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Author Topic: The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance (1962)  (Read 31545 times)
dave jenkins
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« Reply #105 on: October 01, 2015, 01:33:53 PM »

doesn't sound like a remake to me; just re-using an old title

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« Reply #106 on: October 03, 2015, 06:34:45 AM »

OK, I'm old, I saw Liberty Valance when it was originally released, with my family as a little kid.  I just watched the trailer for it, and saw at the end of the trailer it stated includes "hear the legend come alive with the new hit song The Man who Shot Liberty Valance", I think when the trailer was made they assumed that the song would be in the film.  But I think Gene Pitney's hit song wasn't completed in time to get included in the film.

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« Reply #107 on: October 03, 2015, 06:50:50 AM »

OK, I'm old, I saw Liberty Valance when it was originally released, with my family as a little kid.  I just watched the trailer for it, and saw at the end of the trailer it stated includes "hear the legend come alive with the new hit song The Man who Shot Liberty Valance", I think when the trailer was made they assumed that the song would be in the film.  But I think Gene Pitney's hit song wasn't completed in time to get included in the film.

It isn't actually clear if the rushed release of the movie prevented the use of the song (Pitney was actually recording it when a musician in the studio, to the singer's amazement, told him the movie was playing down the street) or whether Ford turned it down when first heard it before it was recorded.

Anyway, this is the second movie I remember ever having seen (the first one was The Pit and the Pendulum) at a famous Tuscany spa with my grandpa.

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« Reply #108 on: October 04, 2015, 07:07:14 AM »

Well, it is a classic song, for sure !!!

This Youtube link states "Gene Pitney released this Burt Bacharach-Hal David song which peaked at US #4 in 1962. Though it shares its title with the 1962 John Ford western, "The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance", starring John Wayne, the song was not used in the film because of a publishing dispute between Famous Music and Paramount"   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C-sjvz6YKnQ

Any, good role for Lee Van Cleef in this film.  I believe this and How the West was Won were two of his last big jobs in US films before Sergio Leone "discovered" him for "For a Few Dollars More"; westerns in US were dying out, he was balding early, tough sell.

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« Reply #109 on: October 04, 2015, 08:41:40 AM »



Any, good role for Lee Van Cleef in this film.  I believe this and How the West was Won were two of his last big jobs in US films before Sergio Leone "discovered" him for "For a Few Dollars More"; westerns in US were dying out, he was balding early, tough sell.

Small job is the more adequate term.
Van Cleef was just an actor for mostly minor roles. Apart from Ride Lonesome I can't remember any substantial role before Leone rebuild him. And in Ride Lonesome he was the baddie, but with not much screentime, and it was a b-picture.

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« Reply #110 on: February 18, 2017, 08:57:58 PM »

Finished watching this for the first time. Excellent movie. I knew it was gonna be good because its in all the top westerns of all time lists. I'll get right to it:

1. Cinematography. Filmed in black and white.  Again, i love black and white cinema. This was filmed mostly on a Hollywood back lot. Except for the opening stagecoach scene, it worked very well and was no problem. That opening stagecoach scene was too tight.  The brief shots out on the plains were a welcome relief.

2. Script.  Very tight. I love tight scripts. Straight to the point. It had only one curve ball that worked very well towards the end.

3. Acting. Steward, Wayne, Strode, Marvin, Martin, they were all good.  Like has been mentioned earlier in this thread, Strode shouldve been a waay bigger star than he was.

4. Musical Score.  Really, i don't remember much from it.

Overall.  Excellent movie. It lived up to its billing. A definite keeper for your Blu Ray collection. I rate it a 8/10...

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« Reply #111 on: February 20, 2017, 11:17:36 AM »

Great movie, almost like a mini epic. Outstanding performances by everyone involved especially by Mr. Lee Marvin.

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« Reply #112 on: February 22, 2017, 05:45:57 AM »

Great movie, almost like a mini epic. Outstanding performances by everyone involved especially by Mr. Lee Marvin.

Excellent movie. Loved almost everything about it...

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« Reply #113 on: April 19, 2017, 03:27:29 AM »

Just read the Dorothy Johnson's original story. Many peculiarities of the film were devised by the screenplayers, first of all the "Print the legend" dictum. No Woody Strode, no O'Brien, no confrontations except the last one (the first meeting between the Stewart and Marvin characters are told in flashback, where Marvin gives him a beating leaving him half-dead just for the hell of it. Wayne saves him), the political career of Stewart is told in half-page. But what is markedly different is the Stewart character, not precisely positive, and his conflictual relationship with Wayne. I think that makes more sense that what is shown in the movie, but of course the figures of the actors make the difference. 

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« Reply #114 on: September 25, 2017, 10:43:58 AM »

Just saw this movie again. (I think it's my fourth viewing.) Still a damn good movie, but gosh, it REALLY hits you over the head with the message, about the old world of guns vs. the new world of law & order, saying it explicitly again and again. My Darling Clementine had a similar theme (albeit without the cynicism over legend vs. fact) but managed to do it much more subtly. The Andy Devine character, so goddamned annoying. And, of course, this Western is too stagy.

The characters in the movie have such great names: Liberty Valance, Ransom Stoddard, Dutton Peabody, Link Appleyard .... but Wayne gets stuck with the crappy "Tom Doniphon."  Cry

Here is an interview with Lee Marvin, discussing this movie https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cI1qBAVrjIs (BTW, there was some discussion earlier in this thread about whether the movie was shot in b/w rather than color because of budget restrictions. In this interview, Marvin discusses the advantages of b/w over color but makes no mention of any budget restrictions.)

In some discussions of this movie, I've seen people saying that Stoddard was a phony, he built his political career on a lie, etc. I don't agree with this. Yes, his political career was built on a lie, but through no fault of his own. Stoddard initially refuses the nomination to represent the territory in Washington; he's upset that people are supporting him because he killed a man. Stoddard only agrees to accept the nomination after Doniphon tells Stoddard that it was in fact Doniphon who had killed Valance. And then years later, at the end of the movie, when the train conductor tells Stoddard, "Nothing's too good for the man who shot Liberty Valance!" Stoddard sighs. He's upset that everyone is honoring him for this. What happened during all the years in between? Did he sigh every time someone mentioned that or did he smile? Who knows. But from what we see, Stoddard never promotes his "killing" of Liberty Valance. But, of course, the point remains that many supposed heroes are based on bullshit. Just like Colonel Thursday in Fort Apache.

And at the end, when Stoddard asks Hallie if she had put the cactus rose on Doniphon's coffin ... so Stoddard is upset about that? Really? Does this mean that all these years, his Hallie was in love with Doniphon? That's silly. Tom has died. Everyone is sad over it. Nothing wrong with Hallie putting the flower on the coffin. Hallie never showed an interest in Doniphon, and clearly made her choice for Stoddard. IMO, Stoddard asking Hallie if she put the flower on the coffin is stupid; it'd have been better if Stoddard had just seen the flower, maybe the camera holds on his face seeing the flower, but not having him say anything. But, again, this movie lacks subtly  Wink

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dave jenkins
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« Reply #115 on: September 25, 2017, 06:12:37 PM »

But, again, this movie lacks subtly  Wink
In other words, it's a John Ford movie?

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« Reply #116 on: September 27, 2017, 10:07:55 PM »

In other words, it's a John Ford movie?

My Darling Clementine managed to get off a similar theme (albeit without the "print the legend" cynicism) without being preaching it so blatantly.

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« Reply #117 on: September 27, 2017, 10:11:27 PM »

To anybody who thinks that John Wayne was not an actor, just watch his scenes in Capitol City, and Wayne rolls in drunk and disheveled, miserable, knowing he has lost Hallie. Even if Wayne hadn't spoken a word during that scene, just his appearance tells it all.
Wayne could be "John Wayne" when he wanted to, and he could deliver Oscar-worthy acting performances when he wanted to.

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