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Author Topic: What is the most priceless GBU quote/line from the movie?  (Read 32468 times)
cigar joe
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« Reply #60 on: October 09, 2011, 07:23:49 PM »

I read it & own it its very good.  Afro

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« Reply #61 on: October 10, 2011, 01:55:52 PM »

It's an interesting idea and you may be right. It's important to keep in mind, though, that there is a water theme in West and that Jill is constantly associated with the substance (she talks about baths several times before she gets one, she is seen carrying water at the end, etc.). So Leone would probably have put the bath scene in West even if there were no such corresponding scene in GBU. On the other hand, to follow your "mirror" comment, it may be important to note the number of times the desert--and, if you will, "waterlessness"--is linked with Tuco.



Hallo Dave,

Although this becomes a private discussion I have to answer you, because in my feeling, you absolutely hit into the black. Water is absolutely one of the (secret) themes in West. Not only with Jill, I do not want to continue your list, but with Timmy (Go inside, quick, and get washed), Morton (before my eyes rot, I want to see the blue of the Pacific), and his death, the washing house of Wobbles, the fight of Harmonica for Sweetwater and his defence of Jill (Give me some water. From the well) at the well. West is his opus magnum, he prepared through many years and many films. As he made the (ironic) bath scene in GBU, he already had the (important) bath scene of West in mind. Look at the end of the scene with the revolver merchant that is the (ironic) version of the (important) scene of the death of Frank with the harmonica in his mouth. So you opened a secret door in West. Another secret door is the fact, that Timmy is the face of Leone as his childhood ends and he meets the crude reality of Frank. I described this in detail in German in http://sternstunde.npage.de/sergio_leone_spiel_mir_das_lied_vom_tod_25730153.html



Andreas Stern



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« Reply #62 on: October 10, 2011, 07:20:10 PM »

We had a discussion on that very topic Once Upon A Time On This Board: http://www.fistful-of-leone.com/forums/index.php?topic=480.0

Re-reading it, I see I talked myself around to the belief that Leone established a simple opposition between Salt Water (death) and Sweetwater (life). It's an idea that to me still seems to have merit.

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« Reply #63 on: October 11, 2011, 01:57:15 PM »


You are right, I switch to that forum

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« Reply #64 on: June 27, 2012, 02:22:38 PM »

I'm assuming Mickey Knox must take much of the credit for these lines in English?
Nope. Thanks for the link, though. I just ordered a copy.

Page 219 of Frayling's STDWD will illuminate you.

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« Reply #65 on: July 14, 2012, 07:58:27 PM »

From the SLWB interview with Vincenzoni:

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CK: How was the dialog writing process working in Leone movies? I assume you were writing in Italian, right?

LV: I was writing to Italian, and after the final screenplay is over, it was translated to English.

CK: Were you involved with the translation process of the scripts as well?

LV: Sometimes I was talking with the translator, who was Mickey Knox actually.

CK: Whose idea were those famous one-liners?, like "there are two kinds of spurs" ?

LV: All the dialogue was mine. I wrote them all.

From the SLWB interview with Mickey Knox:

Quote
So, when you started working with Leone, the Italian version of the scripts already had the dialogue, right? Let's take OUTIW for example, since your involvement is much more than GBU throughout the making of it. How exactly process worked in that film?

In that film, it already had all the dialogue in Italian. I had to adapt it to English, meaning that in many cases, especially in a Sergio Leone picture, where there are peculiar phrases, I had to find the equivalent, but not the same, in English. Because if you translate it directly from Italian, it makes no sense.

How about those ever-famous one-liners, like "there're two kinds of spurs..."? Were they your inventions?

In GBU, I tried to follow his intentions all the time. I didn't want to intrude my ideas of what the script should be. Most of them were his ideas. Sometimes, it was the actors' ideas. But, he was pretty good about that. He knew what he wanted and he did have a sense of humour. So, he did those type of one-liners in Italian which had to be translated to English. Some of them couldn't be. That's when I had to invent things that were American. A lot of the Italian quips, wits, and what you call as one-liners, weren't easy to translate, like in any language.

There is one quite famous of those "one-liners" in OUTIW, which goes like 'people like him have always something to do with death'. I am particularly curious about it. Was that line one of your adaptations, or was it already in the original Italian script as it is?

Well, I wrote it obviously, but it was probably the same in the original Italian, but I don't remember exactly. All the English dialogue is mine. I mean, in terms of adapting it from Italian, but I didn't originally write the Italian script. Somebody else did it, like Sergio Donati, but the English version is all mine.

« Last Edit: July 14, 2012, 08:12:58 PM by Novecento » Logged
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« Reply #66 on: July 15, 2012, 03:20:19 AM »

And for that the original versions of the films are the Italian versions, not the English ones.

Not sure about OuTA, for which the English version is most likely the reference version, but it applies for the 6 westerns.

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« Reply #67 on: July 15, 2012, 08:17:07 AM »

And for that the original versions of the films are the Italian versions, not the English ones.

Not sure about OuTA, for which the English version is most likely the reference version, but it applies for the 6 westerns.

Stuart Kaminsky describes his work on the English dialogue of OUATIA at 4:40 of this clip http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5YDWMn2XpI


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« Reply #68 on: July 15, 2012, 03:08:49 PM »

From the SLWB interview with Vincenzoni:

From the SLWB interview with Mickey Knox:

That makes it as clear as can be. Vincenzoni, as the author of the screenplay, can "take credit" for the lines in the film. He cannot "take credit"  for Knox's translation of course, which, as far as I can tell, is a good one.

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« Reply #69 on: July 16, 2012, 06:15:41 PM »

So he pretty much just directly translated the Italian then?

At least I now have an answer to my question  Smiley


It's also very interesting to read Knox's quote in Frayling's STDWD:

Quote
"[Sergio] had a very poor translation from the Italian, and in most cases the American actors changed their dialogue when they were doing it... I knew what they were supposed to be saying because I had the Italian script... But I had to find the right dialogue, not only in terms of moving the story along, but also to fit the lips. It's not an easy thing to do. As a matter of fact it took me 6 weeks to write what they call the 'lip-sync' script"

And for that the original versions of the films are the Italian versions, not the English ones.

Not sure about OuTA, for which the English version is most likely the reference version, but it applies for the 6 westerns.

Yup, that figures.

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« Reply #70 on: July 16, 2012, 10:51:50 PM »

That makes it as clear as can be. Vincenzoni, as the author of the screenplay, can "take credit" for the lines in the film. He cannot "take credit"  for Knox's translation of course, which, as far as I can tell, is a good one.

Vincenzoni wasn't the only one who did the screenplay; Age & Scarpelli were also credited, and Sergio Donati worked as an uncredited script doctor

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« Reply #71 on: July 17, 2012, 02:29:33 PM »

Vincenzoni wasn't the only one who did the screenplay; Age & Scarpelli were also credited, and Sergio Donati worked as an uncredited script doctor
Age & Scarpelli's material wasn't used (but they still got credited). The actors also had input. I'm not sure which particular lines, but some of the them were supposedly arrived at as they were shooting.

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« Reply #72 on: July 17, 2012, 07:09:03 PM »

Age & Scarpelli's material wasn't used (but they still got credited). The actors also had input. I'm not sure which particular lines, but some of the them were supposedly arrived at as they were shooting.

Yeah, and Eastwood even made some changes in the dubbing studio (eg. he suggested changing Sentenza's name to Angel Eyes; if you look closely at the actor's lips, you see them saying "Sentenza"; also, you can see Eastwood's lips saying the original line "IDIOTS -- it's for us" before changing it in the dubbing studio to "IDIOTS -- it's for you." (Thanks to Frayling's Blu Ray disc commentary for that).

I think I recall reading about how Age/Scarpelli's stuff wasn't used -- probably a statement that Leone made to Frayling -- but I wonder if that's really true; if so, why would they have been given credit for the screenplay?
In OUATIA, Leone hired Normal Mailer to write the script; Mailer did a significant amount of work but (as I recall reading in STDWD), Leone ultimately did not use it, and said that hardly any of Mailer's work made it into the final movie -- and Mailer's name is nowhere to be found among the 6 (!) screenwriting credits. Well that seems similar to what supposedly happened with Age/Scarpelli with GBU.

Sergio Donati and others who worked for Leone seem to really resent the fact that he was stingy about giving credit to those who worked for him; Leone even refused to give credit to Donati for his work on the GBU screenplay (I guess you'd have to call Donati an "uncredited script doctor"?) So why would Age/Scarpelli get the top screenwriting credit if their material really wasn't used? Was Leone being generous to them? Was it in their contract that they had to get a screenwriting credit? Was Leone trying to cash in on their popularity? Or did they indeed contribute to the final product, despite what Leone later said?

Like so many other things, we may never know....

(Maybe someone can ask Vincenzoni?)


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« Reply #73 on: July 17, 2012, 09:32:14 PM »

Now Tuco says "I'll bet they don't call you Sargent Angel Eyes !!!"  So what do his lips say, and would that have had the same impact if Tuco had said Sargent Sentenza?

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« Reply #74 on: July 17, 2012, 09:37:13 PM »

Now Tuco says "I'll bet they don't call you Sargent Angel Eyes !!!"  So what do his lips say, and would that have had the same impact if Tuco had said Sargent Sentenza?

you see his lips say "Sentenza." And in the preceding scene, "Blondie, isn't that Angel Eyes?" You see Tuco's lips say "Sentenza"


btw, I understand that "Sentenza" means "sentence" or "judgment" in Italian, but wtf were they thinking, to use that as his name in the English version? That wouldn't have made any sense to an American audience! Also, you see the Mediterannean loaves of bread, which are round and almost flat, ( shaped something like this http://www.amideastfeast.com/recipes/moroccan-bread/ ) in the eating scenes at Stevens's house and with Tuco in Angel Eyes's room. That's how the bread looks in Mediteranean regions, but not in America (I presume that loaves of bread in Texas during the Civil War look the same as they do in America now)

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