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mortimerforever
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« #30 : March 11, 2005, 10:55:00 AM »

According to HH's Western book, the Mexicans are saying 'We defy' and 'with the wind' in Titoli.


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« #31 : March 30, 2005, 01:59:10 AM »

Oh, they also say similar things in FAFDM's title music.


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« #32 : August 27, 2006, 01:16:51 AM »

Everybody knows that the chorus of "Titoli" says "we can fight, we can fight!" right? Right. If you listen to the OST (original soundtrack) CD, that's what you hear (also on the film).

But when I looked at an old thread in this forum from a couple of years ago (2004 to 2005) I found that there was some confusion going on. One member says the chorus sounds like "we can fight, we can fight" while another says it’s "with the wind, with the wind." Actually they are both right. There are two different versions of  "Titoli." Apparently, neither of them had both versions.

As you may know already, Leone immediately liked the music of "Pastures of Plenty" arranged by Morricone and wanted to use it for his first western. But I didn't know this episode until I watched a BBC documentary on Morricone several years ago.  I also didn't know that this Morricone's version of "Pastures of Plenty" with Peter Tevis's vocal was released in 1962 until I read about it in a Japanese book "Macaroni Westerns."

Japanese single cut of Peter Tevis's "Pastures of Plenty"


When you listen to this Morricone version of "Pastures of Plenty," you can instantly tell this is really the prototype of "Titoli." While the melody of Tevis's song is very similar to Woody Guthrie's original song, Morricone’s orchestration is almost identical to “Titoli.” It already has the sounds of the whip and the bell and the chorus in the background. 

Woody Guthrie's original "Pastures of Plenty"


In Morricone’s “Pastures of Plenty,” when Tevis sings “we come with the dust and go with the wind,” the chorus carry on the last phrase “with the wind.”

As Leone requested, Morricone replaced Tevis’s vocal with Allessandroni’s whistle. The rest remained including the chorus of "with the wind, with the wind." And this mix was cut for RCA single cut OST in Europe and Victor in Japan. And this is the version people played and listened to first.

Japanese single cut OST released in 1965


I’m not sure about Europe, but in Japan, as far as I know, the FOD OST LP was not available until it was coupled with FFDM OST and released through RCA. This RCA LP contains different “Titoli” from the RCA and Victor single cuts. Now the chorus says “we can fight, we can fight!” and the second guitar solo plays different melody. In another words, this mix is exactly the same as the one used for the film.

This is my guess. The mix used for the single cut was the primary mix and the mix used for the LP was the final one. Why was the primary mix used for the single cut, I don’t know. I should have asked this question to Allessandroni when I met him last summer.
       


« : August 27, 2006, 01:56:29 AM Sanjuro »

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« #33 : August 27, 2006, 01:47:15 AM »

Really interesting!



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« #34 : August 27, 2006, 02:14:33 PM »

Very informative.

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« #35 : August 27, 2006, 04:44:03 PM »

Thanks, Sanjuro. A couple earlier threads addressed this topic (as you mentioned), and one features some helpful research from several posters, most notably Cusser: http://www.fistful-of-leone.com/forums/index.php?topic=1413.0



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« #36 : August 27, 2006, 09:52:08 PM »

Thanks, Sanjuro. A couple earlier threads addressed this topic (as you mentioned), and one features some helpful research from several posters, most notably Cusser: http://www.fistful-of-leone.com/forums/index.php?topic=1413.0

Dave, thanks for the link to the old thread. I read the old posts and all links refered to in them again.  But none suggests why the two different mixes.

I just listened to the original "Pastures of Plenty" by Woody Guthrie and Peter Tevis's cover. Then I realized that Tevis altered the lyrics a little.

In my previous post, I wrote "when Tevis sings “we come with the dust and go with the wind,” the chorus carry on the last phrase “with the wind.”  This part is from Guthrie's original lyrics. But Tevis changed it to "I come with the dust and I'm gone with the wind."

I also found that in Guthrie's original lyrics, there is a phrase "We'll work in this fight and we'll fight till win."*

Since the song is about migrate workers, Guthrie was singing for their struggles.   

This is my guess again.  Morricone might have got an inspiration from the above phrase that repeats the word "fight" and he changed the original chorus of "with the wind" in the primary mix to the new chorus, "we can fight" for the final mix. And I don't think this guess is really far off.

* Tevis changed this phrase to "We come with the dust and we're gone with the wind."

« : August 28, 2006, 08:46:43 AM Sanjuro »

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« #37 : August 28, 2006, 06:51:31 AM »

Interesting stuff Sanjuro, thanks for posting.  ;)


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« #38 : February 27, 2007, 02:01:30 PM »

Does anyone know the words which are being said in the music score at the beginning of this film?

Sounds vaguely like someone is saying, "We can win"......not sure if I am right.

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« #39 : February 27, 2007, 03:03:00 PM »

Does anyone know the words which are being said in the music score at the beginning of this film?

Sounds vaguely like someone is saying, "We can win"......not sure if I am right.

They're not real words.

It's just gibberish.


Morricone didn't use actual lyrics in the soundtracks of any Leone films except A Fistful of Dynamite where a singer chants " Sean, Sean, Sean. "


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« #40 : February 27, 2007, 03:38:59 PM »

They're not real words.

It's just gibberish.


Morricone didn't use actual lyrics in the soundtracks of any Leone films except A Fistful of Dynamite where a singer chants " Sean, Sean, Sean. "

what? I swear i could hear GO!GO!AMIGO! in the GBU theme song

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« #41 : February 27, 2007, 03:41:00 PM »

what? I swear i could hear GO!GO!AMIGO! in the GBU theme song

Don't let the DVD subtitles fool you.

It's not intended to sound like anything but animal barks.


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« #42 : February 27, 2007, 08:47:37 PM »

Actually, it says "We can fight, we can fight." Originally, the chorus said "with the wind, with the wind". It is the remaining of Morricone version of "Patures of Plenty" which is the origin of the theme music "Titoli". Morricone rearranged Woody Guthrie's song and Peter Tevis sang. The chorus was used after Tevis sang "We come with the dust and we go with the wind."

Because Leone liked the tune, Morricone simply replaced the vocal with Alessadroni's whistle. The primary soundtrack record still has the chorus saying "with the wind, with the wind." Eventually, the final soundtrack had the changed chorus saying "we can fight, we can fight" and that's what you hear at the opening of the film. However, the primary chorus "with the wind, with the wind" is still used in the middle of the film.

I posted a thread on the same top last year.
http://www.fistful-of-leone.com/forums/index.php?topic=4024.0   


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It's perfect timing, large one...


« #43 : March 10, 2007, 01:55:56 AM »

Don't let the DVD subtitles fool you.

It's not intended to sound like anything but animal barks.

But I heard something like that, too - without subtitles fooling me. ;D



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« #44 : March 11, 2007, 08:39:33 PM »

In the end it doesn't really matter what they're saying, just listen to the great music for what it is!!! O0




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