c-era-una-volta-il.html) and it does not seem to contain this scene:

Cheyenne's train surprise attack:
- Morton noticing the metal Jester chess piece of his desk shaking from the train's movement, it falls over and he quickly grabs it upright so as not to wake Frank's men.


I have seen screenshots of this scene so I know it exists but I was quite disappointed to find it not included here.

Offline stanton

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Re: Italian CVC 175 minute version, original or latter day tinkering?
« Reply #7 on: May 12, 2009, 12:42:56 PM »
Watch again. It's at 1:30:30

Apart from the scene with Harmonica rising at the railway station, this was the only really new piece in the long version.
« Last Edit: May 12, 2009, 12:46:19 PM by stanton »

Offline Novecento

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Re: Italian CVC 175 minute version, original or latter day tinkering?
« Reply #8 on: May 13, 2009, 10:05:11 AM »
I most certainly will.

Guess I must have just missed it when I watched it. I'll keep you posted.

Offline Novecento

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Re: Italian CVC 175 minute version, original or latter day tinkering?
« Reply #9 on: June 01, 2009, 05:27:21 PM »
Watch again. It's at 1:30:30

Just checked. It is definitely not included on my Italian DVD

Offline The Peacemaker

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Re: Italian CVC 175 minute version, original or latter day tinkering?
« Reply #10 on: June 02, 2009, 12:00:51 PM »
Does anyone know where stills of the extra scenes in the Italian print can be found? I'm dying to see the sequence with Morton and the chess piece.

Offline Novecento

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Re: Italian CVC 175 minute version, original or latter day tinkering?
« Reply #11 on: June 02, 2009, 01:43:02 PM »
No, the CVC is the 1990-92 restoration by Claver Salizzato. In addition it has at least Harmonica raising after the gunfight at Cattle Corner. Not sure about other scenes.

Just checked. It is definitely not included on my Italian DVD

Right, I am assuming that my DVD of  the "versione alternativa" is the same "versione integrale" restored by Salizzato. This means that the Morton chess piece scene comes from elsewhere.

There is a supposedly complete version of the movie, by a guy going under the name of Leonenut, that can be accessed here: http://fanedit.org/341/.
The following two claims are made: "Includes all the extended Italian scenes & shots"; "includes some unique shots from the shorter version too".

I will post some more information on how this compares to Salizatto's version once I have watched it.

Offline The Peacemaker

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Re: Italian CVC 175 minute version, original or latter day tinkering?
« Reply #12 on: June 02, 2009, 04:24:07 PM »
Right, I am assuming that my DVD of  the "versione alternativa" is the same "versione integrale" restored by Salizzato. This means that the Morton chess piece scene comes from elsewhere.

There is a supposedly complete version of the movie, by a guy going under the name of Leonenut, that can be accessed here: http://fanedit.org/341/.
The following two claims are made: "Includes all the extended Italian scenes & shots"; "includes some unique shots from the shorter version too".

I will post some more information on how this compares to Salizatto's version once I have watched it.

I'm trying to download the movie from the link but when I download it through rapidshare I can't open the file.

Offline stanton

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Re: Italian CVC 175 minute version, original or latter day tinkering?
« Reply #13 on: June 03, 2009, 01:07:40 AM »
Just checked. It is definitely not included on my Italian DVD

Then check the runtime. The runtime of mine is 2:50:04. It contains 2 small interviews with Leone and Cardinale.

Mine is definitely not the the boot version by this Leonenut guy, which only adds a few sec. from the US DVD to the long cut. But the cover of mine was a different one. But it's hard to believe that there are now 2 different "long" cuts out in Italy.

If your runtime is identical, the chess parts must be there. Actually these aren't chess figures but small tin soldiers, so maybe that's the reason for the confusion.

And here you can see stills of the added material, amongst them also several stills from the tin soldiers scene (at 1:25:15):

http://www.schnittberichte.com/schnittbericht.php?ID=4208

It's in German, but it shows all the differences between the both versions.
The 9 sec scene at 2:30:15 is not in the long version.

The cover of this release is also shown at the bottom.
And to avoid further mish-mash: the backcover states a runtime of 175 min, but the DVD has actually 170 min in Pal, which corresponds to a 177 min theatrical runtime.

« Last Edit: June 03, 2009, 08:57:26 AM by stanton »

Offline Novecento

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Re: Italian CVC 175 minute version, original or latter day tinkering?
« Reply #14 on: June 03, 2009, 06:13:42 AM »
Mine is definitely not the the boot version by this Leonenut guy, which only adds a few sec. from the US DVD to the long cut. But the cover of mine was a different one. But it's hard to believe that there are now 2 different "long" cuts out in Italy.

Ok, I've figured this out I think. I have not fully compared the two all the way through but my "versione alternativa" appears to be the same as the Paramount release except it has the different browner hue to it (nicely restored) and most significantly has the correct end music with Jill's America played out in full  :).

This means that my memories of different shots/angles in my Italian version seem to be mistaken and that I have not seen any of the different takes in the 175min version. I guess I must just appreciate  different things about the movie every time I watch it because I certainly remember seeing new shots of Jill in the buggy which, when I compare the two DVDs now, are identical.